Saturday 17 October: Sinking feeling that lives are being destroyed for a normality that will never come

Posted on by Geoff Graham

An unofficial place to discuss the Telegraph letters, established when the DT website turned off its comments facility (now reinstated, but not as good as ours),
Intelligent, polite, good-humoured debate is welcome, whether on or off topic. Differing opinions are encouraged, but rudeness or personal attacks on other posters will not be tolerated. Posts which – in the opinion of the moderators – make this a less than cordial environment, are likely to be removed, without prior warning.  Persistent offenders will be banned.

Today’s letters (visible only to DT subscribers) are here:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/2020/10/16/letters-sinking-feeling-lives-destroyed-normality-will-never/

672 thoughts on “Saturday 17 October: Sinking feeling that lives are being destroyed for a normality that will never come”

  4. Good Morning Folks

    Cloudy start here.
    The new tier two rules prevent people from different households playing tennis indoors but not out doors in the cold and damp. how weird is that?

    1. As a Doctor may have once written in the patient’s medical notes: ‘NFW’ – Normal for Westminster…..

      Good Morning Bob cubed et al….

    2. Pity about playing tennis indoors being forbidden. Mrs. Mac and I had intended to play a couple of sets of mixed doubles in the drawing-room this afternoon, with some friends.

      Ah well, we shall have to content ourselves with a hand or two of bezique instead.

    3. I’m off to play table tennis indoors shortly! It’s a sports club so we’re allowed two groups of six.

  5. Police break up crowds of drinkers in London and make arrests as pubs kick out at 10pm before city is plunged into Tier 2 lockdown from midnight. 17 October 2020.

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/63a8852566095875e003c10639f2e531fc4d93a2df3460dfcaf0f38554c297fb.jpg

    Metropolitan Police officers broke up crowds in Soho and made arrests after pubs kicked drinkers out at 10pm last night – two hours before the city was plunged into a Tier 2 lockdown.

    Officers were pictured squaring off against revellers who were refusing to go home, with few wearing masks or socially distancing – and some carrying placards protesting against the measures.

    These people self-evidently do not believe the government narrative. Once out of sight of the police they will do as they please. Though it is not admitted, they, and the millions who share their perception, will be the reason for the failure of Test and Trace. Essentially they ignore its instructions to self-isolate because there is no threat. Yes they may get the virus: so what?

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8848433/Covid-cops-force-tonight-Police-warn-Londoners-against-having-boozy-blow-out.html

    1. It seems the young folk are voting with their er feet: Testes and Tracey it is then…..

    2. Oh No ! The police are out in farce again.
      Two little people shoving their oars in again.
      Dickie and Kahnt.

    3. I bet being forced to wear masks whilst on duty after months of swaggering around without, forcing others to wear them really pees them off and may help explain their dumb aggressive approach towards people they are sworn to serve….

      1. Good morning, Rick.
        Funnily enough I recently downloaded 1984 in .PDF format and bought a paperback copy of Cold Comfort Farm. I’m currently reading R F Delderfield’s Swann Trilogy so I’ve some doom and gloom to look forward to.

        Maybe I’ll wait until January/February for something to modify the elation of being finally free and clear of the EU .

      2. I’ve been saying it for years,………….government manifesto’s are based on the writings of Orwell.
        And according to the MSN it’s happening again right now, they said that 2 million children i the UK are starving, which is absolute BS. But The Road to Wigan Pier raises it’s ugly head amidst the lockdown procedures.
        The first half of this work documents his sociological investigations of the bleak living conditions among the working class in Lancashire and Yorkshire in the industrial north of England before World War II.

        1. Should be compulsory reading in all schools and universities.
          And all those professional activists bleating about today’s social injustices.

      3. That book frightened me so much that I’ve only been able to read it the once.
        But I didn’t think this dystopia would appear in my life time.

  6. ‘Morning, Peeps.

    He has a point:

    SIR – There’s nothing new in the absurd Russian assertion that the Oxford Covid vaccine will transfer monkey characteristics to its users.

    Two hundred years ago, early anti-vaccinationists claimed that Edward Jenner’s cowpox vaccine against smallpox would turn people into cows. Same old bull.

    Gareth Williams
    Emeritus professor of medicine
    Rockhampton, Gloucestershire

      2. The Cow-Pock-or-the Wonderful Effects of the New Inoculation!- (British Moozeum)

        A scene in a vaccine institution; poor patients crowd in through a doorway on the left; in the room are those whose treatment has had dire consequences. A comely and frightened young woman sits in an armchair in the centre, the doctor (Jenner, a good portrait, see BMSat 9925) holds her right arm and gashes it with his knife, while a deformed and ragged boy holds up a bucket of ‘Vaccine Pock hot from ye Cow’. A charity-schoolboy’s oval badge on his sleeve is inscribed ‘St Pancras’; from his coat pocket projects a pamphlet: ‘Benefits of the Vaccine Process’. From the patients miniature cows sprout or leap. A pregnant woman (right) stands in profile to the right, a cow issues from her mouth, another from below her ragged petticoat. A man dressed as a butcher registers despair at the horns which sprout from his forehead. A labourer with a pitchfork sees a cow bursting from a swelling on his arm while another breaks through his breeches; cows struggle through huge swellings on nose, ear, and cheek. Another patient has only reached the stage of large carbuncles on forehead and chin.
        The doctor’s medicine-chest and a close-stool stand on the left. On the chest are bottles, a syringe, &c, and a tub of ‘Opening Mixture’. This a haughty assistant ladles contemptuously into the mouths of the patients as they crowd into the room. On the wall is a picture: a crowd of kneeling worshippers pay homage to the statue of the golden calf.
        The scene combines fantasy and realism. After the title: ‘Vide – the Publications of ye Anti-Vaccine Society.’ 12 June 1802

  7. So…our Lord (formerly Sir Kim) Darroch was hard at it for years banging away at a CNN journalist (Michelle Kosinski) whilst representing Her Britannic Majesty in Washington. And nobody can figure out who leaked what to whom and when except that all Darroch provided to his FCO bosses was straight from CNN Anyway, the Donald wanted him out of town….so he departed… and got elevated to the HoL.

    3. It appears that the alledged whambangery lurveyer mammaries was while she was married.
      I wonder what the atmosphere will be like in her household at the moment.

  8. Covid – restaurant or pub?

    SIR – On the subject of what constitutes “pub grub” (Features, October 14): if you’re having something to drink with your meal, you’re in a restaurant. If you’re having something to eat with your drink, you’re in a pub.

    Will Doran
    High Wycombe, Buckinghamshire

    SIR – When I was a student in Cork in the Nineties, a bar near the university, the Thirsty Scholar, advertised a three-course lunch.

    It consisted of a packet of cheese and onion crisps, a Pot Noodle, and finally a chocolate biscuit. The bar has been gone for a number of years. We often referred to it as the Filthy Squalor.

    Dr Neil F Ramsay
    Ratharoon, Co Cork, Ireland

    SIR – The late Ken Mellor, once landlord of the Quiet Woman in Earl Sterndale, Derbyshire, offered a varied menu. There were three choices: pork pie, pickled egg, or pork pie and pickled egg.

    Bill Mason
    Chorley, Lancashire

    SIR – A few years ago, sitting outside Sydney Opera House, my husband and I decided to order delicious Australian wine to round off the afternoon.

    The waiter said this wasn’t possible under his licence unless we had a meal. But then he said the situation could be resolved if he laid the table and gave us a menu to peruse. We left after half an hour and he kept his licence.

    Elizabeth Green
    London SW1

      1. Just shows how daft the rules can get.
        Some restaurants in Norway don’t allow you to carry your drink from the bar to the eating side – the waiter must do it for you… :-O)

        2. It happens in posh restaurants in the UK. If one has a sherry in the bar, the waiter will carry your glasses to the dining room for you once your table has been prepared. So I’ve been told.

          1. Interesting… Don’t go to posh restaurants, I’m afraid.
            More “Trattoriaman” (Un uomo dei trattoria), me.

  9. Morning all

    SIR – Back in April I had a serious case of Covid (intensive-care unit, ventilator and almost pegging out).

    If I am being told that I now probably have no more immunity than anyone else, how can we be confident that a vaccine (assuming one can even be found) will provide the immunity to enable life to return to normality?

    Are we not just destroying the economy and lives, waiting for a non-existent solution?

    Rowland Aarons

    London N3

    SIR – Does the Government not realise that, even if the three-tier system is successful, there will be a third wave of coronavirus, and subsequent waves each time restrictions are lifted?

    Meanwhile, our economy will die, along with a large number of the untreated victims of other diseases more lethal than Covid.

    The only solution is herd immunity: safe vaccines take years to develop and, even then, they are not 100 per cent effective. We can’t beat this disease so we have to live with it. In practice, this means the sooner a large number of people have it, the sooner life can return to normal. Delay is economically catastrophic.

    Advertisement

    The average age of people dying of Covid-19 is 82. The old and vulnerable should be warned to manage their risk and the state should help them, if they wish to be helped. The rest of society should get on with life since, for most, the disease is not a lethal threat.

    There will be a rise in cases for a while, and a small number of people under 60 will die. However, the NHS can now treat a large number of cases and is much better at saving them.

    The struggle against Covid should be viewed like a war. More than a million Britons died in the last century’s two world wars to protect our liberty and way of life. A vastly smaller number of fatalities is required to achieve the same ends in the face of Covid. We must be brave.

    Gregory Shenkman

    London W8

    2. Mr Shenkman’s letter was followed by this:

      SIR – I am getting heartily sick of the constant carping at the Government as it tries to curb the spread of the virus.

      Until a cure or vaccine is perfected, there is only one way of containing this pandemic and that is for everyone to act responsibly. That is not everyone else – it is you and I.

      Too many people have been acting with disregard to the danger they pose to other people. To wear a mask, wash your hands, keep your distance and not meet other people unnecessarily is not difficult to understand.

      What is more important? Joining a student party, going to an illegal rave, going to the pub or a football match, even meeting you grandchildren for a while, or eliminating this virus so that everyone can get back to a normal life and the economy can start growing again to produce jobs?

      G M E Barber
      Long Melford, Suffolk

      There’s still plenty of resistance to the virus out there.

      1. Yup. What could be more important than living life by, “Joining a student party, going to an illegal rave, going to the pub or a football match, even meeting you grandchildren for a while”?
        Cringing behind a useless mask, stepping away from everyone you meet on the street or in a shop, staying distant from neighbours and family?
        There is no way back to “normal” unless we brazen it out and live normally and accept casualties. There will be no vaccine, only total control of every aspect of our lives if we endure this deliberate training.

      2. “Eliminating this virus” – I may have missed something, but surely we won’t ever “eliminate” Covid-19? Especially if the Norwegian research is right and there are several variants already?

        1. Much as I hate to wear a tin foil hat, this farrago has gone well beyond controlling a virus.
          Never let a good crisis go to waste.

        2. They have been seeking a vaccine for SARS since 2003.

          Why does anyone think that an effective vaccine for Covid-19 will be quicker?

    3. My first thought on reading this letter was in regard to Mr Shenkman’s use of ‘we’, as in ‘We must be brave’.
      Funnily enough, he doesn’t mention how old he is.

  10. SIR – My wife and I live in Essex and so from today cannot receive visitors from another household.

    My daughter and her family, whom we haven’t seen since February, were coming for Sunday lunch tomorrow. That has now been cancelled.

    This daughter lives in Suffolk. Another lives in Hertfordshire and a son in Cambridge. None are allowed to visit us for the foreseeable future.

    However, we could visit each of them. I’m afraid the logic escapes me.

    Geoff Riley

    Saffron Walden, Essex

    SIR – I live in a small isolated rural village in Essex with no Covid-19 cases. I am incandescent with rage.

    Dr Martin Henry

    Good Easter, Essex

    SIR – Here, in Hambleton, North Yorkshire, the occurrence of Covid-19 has been negligible. Indeed, even when the cause of death is listed as Covid, there have in those unfortunate cases been long-term health problems.

    Our hospitality and retail outlets have dealt remarkably well with the health threat. Why, then, should we have a draconian lockdown imposed on us because of the reckless behaviour of some of those living in the big cities?

    Martin E J Curzon

    Thornton-Le-Moor, North Yorkshire

    SIR – Andy Burnham, the Labour mayor of Manchester, does not want a total lockdown of his city. Sir Keir Starmer, the Labour Party leader, wants a total lockdown of the country.

    Mr Burnham blames the Conservative Government. There is something odd here.

    Malcolm Allen

    Berkhamsted, Hertfordshire

    SIR – Although I am able go to shops and restaurants, I miss being able to talk to shop attendants and waiters, and having a laugh. I am hard of hearing, so cannot make out what people are saying while they are wearing a mask.

    I feel isolated and lonely, as I cannot speak to anyone.

    David Hunter

    Godalming, Surrey

    1. When you say “reckless behaviour”, Mr Curzon, do you mean “behaving normally”?

    2. I am ashamed of my fellow Essex inhabitants.
      What load of wimps; what happened to the barrow boy made good spirit?

    3. David Hunter – I feel for you.
      Was spoken to by someone who appeared to be talking through a pillow, but what she said I have absolutely no idea at all…

    4. Mr Riley is mistaken. He cannot (legally) visit his relatives in other counties, his tier two status travels with him.

  11. SIR – It’s so simple, it doesn’t cost a penny, and it will lift people’s spirits – just keep British Summer Time (Letters October 9).

    Paula Leek

    Solihull

    1. 325694+ up ticks,
      Morning Epi,
      I do NOT believe that lifting peoples spirits is on the
      governance party’s agenda Paula, far from it.

    2. I half agree with her.
      Let us stop changing the clocks and use the UK’s natural time zone, GMT.

      1. I’d go along with that but not BST all year round. I hate the dark mornings even more than dark evenings. I remember those years when it was tried.

        1. Yehbut the number of hours of daylight remains the same, the answer surely is to adjust your routine

          3. Not even so easy to do if you are unemployed and claiming benefits as you have to attend to so much job-seeking that you pretty much have to live by office hours.

        1. Those beaches can be dangerous in the dark, rock pools unexpectedly deep, stones slippy. (They might be safer working in an ammunition factory.)

          2. Ironically, it did protect them from heart problems!
            Hence the use of Glycerol Trinitrate oral sprays for angina.

    3. A Red Indian once observed that only a white man could cut one foot of the end of his blanket and sew it onto the other end, and then claim that he had a longer blanket.

      Meanwhile, as earlier discussed, the Earth’s obliquity is lessening, so the length of the day will vary less.

      1. ‘Morning, Reynard, that reminds of a poem that is remarkably apposite for Black History Month:

        In the matter of racial comparisons
        The media shouts to the moon,
        About all the historic achievements
        Of the Redskin, Spic and the Coon.

        Yet strangely, when strolling museums,
        The white man’s creations stand thick;
        But all we can find of those others
        Is a blanket, a bowl and a stick.

        No telephones, timeclocks or engines,
        No lights that go on with a flick.
        No aeroplanes, rockets or radios.
        Just a blanket, a bowl and a stick.

        Not one Sioux Indian submarine,
        No African ice cream to lick,
        Not a single Mexican x-ray machine,
        It’s a blanket, a bowl and a stick.

        So, remember when history’s the subject,
        And revisionists are up to their tricks,
        The evidence tells quite another tale
        Of a blanket, a bowl and a stick.

        A poem by A. Wyatt Mann

    4. It most assuredly won’t lift my spirits to be getting up and driving to work in the dark!

    5. It won’t lift my spirits, woman! It will cause me to feel even more suicidal; the only thing I can look forward to over winter is not having to live an hour ahead of myself.

  12. SIR – Ambrose Evans-Pritchard (Comment, October 15) reports that “French trawlers are entitled to 84 per cent of the catch off Cornwall while Cornish fishermen are left with just 
9 per cent”, and that “European boats can come to within six nautical miles of the British coast, while British boats must abide by the EU’s 12-mile rule.”

    Is this the EU’s idea of a level playing field?

    Graham Francis
    Fetcham, Surrey

    Quite so, Mr Francis. This is just one reason why so many of us voted to leave the Evil Empire!

  13. Gordon Bennett, that’s all we need – the architect of Project Fear as BBC chairman…

    From the DT:

    Former Chancellor George Osborne is being lined up as the next BBC chairman, one of the most prestigious jobs in British broadcasting, after the Government increased the salary for the role, The Telegraph can reveal.

    Ministers increased the chairman’s pay to £160,000 a year for the part-time role to encourage a wider range of candidates when the job advert was posted online this week.

    Boris Johnson, the Prime Minister, is understood to be very keen to appoint a Conservative to the role to counter a perceived left-wing bias at the corporation.

    The Telegraph understands Mr Osborne, who edited the Evening Standard newspaper until June this year after quitting as a Conservative MP in 2017, is being urged to stand by senior figures.

    One source said ministers could even lift the salary cap to as much as £280,000 a year, in a bid to secure the signature of Mr Osborne. The chairman’s salary was cut to £100,000 when Sir David Clementi was appointed in 2016, and has been increased by £60,000 for the “3-4 days per week” role for a four-year contract running to 2025.

    The role would in theory fit with Mr Osborne’s job at fund manager BlackRock where it was reported in 2017 that he is paid £650,000 a year to work one day a week.

    The highest paid BBC stars in 2020
    If Mr Osborne were to accept the offer he may have to quit some of his other roles.

    It was claimed two years ago that he had taken on nine different jobs, including roles advising a San Francisco venture capital fund, a business with stakes in Juventus Football Club and Fiat, and the chairmanship of the Northern Powerhouse thinktank.

    The BBC job advert said the Government is looking for “an outstanding individual with demonstrable leadership skills and a passion for the media and public broadcasting, to represent the public interest in the BBC and maintain the Corporation’s independence”.

    Applications close on November 11 and a shortlist will be drawn up on November 16. Final interviews are in late November or early December, with the successful candidate taking up their post in February.

    The job advert also states that “all reasonable and properly documented expenses incurred in performing the duties of these roles will be reimbursed in accordance with BBC’s expenses policy”.

    Several government sources were tight-lipped about which candidates might put their name forward, although some downplayed the chances of Mr Osborne getting the job. There was also some doubt ministers will be able to increase the maximum salary to as high as £280,000.

    Asked about the search for the next chairman, Culture Secretary Oliver Dowden told the Culture select committee he was looking for “a strong, credible figure who can hold the BBC to account” and is “particularly concerned to ensure the BBC returns to its core values of impartiality”.

    The successful candidate must answer the question: “Does the BBC as much reflect the values of somebody living in a semi in Leigh outside Manchester as they do someone living in a loft apartment in Old Street, London?” he said.

    Other candidates who are expected to apply include Sir Robbie Gibb, an ex-BBC executive and the former head of communications at 10 Downing St; Baroness Morgan, who as Nicky Morgan is a former Conservative culture secretary; and Trevor Phillips, the former equalities chief.

    Mr Osborne declined to comment. The Daily Telegraph understands that he has not yet been approached about the role.

    2. I am afraid this speaks volumes as to Johnson’s judgment.
      For Christ sake Johnson, try and get at least one thing right before everyone see you for the bumbling windbag you truly are.
      Edit, where are my manners? Morning all.

    5. So the job for the boys* will go to one of the boys? Well, “I’ll go the foot of our stairs” as they say in Leigh.

      * This should not be taken to exclude Baronesses and other sinecure lovers of the non-male persuasion.

  15. ‘Morning again.

    Not sure this is going to make much difference, judging by the current level of illegal phone use by drivers.

    From the DT:

    Drivers taking photos or scrolling social media or the internet on their phones will get an instant £200 fine, under new Government plans to close a loophole letting motorists use devices behind the wheel.

    The Department for Transport on Saturday unveiled proposals that would lead to immediate penalties if drivers are found to be handling phones in any way while the car is moving.

    The new rules will maintain an exception for people using their phone as a satnav, as long as it’s in a holder, and create an exemption allowing people to use their phone to make a payment while stationary.

    The move aims to update current laws, which were last revised in 2003, that only ban using “interactive communication” behind the wheel – a definition that meant using smartphones for other purposes were not explicitly prohibited.

    Drivers distracted by their devices could still be prosecuted for careless or dangerous driving if they caused an accident.

    In 2019, builder Ramsey Barreto successfully used the loophole to overturn his conviction in the High Court, for filming a car accident in Ruislip, west London, by arguing the law only prohibited texting.

    The issue has become more pronounced as smartphones have become more powerful in the intervening 17 years. For instance, since 2017 police forces have launched a series of ‘Don’t Stream and Drive’ campaigns to discourage young motorists from taking pictures or selfies while driving.

    The Department for Transport also released research commissioned by it from the University of Leeds that laid bare how frequently drivers are picking up their phone.

    A study of 51 British drivers found that they used their phones 662 times during 765 trips, with only 32 of those times via their phone’s hands-free function.

    Under the new rules, the police will be able to give an immediate £200 fine, and six penalty points, to drivers seen handling their phone and using it in any way.

    Ministers expect the changes to the law to come into force early next year, following a consultation period.

    Roads Minister Baroness Vere said: “Our roads are some of the safest in the world, but we want to make sure they’re safer still by bringing the law into the 21st century.

    “That’s why we’re looking to strengthen the law to make using a hand-held phone while driving illegal in a wider range of circumstances. It’s distracting and dangerous, and for too long risky drivers have been able to escape punishment, but this update will mean those doing the wrong thing will face the full force of the law.”

    Under the new regime, drivers will be able to use their phones for certain limited functions such as navigation, if it is a holder or ‘cradle’.

    An exemption has also been made for people using their phones for payments at takeaway drive-throughs, where a phone can be handled if the vehicle is stationary and the goods or services are “delivered immediately”.

    The new rule only applies to devices that drivers can pick up, so do not cover drivers wearing gadgets such as smart watches.

    The proposed rule change has been welcomed by senior police officers, who said it would make enforcement more clear cut for officers on the ground.

    National Police Chiefs’ council lead for Roads Policing, Chief Constable Anthony Bangham, said: “Using a mobile phone while driving is incredibly dangerous and being distracted at the wheel can change lives forever.

    “Police will take robust action against those using a hand-held mobile phone illegally and proposals to make the law clearer are welcome.”

    1. Using a mobile phone while driving is very dangerous.

      But it is more easy pickings for raising the crime conviction rates.

    2. So looking at and fiddling with a Satnav is not a distraction? These doughnuts are pathetic. The dashboards of cars are now more complex than the controls of Apollo 11. For no good reason at all, unless it is to impress the impressionable that the car is fancier than the competitors’ cars. While the mechanical bits are safer* the risk has now been passed to the driver via the distracting plethora of dials, buttons, and bobbins in front of them. Try wrestling with a modern radio/CD/Bluetooth entertainment centre without losing concentration on driving.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unsafe_at_Any_Speed

        1. I’ve had my C-Max for 14 years & still have no idea what 1/2 the things on the dashboard & steering column are for.

          I’ve had my Bosch dishwasher 10 years & discovered only last week that there is a delay start function.

          1. I have some odd diagrams appear on my dashboard. If I ignore them they go away.
            Or the garage sorts them out when they do a service. I’m not too sure.

          3. I was driving a Renault last week (courtesy car whilst my local garage fixed a little problem with my own). The dashboard was a sheet of smooth, dark, glass (or glass-like plastic). At rest it displayed nothing. In motion it displayed a digital number for mph and another for time – nothing else. I rather missed my rev counter and my fuel indicator.

            It should be noted that it is not legal to “fiddle with” a SatNav, that is “handling” and illegal just like texting. You have to set the thing before you start. It is legal to glance at one, or two listen to one. I find that the disembodied voice on mine conveys 99% of the information I need. Of course if I’m going somewhere unfamiliar I look at a map beforehand – and don’t just rely on bodiless navigation.

            I confess to being slightly envious of my niece who has a modern vehicle where the built in SatNav turns into a reversing guide – displaying clearly what is behind the vehicle and measuring the gaps. It appears automatically when reverse gear is engaged. I have sensors which tell me if I’m getting to close to something, but her gadget makes tight spaces simple even with a large vehicle.

        2. When my d-i-l acquired a BMW, I offered to pop over and show her where the indicator stalk is.

          Fortunately she has a well-developed sense of humour.

        2. So do I, normally, but I have had it switch itself off for no apparent reason occasionally and then it has to be reset. I do pull to the side to do that, though.

    3. Smart phones on Smart motorways. What could go wrong – especially when driving a Smart car.

      1. My phone is connected to the truck radio by Bluetooth and all controls transferred to the steering wheel. I tell it what number to ring and the phone remains in my pocket – about as safe as it can be.

    1. Who was the worst chancellor in the last 50 years?

      Was it Brown? Was it Alastair Darling? Was it Kenneth Clarke? Was it John Major?

      No, streets ahead, leading the field as the worst chancellor in history is:

      George “Call me Gideon” Osborne

      1. Major was good as Chancellor, I thought?
        Brown has got to be the most useless.
        Osborne’s strongest point was looking as though he knew what he was doing, but at least he didn’t sell all our gold and bankrupt the country.

      2. It was close run, but i think you are right Richard.
        I would have given the award to Daft Vader aka Brown, as he gave away our gold reserves. And introduced charges for tipping waste. Which has lead to our countryside becoming a tip.
        But overall Osborne acted like a scummy but clever little shit with free range in the school corridors.

    1. There are many reasons not to like Biden but two simple damning ones are enough for me to loathe him. First, he was reported as saying that he “supports prepubescent children being able to change their gender”. Secondly, he was ‘endorsed’ by St. Greta.

          1. “Yesterday

            All my troubles seemed so far away

            Now it looks as though they’re here to stay

            Oh, I believe in yesterday

            Suddenly

            I’m not half the man I used to be

            There’s a shadow hangin’ over me

            Oh, yesterday came suddenly….”

    1. Love the picture! Did you take it, Citroën?
      That would make a lovely calendar picture for autumn.

      1. Not mine! I’m above averagely hopeless with a camera.

        The Graun has ‘photo galleries’ every few days, often of Soshul Justice warriors burning things or marching or somesuch, but they also do some excellent wildlife collections from freelance photographers from time to time.
        https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/783e66149a38883f5b251e851a540bfdc8119c10/0_0_4128_2322/master/4128.jpg?width=720&quality=85&auto=format&fit=max&s=e1bc3287919a7f7bd1a62b916f4248e0

        https://www.theguardian.com/environment/gallery/2020/oct/16/the-week-in-wildlife-in-pictures

    2. I could do with a few of them in my garden, my shed roof is covered in acorns from my Neighbours Oak.
      Pigs are too heavy to lift.

          1. The black ones are the natives apparently – the reds are regarded as invaders in central Europe.

        2. All covered with netting the little buggers have eaten all my grapes as well.
          I sometimes take them to task and trap them in a cage trap they don’t last long in the water Butt and the local Red Kites do the rest of the tidying.

        3. Should also be none of that grey vermin in the UK – they are slaughtering the native reds – some tw@t imported greys from USA. Deport (or shoot) the lot like any vermin.

          1. The same brand of scum imported invasive weeds to the UK and rabbits and cane toads to Australia. I’d shoot people like them.

  21. Morning, hall.
    If you wish to check on the latest news on the talks with the EU, you might possibly consider that the website of Britain’s national treasure, the BBC, would be the place to go. However, visit their home page and look in vain. Apart from a review of newspapers’ headlines, there is nairy a mention. One should perhaps, considering its national importance, have expected a banner headline. Admittedly, it has to compete with items such as a boy sleeping in a tent, the Americans selling swans, and many other life-changing events.
    Finally found an item about Boris’ ‘no point’ pronouncement buried in the Politics section.
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news

    1. Be reasonable, LF; it’s still sackcloth and ashes for the Beeboids since Little Burk-O and all the other traitors left to spend more time with their bank accounts.

    1. Education, education and education………….. eh !

      Don’t you see that the whole aim of Newspeak
      is to narrow the range of thought?
      In the end we shall make Thoughtcrime literally impossible,
      because there will be no words in which to express it.

    2. It can’t be,……… he’s busy woke-ing for Sorros against all established and well known reason and common sense.

  23. A school teacher was arrested today at John F. Kennedy International airport as he attempted to board a flight while in possession of a ruler, a protractor, a compass, an ancient wooden device called a “slide-rule” and a calculator.
    At a morning press conference, the Attorney General said he believes the man is a member of the notorious Al-Gebra movement. He did not identify the man, who has been charged by the FBI with carrying weapons of maths instruction.

    2. Quite good for innocent punsters – but what about the really naughty jokes you used to shock and delight us with?

      1. I guess I could repeat them Richard.

        What about one-liners like “She was sweating like a blind lesbian in a fishmarket”

  24. JOHN HUMPHRYS rails at fear replacing reason, ministers who have lost control… and why the public is rising up against the hysterical response to Covid’s second wave. 17 october 2020.

    Let me acknowledge immediately that one single avoidable death is a death too many. And let me also acknowledge that the statistics show more than 43,000 people have died in the United Kingdom.

    But let’s look at who make up that number — and who do not. They are not children. It is worth reminding ourselves again and again that this is not a disease that threatens the young or even the middle-aged.

    They become infected, but they shrug it off like I shrug off my sore arm from my flu jab. They might very well not even know they’ve had it.

    We must also keep reminding ourselves that those who die from it are old. Very old. The average age of death from Covid is 82.4. That’s several months longer than the UK’s average life expectancy.

    It’s not even true to say that most old people who get Covid die from it. The fact is that for every seven victims in their 90s, six survive. We used to think Covid killed between 2 and 3 per cent of its victims. Now it’s reckoned to be below 0.4 per cent.

    Morning everyone. All this seems irrefutable and if you accept it you have to ask why are we destroying the economy in pursuit of a chimera? Herd immunity already exists in the sense that the vast majority of the population will suffer only the mildest symptoms if infected. The Government’s futile lockdowns and their Test and Trace program will eventually disappear under public scepticism and sometime next year we will inhabit a ruined country! It is of course possible that a vaccine will appear in the interim which will absolve the PTB of responsibility for this fiasco, it wouldn’t need to work of course, a simple placebo would suffice since the end result would be the same!

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-8849165/JOHN-HUMPHRYS-public-rising-against-response-Covids-second-wave.html

  25. Back from Narridge – where it was gloriously sunny – to a cold raining Fulmodeston. Thanks, Met Office for telling lies again.

  26. Why are professional sports games allowed to take place when amateur games are not? It is generally recognised that highly tuned athletes are more susceptible to random illnesses than the average slob. “Following the science”would allow amateur sports and not professional sports. I note that scrums do nor comply with the “rule of six”.
    Worse, I noted that the TV presentation of the Rugby League Challenge Cup semi-finals included canned crowd noise.

  27. 325694+ up ticks,
    May one ask why are these islamic ideology followers
    good / bad / handsome or ugly still WITHIN our borders & being given succour by the lab/lib/con coalition party.
    How many more soldier Lee Rigby’s ( RIP) must we endure ?

    If the islamic terror plague was given half the attention that the covid is receiving decent peoples would rightfully feel a good deal safer.

    The islamic ideology plague is a genuine threat to peoples of these isles
    and instead of being kicked out en masse they are watched, after a fashion, thereby giving them more opportunities to kill & maim, WHY.

    Officers Monitoring Freed Terrorist Who Attacked in London Had ‘No Specific Training’

  29. Teachers call for ‘circuit-breaker’ lockdown and two-week half term.
    Union demands schools are closed as part of national lockdown as pressure grows on Boris Johnson for countrywide measures.
    D/Telegraph.

    It won’t be long before teachers are no longer needed. Why employ a number of teachers when ‘education’ can be provided without them, online or even holographically…

        1. Fully subscribe to that Oberst. However government doesn’t, didn’t they just award teachers a pay increase? While all the gullible private sector workers …

    2. The teachers I know have all worked during the lock up so they’re not wanting to ‘do nothing’.

      I have heard from my teacher chums that the students – children – aren’t wearing masks or distancing – they’ve no fear, and how do you say ‘stay 2m apart! in a school?

      1. They might be following orders and distancing in school, but get outside and then still cluster together incomplete disregard of any rules and regulations.

        I am getting confused and had to check if it was UK or Canadian teachers being discussed, the same conversation is being had in Ontario as teachers demand more time off.

        1. Honestly, I’ve no idea what the solution is. When I see kids walking in great gangs together in to school they’ve either not got it or a huge number have.

          That will bring it locally. We cannot stay locked up forever. My intent throughout has been to just get on with it.

          1. Read lockdown sceptics.org , article by Dr Yeadon. Nearly 70% of the British population is quite possibly immune. (in the sense that they are less prone to catch the bug after a lifetime of colds and coughs)

      2. The UK never mandated metrication of distance, so ‘2m’ means 2 miles. 6 foot will do nicely, though the Chinese virus has no tape measure installed.

        1. Ah, no. Metric was introduced decades ago and 2m means 2 metres.

          Dear life, my mother still converts from grams to ounces and pounds and pence into shillings. It’s archaic.

          1. Your mother is not alone. Just because metric was “introduced” doesn’t mean it is universally accepted 🙂

          3. When you are next on a motorway, have a glance at any sign informing road users of a service area ahead; 3m = 3 miles. 1/2 M = half a mile.
            And some triangular warning signs still use ‘yds’ .

    1. The mayor seems to be somewhat obese, perhaps his brother has a similar physique. What a fattist virus this bug seems to be.

      1. Precisely our reaction.
        The mayor is 62, so presumably brother is somewhere around the same age.

          1. Most of us are slightly overweight, but if there were ever an Obesity Olympics,
            England would stagger away with plenty of medals (and a plate of chips).

        2. I remember that woman “with no health issues” who caught it back in the spring at a funeral. Obese was an understatement.

        3. eldest brother + Liverpool + Merchant Navy father + 1950s = possibility of large family.
          Deceased brother looks to be about 70 in the photo in the daily blah. Sad.

        1. No problemo, we all do it. It is impossible to read every comment before posting – and it is good to see we are all in agreement anyway.

      1. Afternoon Sue – Judging from the Mayor’s photograph he was probably obese with all the problems that creates. The report in the Independent that I read on my I-pad only said Covid-19

        2. Sorry clydesider! I’ve just looked at my post and it read very badly. I didn’t mean you to give “the facts”. Apologies!

    3. Sad. I hope the PTB won’t use this personal tragedy to push more lockdowns, but I fear they will.

  31. Good Moaning.
    Oh, What A Grey Day.
    And I see Minty’s beaten me to it on posting John Humphrey’s article.
    The Mail seems to have done a U-Turn. After months of shrieking for ever tougher measures and calling sun bathers ‘covidiots’, it has joined the sceptics.
    The MSM have played an inglorious role in the ruination of Blighty..

    1. Morning Anne,
      They’re playing Good Cop Bad Cop. Khan screeched for London to be shut down so that he can demand more funds from the government to misuse for his own ends.

    2. Indeed many of the “columnists” appear to be Fifth Columnists…..(The same may be said of the States….)

  32. Nagsman News

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/content/dam/beauty/2020/10/15/TELEMMGLPICT000242002426_trans_NvBQzQNjv4BqpVlberWd9EgFPZtcLiMQfy2dmClwgbjjulYfPTELibA.jpeg?imwidth=680
    Her Majesty, without a mask, during her visit to Porton Down

    She has asked me to pass on felicitations to NoTTLers one and all, young and old, large and small. She is not avoiding us on purpose. Her silence is because her computer operating system has taken a turn for the worse making the NoTTL page very cumbersome to access and she has been too busy to get it fixed.

    She and I speak three or four times a week, usually when I read something Covid in the blatts and have to ask WTF it means in the real world. We have lunch every couple of weeks. She had wonderful weather for five days on the Norfolk Broads with Muppet, Lizzie (daughter), Lizzie’s man + his two children. Muppet fell in love with a swan.

    She continues to serve Queen & Country by taking part in the thrice weekly telephone conference calls organised by Porton Down which are supposed to advise HMG for/against various courses of action. [There are always two or three Risk Management people from Porton, of which Naggers is one – they don’t let any of the mad boffins participate – plus a couple of PHE people who always get jeered at, quite often someone from HM Treasury, always someone from the Cabinet Office, plus ‘guests’ from different regions or industry groups – the total number of participants varies between a dozen and twenty.] They try to anticipate how journalists will misinterpret and sensationalise largely irrelevant data, knock down nearly all ‘Government Initiatives’, try to make sense of the often contradictory nonsense that ‘Behavioural Psychologists’ preach, and other worthy pastimes.

    Around 5:00 pm each day they sit back watch Whitty and Vallance prescribe the exact opposite of what was recommended that very morning. Obviously Naggers has steam coming out of her ears but it’s quite funny to listen to her even though I don’t understand everything that’s happening or that she tells me. Pithy emails are being sent to the Cabinet Office to make clear that Whitty & Vallance are knowingly marching in the opposite direction away from the considered advice from the Risk Managers.

    Overall, she’s really quite busy with lots that needs doing both before and after each telephone conference, usually preparing stealthy heat seeking missiles to puncture some of the more preposterous suggestions put forth. She promises to return once time permits.

      1. Entirely agree. She and her Porton pals have made their views and general pissed-offed-ness clear to the PTB in the preamble to their latest email to the Cabinet Office “Rather than communicate directly with the national press, we are writing….”

        Very nobly, Pat started off doing everything pro bono but realising that she was about to ‘walk’ and valuing her unfettered and, shall we say, ‘robust’ contributions in telling various snivel serpents in various arms of HMG that they were ‘full of it’ and didn’t know what they were talking about and devoid of common sense, her pals at Porton found some budget £s to throw her way, not a lot but it keeps her in booze and fags.

      1. I wouldn’t recommend that course of action, Phizzee.

        You have met Our Pat.

        She’d rip off your nether parts and put them on eBay with a maximum permitted bid of £0.01 before you knew what had happened..

      1. Have already done so, Robert, and given her a commentary on the very impressive Hill Fort that you have constructed, now being secured by encircling battlements. She is well and sends best wishes.

    1. Just broke the draught with a draught of red wine!
      There are loads of bozos out there, getting in the way… makes a 30 minute shopping trip take 2 hours – and then, there’s me house to look after – water the plants and cats, feed the plants and cats… get clean clobber.
      Exhaustion beckons – after weeks of writing a critical bid, I’m knackered from stress!
      Sigh…

  34. While I am delighted that the murdering slammer was shot dead in Paris yesterday, thus avoiding a trial,metal ishoos, human rights, over-reaction etc etc – I am troubled that, in a few years time, the children, on whose behalf he was so “enraged”, will become jihadis and seek to avenge their innocent, martyred, father so brutally slain by the murderous, white, racist police…..

    Still, if I could, for each person killed by a slammer, I’d blow up a mosque at random – preferably on a Friday.

    1. If everyone in the UK printed ten copies of these cartoons and stuck them up around the place on noticeboards, at work etc, it might develop herd immunity against offence for anyone who is a begins with M and ends in uslim.

      2. 325694+up ticks,
        Morning siadc,
        Along with, what in hell’s name is that instruction manual doing resting between the two dispatch boxes in parliament, and halal fodder on the parliamentary menu, ?

        Are your political future intentions towards the United Kingdom HONORABLE ?

        1. The franc is beginning to drop in France. The population figures and relative birth rates indicate that in around 20 years or less the incomers will be in the majority in Paris and other cities.

          3. I remember recently seeing clips of Paris litter strewn streets filled with illegal camps.
            No wonder they send them to us.

        1. I believe there are moderate muslims at the moment. As soon as widespread sharia is introduced (and it will be) these moderates will fall into line.

          We have already seen this happen in other countries.

          1. For “moderate” read “slovenly backsliders”. They don’t go the whole jihadi hog, but they agree with it. Is there even one case of a muslim giving information that would warn of an attack? The notion that “no one else was involved” is frequently trotted out by spokespersons for the security services. It is baloney.
            The lone gunman in the police station seems to be the centre of a cover up by the security services, as it has all gone not just quiet, but invisible, in respect of enquiries and raids and explosions that occurred in the days following the murder.

    2. Kitty, kitty burning bright,
      In the forests of the night;
      What immortal hand or eye,
      Could stroke thy furry symmetry?

      In what distant deeps or skies.
      Burnt the fire of thine eyes?
      On what wings dare he aspire?
      What the hand, dare seize the fire?

      And what shoulder, & what art,
      Could twist the sinews of thy heart?
      And when thy heart began to beat,
      What dread hand? & what dread feet?

      What the hammer? what the chain,
      In what furnace was thy brain?
      What the anvil? what dread grasp,
      Dare its deadly terrors clasp!

      When the stars threw down their spears
      And water’d heaven with their tears:
      Did he smile his work to see?
      Did he who made the Lamb make thee?

      Kitty, kitty burning bright,
      In the forests of the night:
      What immortal hand or eye,
      Dare stroke thy furry symmetry?

      (With apols to Mr Wm.Blake)

    3. What a gorgeous little face Rik.

      Morning all BTW. Cooked breaking this morning once bacon has defrosted.

        1. Trying to emulate son in law who reckons he’s lost 4” off his waist by eating differently. Eat like a king at breakfast, a prince at lunchtime and a pauper teatime. Mind you he’s in Dubai in the warm and eating loads of rabbit food that never did interest me much! Each to his own. And he goes proper cycling for miles at a time as opposed to us – we have an exercise bike! Not like you Bill, you must be in tip top condition with your 🚵‍♀️ cycling!

          “Trying to … “ – who am I kidding?🙂 I won’t hold my breath!

          1. If you heavily reduce your carbohydrate intake you will lose weight. When i did it i started dreaming about mashed potatoes. I got a flat stomach though.

          2. Thing is Phizzee we don’t eat a lot of carbs anyway. We think we eat really healthily but, must confess, I’m partial to the odd bar or two of the old choccie!

          3. There’s an article in the paper about a lady who ate all the right stuff, but became hugely fat. It was only when she wrote down what she ate, and how much, that she realised a handful of nuts is good, the whole bag is not; half an avocado is OK, 3 avocadoes isn’t, and so on. Lost 50kg in a year, she did.
            Cut out chocolate, too ;-))

          5. There’s an article in the paper about a lady who ate all the right stuff, but became hugely fat. It was only when she wrote down what she ate, and how much, that she realised a handful of nuts is good, the whole bag is not; half an avocado is OK, 3 avocadoes isn’t, and so on. Lost 50kg in a year, she did.
            Cut out chocolate, too ;-))

    4. Yep, far too many people are dumb as rocks. What it really shows is their own prejudices reinforced.

  36. Morning, all Y’all!
    Article in Aftenposten today about that the Norwegians have found 26 variants of the COVID virus by DNA analysis. Some are apparently easier transmitted but less virulent, the others the opposite.
    Good luck with finding a useful vaccine that will “protect us all”.

      2. I saw that. Of course they do. Bl**day teachers. How their pupils ever leave school with any sense of work ethic or responsibility is beyond me.
        Oh, wait a minute

        1. But, Stormy, they’re all (mostly) good little brainwashed leftie libtards. I grant you that there is maybe 10 in 100 who can think for themselves but the rest…

          1. There are also quite a few who work extremely hard and actually give a shut about their pupils getting on (Rastus of this Parish, and LotL being two, also my weird friend back home in Daarset), but they seem to be in a minority.
            Maybe they should be paid piece rate – £nn per lesson, bonus for exam performance? Like in my industry.

          4. There weren’t many of us in the staffroom. We used to huddle together for safety (and to do the crossword) 🙂

      4. I think it would be fairer to say that the spokespeople of the teaching unions want….

        One of my neighbours is a teacher and, whilst she is looking forward to half-term, she has no wish to return to either lockdown or school closure. Her recent comments suggest that more of her colleagues share that opinion than the opposite one.

        1. Then the union members should nstruct their union officials about their opinion.
          Another good reason to not be a member of a union.
          Good evening, Jennifer! (manners… :-((

          1. ‘lo Paul.

            Quite a lot of teachers are not members – which makes it difficult to instruct the union officials… (which could easily become a circular discussion).

            Quite a lot of teachers were working all through the spring – there were schools open for the children of key workers and even in a little village like the one where my elder niece lives the teachers were putting work up online to keep their youngsters occupied. In fact my great-niece and nephews did all sort of interesting projects between March and the end of June. From scale models to competitions to find leaves of the largest number of trees.

            They went back in August – then after one day my middle great-nephew had another week off (to his great disgust, he likes school) because the water which cause the train derailment just south of Stonehaven also flooded his school which is near the harbour. The teachers moved as much kit as they could when they realised what was going to happen and they were heavily involved in the clean up too. It’s easy to be disparaging, but it’s very often not accurate.

          2. Perhaps the teachers who actually want to teach should form a union of their own, to counter the prefer-to-be-at-home union? Maybe they should work, after all, not let the wasters run things and tell them what to do?
            And, I’m fully aware that there are hard-working teachers as you desscribed – my loops friend is one – but htere are an awful lot who went into teaching for an easy life and would rather sit at home on salary.
            Maybe the shop workers, who get paid bugger-all in comparison, should refuse to serve the waster teachers? As the waster teachers don’t do yer actual teaching unless they absolutely have to.

          3. I think any teacher could tell you that no one goes into teaching for “an easy life” or, if they do, they don’t last for more than a year or two. An easy life it ain’t even if it ever was (which I doubt). One of my clients gave up teaching a couple of years ago – after 20 years of teaching 4 and 5 year old “intake” classes. On two separate occasions when I was visiting the business she runs with her husband (and which now occupies her full-time) she was painting her classroom during the summer holidays – because the school budget could stretch to a few pots of paint, but not to painters. That’s how “lazy” a teacher is; she wasn’t the only one, the whole staff was in painting.

            The problem is that teaching well takes a lot of time – and so does running a union. The enthusiastic teacher doesn’t want to waste time on union affairs – but without union affairs being dealt with, there is no union.

            So the enthusiastic teacher either doesn’t join the union at all, or joins and ignores it 99% of the time. The union does the necessary pay negotiations (and anyone who is paid by government needs a decent negotiator) and the rest of the time most of the membership simply ignores it.

            Of course, in an ideal world, the teaching unions would reflect their membership better – but when did we ever live in an ideal world.

      5. Who do they think is ultimately going to pay their salaries when tax returns fall through the floor due to mass unemployment? There may be trouble ahead….

        1. Trouble is what they want though. It’s so clear that they are using this virus to try to steer the West into another Great Depression.

    2. The vaccine is nothing more than another ruse to keep people under control.
      Vit D, Zinc, Vit C, lose weight, a few cheap drugs and washing one’s hands are all that’s needed to reduce the risk to sensible proportions.

      1. Good afternoon, BB2.

        Yes, I agree with you but why
        do people need telling how to
        wash their hands and why do
        establishments make it a virtue
        by telling us their premises have
        been properly cleaned?
        These are very basic human actions
        yet so many of us, who should know better,
        are not complying with normal hygiene
        habits.

      1. 1. Empty words, as you allow more jihadis into this country every single day, although the responsibility for stopping them is yours.
        2. They were doing their job. What are your police doing?

      2. 325695+ up ticks,
        O2O,
        Has the priti thing any thoughts for the UK indigenous ?
        That is, good thoughts ?

          1. I wonder how many Norfolk boys and girls we have.
            A true ‘dumpling’ will know the answer to this question:

            “Ha ya faather gotta dicker bor?

        2. Don’t need a Mum, need a keeper with a gun, there’s trouble enough for three, ‘ave you got a loight boy, Ovaltine loite.

  39. Todays John Redwoods Diary.

    As
    we exit the EU fully we need to be aware of just how far the EU had got
    in seeking our integration and submission to their system. They were
    always bitterly disappointed that the UK avoided joining the Euro, the
    main mechanism by which a fully integrated EU economy is being created.
    Greece and Italy have discovered the hard way that there are many policy
    choices they can no longer make as they are committed to the
    disciplines of the Euro.

    Despite this they sought to ensnare
    us with various common policies. The Common Fishing policy took more and
    more of our fish to foreign ports, leaving us with one of the richest
    seas in the world to become net importers. The common energy policy got
    us to depend more on imports through interconnectors, making a country
    with plenty of its own energy partly dependent on a continental EU short
    of energy and committed to Russian gas. The common state procurement
    policy meant we bought more and more goods that the UK is quite capable
    of making from EU suppliers with continental factories. The Common
    Agricultural Policy led to a sharp decline in the proportion of our food
    we grow and rear for ourselves. The trade policy made us impose high
    tariffs on food products from outside the EU we could not grow
    ourselves. The animal welfare policy fell short of what we wanted, but
    we had to accept live movement of cattle and the standards the EU would
    accept for everything from chicken cages to sow tethers.

    In
    future blogs I will be examining the scope there now is to improve so
    many things. The annoyance is the way the last Parliament and much of
    the UK establishment blocked preparatory work to grasp these many
    opportunities to do better more quickly.

  40. Builder who stabbed three men to death as they attacked him will face NO charges because he was acting in self-defence. 17 October 2020.

    A man who stabbed three men to death as they attacked him has become the first person in the UK to face no charges over a self-defence triple killing.

    Mr Singh himself produced a knife during the vicious clash which lasted around 13 seconds and left Baljit Singh, 34, Narinder Singh, 26, and Harinder Kumar, 22, dead.

    Interesting that they are all Sikhs! It’s over money of course though there are no details. They are all here illegally as well so probably drugs.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8849961/Indian-overstayer-person-UK-face-no-charges-self-defence-triple-killing.html

    3. “a self-defence triple killing”
      Man, I’d hate to come across him when he’s REALLY scared!

      1. Sometimes she’s described as a foster mother, others as having adopted the children.
        That would make a helluva difference as to when the SS could get involved.

      2. My experience of social services ref my mother is thart they are all f*cking useless. And that’s on a good day. Spotting a problem and solving it is not their forte, to be polite about it!
        Proof of my opinion I receive almost weekly.

        1. Yes. I have a very low opinion of social worker types in general. When doors need to be kicked in they aren’t.

    2. As a foster mother (?) were there no checks? There are different accounts about her legal position.

    3. I couldn’t read that one. It sounds dreadful. Much sympathy if it brought back bad memories.

      1. It was very shocking. The mother or rather their torturer is out now. 14 year sentence reduced to 12 on appeal and served 6. The eldest girl killed herself some years later.

  42. Apropos BBC chairman…from the Grauniad

    “Osborne, who stepped down as editor of the Evening Standard in June after three years, is not believed to have been approached over the vacancy yet.”

    Stop approaching people! Advertise, shortlist, interview, appoint

          7. For months afterwards, I imagined that snakes were hiding under my bed.
            I knew I was being stupid; I knew that tropical venomous snakes did not inhabit an Essex farmhouse, but I still used to take a flying leap from the bedside mat onto the bed to avoid them.

          8. I remember doing that too, the flying leap onto the rug for precisely the same reason – logical thought process told me there were no snakes under the bed (nor hands to grab my ankles) but for that split second logic was over-ridden by sheer terror.

          10. That was re-enacted in a taxidermy tableau by my bedside on one exchange visit I led. As a confirmed herpetophobe, the last thing I needed was to see a cobra silhouetted against the early morning light every time I woke up!

  43. Off now to knock a little white ball around. We’re allowed to play table tennis indoors in two groups of six. Catch you later!

      1. No? I belong to two table tennis clubs – the league season is in abeyance and may not start in January either, unless things change, but with all the systems we have in place, risk assessments done, etc, etc, there is very little risk of catching anything. We have to wipe down the tables and clean the balls. We have much reduced numbers and only four tables where we used to have 12, but it’s a start.

        1. Father is allowed to bowl again, I’m not sure what all the detailed rules are, but he is able to get a bit of social time anyway.

  44. Just back from w/rose. Usually quiet early on Saturday, but today busy. People either stocking up for Christmas, or a national lock-down.

  45. The online gambling industry covers itself in glory once again as it refuses a punter a 1.7 million payout and whines “There was a software glitch”
    Hmm,I suppose if the “glitch” worked the other way they would be rushing to refund all the punters who were robbed??
    No,thought not…………
    Online gambling is entirely penicious in a way that goes far beyond offering lousy odds,most of it is actively crooked,many cases of payout refusal “Our algorithms don’t permit that level of win Mr Punter you must have been cheating”
    Have the temerity to be good enough at Sports betting to actually win and you will be promptly banned
    Hint,it ain’t the companies paying for the vast swathes of tv advertising,it’s the punters

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8847861/Gambler-refused-1-7m-blackjack-payout-Betfred-500m-glitch.html

      1. What ever their predicament Alf you have to feel a little bit sympathetic. Especially when migrants arrive here with two wives and 12 kids and the council have to evict a family to knock two houses into one to house them. Because they have complained.

        1. I agree with you in principle and have sympathy with them in the current circumstances. However my original reply still stands.

          2. The couple together have had 1 child; the others are all his by some other relationship. No idea where they were living before though.

      2. I don’t understand why welfare dependents get given more for breeding. They sit there, not working, being economic drains and yet when they have children they cannot afford, cannot house, cannot educate they get rewarded with a larger property – all at someone else’s expense.

        The neighbours away used to look at having more brats as a form of ‘promotion’ to a bigger house. The idea of earning it was beyond them. While welfare exists as a giant matress with the sheets and pillows changed and washed by the enforcement and punishment of the tax payer that attitude will continue.

        If you haven’t earned it, you can’t have it. It’s not bloody complicated.

    3. Perhaps fewer children might have been an idea? And she could have used the time to lose eight or ten stone.

      1. Miter been cafflicks.

        Both non catholic, my parents came from large families. But nobody starved.

      1. Sorry, I hit a downvote intending to hit “reply”. Here’s my reply “It’s only a shanty in old shanty town”.

          2. That was ages ago… moved to limoncello spritzers now, to get in the mood for Italian restaurant a bit later.

    2. Hi, Bill, I think that it maybe that the Kiwis are too close to Antarctica and it must freeze their brains rather than fry them.

    3. Isolationist NZ V Let it rip Sweden
      Interesting,we shall see what happens in the end……………

  49. Prickly business: the hedgehog highway that knits a village together. 17 October 2020.

    Hedgehogs are lactose intolerant. This was the first lesson from my village safari around Kirtlington in Oxfordshire, home to the UK’s longest volunteer-run hedgehog highway. “Leaving out bread and milk is the worst thing you can do,” says resident Chris Powles, who created the highway. It passes through 60 properties in the village, all linked by CD-sized holes cut into fences and walls, some of which have been around since the 18th century.

    Hedgehogs need space to create territories, forage and find mates. The compartmentalisation of land into private gardens is one of the causes of their disappearance from our landscape – they have declined by 90% since the second world war. More than 12,000 hedgehog holes have been created as part of the UK’s hedgehog highway network, and Kirtlington has one of the most creative routes on the map. Miniature ramps and staircases thread between gardens in this higgledy-piggledy place, with its 13th-century church and notices about cake sales and “cricketers wanted”.

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/oct/17/prickly-business-hedgehog-highway-knits-a-village-together-kirtlington-oxfordshire-aoe

    1. What an excellent idea. I could make a hole in our back fence (it belongs to us, and would connect the hedgehogs with the back garden of the flats behind us). We have them, but the death rate on the roads is distressingly high.

  50. Q: Why is the Bidens’ attorney demanding that Rudy Giuliani hands over/back the hard-drive allegedly from the computer Hunter left at a repair shop, which contains all those scandalous e-mails?

    A: Because it is a fake?

    1. Why would Giuliani have it anyway? He’s not a repairman.
      Reminds me of a 2 Ronnies sketch:
      RB: “If I was as rich as Rockefeller, I’d be richer”
      RC: “‘Ows that, then?”
      RB: “I’d do a spot of windowcleaning on the side!”
      Boom! Tish!

      1. It was handed over to Guiliani because he’s a Republican with lots of “clout” and contacts and would be listened to.

        He would also be very difficult for the Democrats to shut up.

          1. Someone posted a link to an Australian Sky interview earlier saying much the same.

            I smiled at a later description in your turcopolier link.

            Sweet Jesus! Are we really going to elect this poor fool? Are we going to give him and “Pol Pot in a pants suit” the Football and the Gold Codes?

    2. Yes, The Hunter Biden Emails Are Authentic by Larry C Johnson. 17 October 2020.

      This is the story of an American patriot, an honorable man, John Paul Mac Issac, who tried to do the right thing and is now being unfairly and maliciously slandered as an agent of foreign intelligence, specifically Russia. He is not an agent or spy for anyone. He is his own man. How do I know? I have known his dad for more than 20 years. I’ve known John Paul’s dad as Mac. Mac is a decorated Vietnam Veteran, who flew gunships in Vietnam. And he continued his military service with an impeccable record until he retired as an Air Force Colonel. The crews of those gunships have an annual reunion and Mac usually takes John Paul along, who volunteers his computer and video skills to record and compile the stories of those brave men who served their country in a difficult war.

      This story is very simple–Hunter Biden dropped off three computers with liquid damage at a repair shop in Wilmington, Delaware on April 12, 2019. The owner, John Mac Issac, examined the three and determined that one was beyond recovery, one was okay and the data on the harddrive of the third could be recoverd. Hunter signed the service ticket and John Paul Mac Issac repaired the hard drive and down loaded the data. During this process he saw some disturbing images and a number of emails that concerned Ukraine, Burisma, China and other issues. With the work completed, Mr. Mac Issac prepared an invoice, sent it to Hunter Biden and notified him that the computer was ready to be retrieved. Hunter did not respond. In the ensuing four months (May, June, July and August), Mr. Mac Issac made repeated efforts to contact Hunter Biden. Biden never answered and never responded. More importantly, Biden stiffed John Paul Mac Issac–i.e., he did not pay the bill.

      When the manufactured Ukraine crisis surfaced in August 2019, John Paul realized he was sitting on radioactive material that might be relevant to the investigation. After conferring with his father, Mac and John Paul decided that Mac would take the information to the FBI office in Albuquerque, New Mexico. Mac walked into the Albuquerque FBI office and spoke with an agent who refused to give his name. Mac explained the material he had, but was rebuffed by the FBI. He was told basically, get lost. This was mid-September 2019.

      https://turcopolier.typepad.com/sic_semper_tyrannis/

  51. Further to earlier.
    I watched the start of the Rugby League Cup final. I missed all the intro bit and joined the broadcast when they were observing a minute or two of silence in respect of someone, I know not who. This was followed by the National Anthem sung by a lovely young lady with a beautiful voice, Lizzie Jones. Then both teams went down on one knee. Not one player had the guts to stay on his feet. There were no members of the public in the Wembley, and it was apparently completely quiet, so quiet the commentators in the stand could hear the players talking. There were no scrums after a knock-on, simply a handover of the ball (Covid you know – anomalously ignoring the fact that a tackle involves three men in very close contact). After a few minutes Leeds were awarded a try, although from the playbacks etc I’d have said that the player was in touch.
    By that point I’d had enough.

    2. I watched the match – watched the opening, singing National Anthem etc.

      I saw them take 1 minutes silence in regard to members of the RL community who had died as a result of Covid 19.
      I was waiting to see if they were going to do that “Kneel to the BLM” stunt as I was ready to turn the tv straight off.
      They didn’t kneel down – I don’t know what you were watching but it certainly wasn’t the same programme that I watched !!!!
      Rugby League players don’t go in for that kind of Cr#p . . . .

  52. Just went out in the rain to check the bonfire. Still smouldering, nicely – and the fire was good, too.

    Amazing thing. I stuck a fork into the middle to see what was left – and half the cardboard box I used to start the fire PLUS some newspaper – appeared – unburnt. Yesterday, when it was at full pelt, you couldn’t get near it for the heat – and yet combustible material was, er, uncombusted.

    3. Ah, you need to turn the content around so it burns evenly. Otherwise – despite the heat it’ll not burn but merely exhaust the fuel.

      You need a sort of washing machine motion.

  54. The Royal HAIR Force: RAF will allow dreadlocks, braids and ponytails in bid to boost diversity in the service

    Marine sues Ministry of Defence for £100,000 after he had to sleep in igloo

    Who is in charge of the defence of the realm? The BBC or Elton John? It cannot be anyone of sound mind.

    1. The intelligence levels of the species are deteriorating at a far rapider rate than even I anticipated or forecast!

      1. We’re currently on the third generation where the weakest in society were not only saved from the consequences of their behaviour, but encouraged to have children, and everyone else lost their fear of starving.
        Thank you NHS and Welfare State!

      1. And discipline. Can’t have people shouting at miscreants, can we? They’d be suing for hurty feelings.

    4. People PAY good money to sleep in igloos & snowholes, ice hotels… Send the man a bill & tell him to…

      1. The issue, as is often the case, is not about where he was expected to sleep but about the fact that the appropriate kit was not provided for the exercise to be undertaken. Peace-time soldiers should not be left with life-long injuries simply because the kit-issuers can’t get their act together.

        1. There won’t be a lot going on in the UK, then, as pretty well everybody can’t get their act together.

          1. Actually there are lots of people getting on with life and doing a pretty good job most of the time. A morning when you encounter one of the wrong sort can give you a bit of a scunner – but they really are a pretty small minority – even in government departments. NB. My job means that I do spend quite a lot of time communicating with people in government departments and most of them are both pleasant and competent.

          2. That’s because they know that they can’t pull the wool over your eyes. It is often different for the layman.

          3. As far as any government department is concerned I’m just another layman (or woman) – I have no official clout at all.

            I have one contact, in one department, whom I use shamelessly for any problems which fall within her scope (and she hasn’t let me down yet), but for everything else I’m just another anonymous voice on the phone.

            Very often the hardest thing is to get through to the right person, telephone systems with recorded messages seem to be arranged to give the most confusing set of choices possible, but once there it can usually be solved.

            One morning in May it took me over 3 hours of listening to the options, then the music, repeatedly until I eventually reached the person who had access to the right part of the computer system (working at home each person had only limited access and couldn’t transfer calls) but the action required, when I finally reached the right person, was no problem. I think that the people who design the “in order to route your call…….” systems are a lot less competent than the people who actually deal with the queries.

  57. Bloody Hell,my sheltered housing court has gone full Covid Nazi overnight,new signs abound
    “Masks MUST be worn as residents move around the complex”
    “No entry to these premises without a mask”
    “No entry to the office for residents under Covid regs,email for appointment”
    FOAD springs to mind!!

  59. That’s me for the day. Lovely sunset – rain forecast for tomorrow morning.

    Have a jolly evening.

    A demain.

    3. Happiness is when an enemy slips on a banana of life and lands elbow first in another enemy’s solar plexus.

    4. Exeter have won the trophy, rugby union, against a French team. That’s Something to be happy about! 😍😍😍. Heineken’s Cup.

  62. Nicked

    Liberty versus the barbarians

    “He died, beheaded, in the middle of the road, in the middle of the day, in
    France. A history teacher, he joins the memorial to the victims of
    conquering Islamism alongside the soldiers of Montauban, the children of
    the Otzar Hatorah school, the journalists and cartoonists of Charlie
    Hebdo, the policewoman of Montrouge, the French Jews of the Hyper Casher
    supermarket, strollers in Nice on Bastille Day, Father Hamel, the
    massacred of the Bataclan and the cafes and terraces, the young women at
    Saint Charles station, Colonel Beltrame, the officers at the police
    station, and all victims from Saint-Quentin-Fallavier to the Champs
    Elysée, from Villejuif to Romans-Sur-Isère, who have died from the
    bullets and knives of the jihadists. If this is not a war on our
    territory, a ‘clash of civilisations at the interior of our national
    community’ (Alain Finkelkraut), what is it, then? The terror is striking
    our institutions, symbols, ordinary people. The Kouachi brothers have
    inspired imitators in the streets of our suburbs. School, which they
    benefited from, is not spared. After the soldier, the jew, the
    cartoonist, the journalist, the cop and the priest, the teacher is being
    watched by the barbarians. For what limp objective? To install by
    murder the impossibility of criticising islam. He who caricatures the
    prophet does so at risk of his life. ‘They are trying to impose their
    ideology through terror’ explains Zineb El Rhazoui, former journalist at
    Charlie Hebdo, herself threatened with death. She is not the only one
    to sound this alert. Like so many others, the only response she receives
    is the sugary speech accusing her of sowing division and stopping
    community harmony. To take these threats seriously was, to these higher
    souls, to give substance to them. The priority was something else: to
    track ‘hate speech’, coming from the depths of an automatically guilty
    France. Poor censors who should blush with shame! Yesterday our country
    was hit directly in the heart. When will we finally wake up? ”

    Le Figaro

    1. For what it might prove to be worth, sounds as though Le Figaro might slowly be rousing from its slumbers.

      1. Too bloody late. The slammers are well installed. Everywhere, like rats. Toy Boy may “pledge” that France will not have “a nation within the nation” – but he, too, is far too late. The damage has been done. The bastards are there.

        And it is not helped by the woke (yes, they are alive and well in yer France) saying that each perpetrator has mental issues, or has been radicalised, or failed to appreciate the seriousness of what he was doing.

        All rational, sensible, well-adjusted people in the UK and in France – and everywhere else where this evil dogma is established – know this but are silenced for “hate crimes” or ignorance or intolerance or are dismissed as “far-right extremists”.

    2. It’s the same here in the UK where there is in actuality a low level Islamic terrorist campaign being waged. The government of course pretends that it is a few individuals that have been “radicalised” but their reluctance to provoke them in any way tells you that they have surrendered!

  64. Polish Leader: EU Won’t ‘Blackmail’ Poland Into Giving Up Values, Surrendering Sovereignty
    https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2020/10/17/polish-leader-eu-wont-blackmail-poland-into-giving-up-values-surrendering-sovereignty/
    ‘Nuff Said
    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/f8edc9f7b85dcaf4c4573e8627bda0d9cedae0b3b8294aa8a2f0a032b00da626.jpg
    Funny how this only works one way…………………..
    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/ef9f561809df6135d8cd5b5d812b901985387755d8dc4d54f917c0d9c3bde9af.png

          1. Try some of the various French “crémants”. A fraction of the price of Champagne and in many cases as good, and if you buy and drink many cases for the price of one of Champagne you won’t be able to tell the difference.

          4. Cremant de Jura, from Lidl (or ALDI?) and Blanquette de Limoux from wine merchants.

          5. Bordeaux, Bougogne, and almsot anywhere that produces wines that lend themselves to being “fizzed”.

            I’m a Philistine, give me four bottles of a good crémant over a mediocre champagne any time, and cost; bottle to four, is about the same.

    2. ‘Community relations’ seems to consist of Muslims on one side murdering non-Muslims on the other.

    3. They come to our civilisations for a “better life” – – then want everything exactly like they have back home.

  70. From our son but can’t post the picture.

    Question:

    If you could end COVID-19 by sacrificing a U.K. City, which city would you choose and why Liverpool?

      1. It has to be that area bounded by the M25, when a full parliament is in session.

        York for capital Sue Edison for PM.

    3. London, Luton, Birmingham, Brighton.

      Oh. Do I have to choose one? Wouldn’t more than one be a bigger ‘sacrifice’?

  71. There have been a few posts today about the French school teacher who was murdered and beheaded.

    The killer was 18 years old, a Muslim and almost certainly arrived as a “refugee”, probably pretending to be a child.

    Every day, Europe is accepting hundreds if not thousands of asylum seekers and economic migrants, the majority of them being in the age range 18-30 (even ignoring those claiming to be under 18) and of those probably 95% are males.

    Of those, the majority are Muslims.

    We are preparing our own funeral pyre, as Powell noted.

    2. Douglas Murray’s fears and warnings have been overlooked by our mindless politicians.

  73. Thought for the evening:

    I always lift the seat to pee and then lower it again on the off chance that HG is next up (or down as the case may be)

    Do any women who pee lift the seat for the next man?

    1. I am far happier when facilities have a good bidet: we have two – one in the main bathroom upstairs and the other in the downstairs loo.

  74. Night All
    I’ll just dump the odds and sods picked up during the day…….
    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/3954d5d806d1e0451d3ef6dca22915ab8fa7bb2f0365b2a4c26c44baf03d0f04.jpg
    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/32994f9599cab74b5b55c9d74f9d2acfeb16cef568ea1ee6485e54cab6611d20.jpg
    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/36b49911dfecf7db7d55d3f2834f4b82c0d52eccbefa26600be2619a682d181e.jpg
    https://scontent-lhr8-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/121664779_1690271051134915_1478377981213755064_n.jpg?_nc_cat=109&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=YKYJg4Xapo8AX9JFBdf&_nc_ht=scontent-lhr8-1.xx&oh=76efc84ba4b3018d7841849bb80d00f5&oe=5FAF1C7A
    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/d291a4975af4ebc217aa04aaebb3a0bb383bc8be061895e3be69ec23ad84bb2f.jpg

    1. A movie I won’t go and watch. Too much hard work, that. It was bad enough going to Auschwitz & Birkenau, without seeing it with people in it, too, actors or otherwise.

        1. The film is outstandingly good and leaves an indelible impression. Many say it’s the best film ever made.

          I recently purchased the super-duper 4K version but somehow I can’t bring myself to watch it again.

          1. I’ll pass, thanks. I don’t have the strength for that kind of emotional assault.

        2. The visits to Auschwitz were hard work. The biggest event was the famous room with the glass exhibition cases with hair (ukk), belongings, suitcases and shoes.
          The cases typically had the owner’s name painted on them, so you knew who that case had belonged to.
          The posessions were typically small and pathetic: Combs, brushes, toothbrushes, razors, small bowls and the like.
          … and the case of the poor, broken shoes.
          Anything of any value had been recycled into the economy, leaving the useless behind. It’s very moving. Glad I went, hated every tiny moment of it.

          1. I haven’t been there, I will go if the opportunity arises, so far it hasn’t. The last time I did any major travelling in Europe the east was still closed.

          2. It’s good education, but very discomforting.
            Went with Firstborn’s school class when he was 16. By bus (argh – never again) and we visited several camps.
            At Auschwitz, the Polish guide got cross because the girls in the class would sit & chatter when she was trying to tell us about whatever.
            When, in Birkenau, we got to the ovens, the girls sat down again on the grass (amid ponds of weirdly turquoise water), she asked them whether they could see small the white flecks on the ground where they say. When they said “yes”, she explained that they were the bone remains of cremated people, and the girls stood up in utter horror – and at that point realised what the trip was about. Not socialising and shopping, but confronting as best one could the beastliness of mankind.

          3. Your average 15 to 17 year old is a pretty self-obsessed beast – probably necessary to survive the business of growing up, but it can make them seem particularly dense. The girls chatter and the boys (in the main) turn dumb and confine themselves to communicating by grunts or, at best, monosyllables. It makes the girls look dizzier than the boys, but it’s mostly appearance rather than fact (unless you just landed with a particularly silly group of girls).

            I’m inclined to think that while schools are doing their best the teen years are not the best for that sort of experience. The beastliness of mankind is hard enough for adults to cope with, after all.

          6. Tragic, Annie.

            PS -Some years ago I went with a coach load of friends to Ypres en route to Brussels and Waterloo. There was a museum in (I think, Brussels) commemorating the slaughter of Jews in World War Two. I was totally moved and had to shout at a group of British teenage schoolchildren to stop chattering and laughing and tell them to show a little more respect or leave the building. They did shut up, but I could imagine them all thinking “Silly old fool”.

          7. Tragic, Annie.

            PS -Some years ago I went with a coach load of friends to Ypres en route to Brussels and Waterloo. There was a museum in (I think, Brussels) commemorating the slaughter of Jews in World War Two. I was totally moved and had to shout at a group of British teenage schoolchildren to stop chattering and laughing and tell them to show a little more respect or leave the building. They did shut up, but I could imagine them all thinking “Silly old fool”.

          8. We visit all sorts of cemetaries and battlefields and museums and fortresses, HG is mostly a follower but she knows what it means, because I found her great Uncle’s grave. and I never come away without a sense of what all those young men suffered.

            On the civilian side, we ( actually me) get drawn back to Oradour sur Glane, horrifying; and places like Passchendaele and Ypres itself, where one can’t start to imagine what it must have been like living in the vicinity.

            And when people complain about French sacrifice I would refer them to the ossuarries and fortresses around Verdun.

          9. I’ve been to Auschwitz-Birkenau, also visited the nearby salt mines on one of my many trips to Poland. On another occasion I visited Theresienstadt, now called Terezin, in Czechien. That was the propaganda camp, where the inmates were shown enjoying a happy life. What the cameras did not film was the wall around he back where prisoners were shot. Most got transferred to Auschwitz.

          10. Hi, Peddy. Recently I watched the two TV series of WINDS OF WAR and WAR AND REMEMBRANCE, based on the two novels by Herman Wouk, and the “spruced up” village of Theresienstadt with happy, smiling prisoners welcoming Red Cross inspectors was featured in the second series. It was suggested that the Red Cross (mainly composed of Norwegians) were not at all fooled, but did not voice their real views because they feared that the Germans’ anger would be taken out on the prisoners themselves. Incidentally, after watching the two series I decided to read the two books (I am now a quarter through the second one) and can heartily recommend both books and the two series (available free on YouTube) to all NoTTLers.

          11. Hi, Peddy. Recently I watched the two TV series of WINDS OF WAR and WAR AND REMEMBRANCE, based on the two novels by Herman Wouk, and the “spruced up” village of Theresienstadt with happy, smiling prisoners welcoming Red Cross inspectors was featured in the second series. It was suggested that the Red Cross (mainly composed of Norwegians) were not at all fooled, but did not voice their real views because they feared that the Germans’ anger would be taken out on the prisoners themselves. Incidentally, after watching the two series I decided to read the two books (I am now a quarter through the second one) and can heartily recommend both books and the two series (available free on YouTube) to all NoTTLers.

      2. Just seeing the military cemeteries in Northern France is enough for me, I really don’t need to see how bad people can be.

        Father in Law was observer in a plane that flew over one of the camps shortly after allied troops reached it. His memories were such that he would never fly in a small plane again.

        1. Never been to the Northern French war cemeteries, but just seeing the pictures… the endless rows of white crosses…
          There’s a small war cemetery just outside Siracusa, Sicily, that I visited some years ago. In beautiful condition, but sad as you could imagine – it even seemed to shut out the sound of the main road outside. Very emotional, it was.

  76. I’ve been reading all the earlier posts on Covid, moving music, and people’s experiences.

    Without being callous, and I apologise to anyone who is hurt by this comment:

    I suspect that most Nottlers know of far more people who have committed suicide than have died of Covid, and I strongly suspect that that apples to the population as a whole.
    And what I find appalling is that the actions of the politicians and “experts” are likely to increase the number of suicides almost exponentially.

    It is not just sad, it is criminal.

      1. I am almost certain that more people will die of neglect, lack of investigations, lack of early treatments etc., because so much of the response has been to covid.

        It will be far more than covid will ever kill, and of those, most would have died “naturaly” in a few months anyway.

      2. This nonsense has gone on long enough. The entire Covid scheme is a constructive scam. Anyone with an ounce of intelligence can see this as a gigantic fraud aimed at stealing our wealth and industries and has nothing whatever to do with our nation’s health and everything to do with the globalist billionaires who hope to determine our livelihoods and steal our money.

        The future, whilst we have clowns such as Johnson and Hancock in charge in the UK, for government is bleak.

        1. There will be an islamic power grab very shortly. Johnson is making such a (deliberate?) mess of everything; we as a people are disorganised with no national unity having been sliced, diced and deliberately set at each others throats for this very reason.

    3. 650 deaths per million is what Statistica is reporting for the UK (488 per million in yer France and 263 per million over here in Canada). That’s about 1 in 1,500 in the UK.

      You would think that everyone would know of someone in their village who popped their covid clogs.

      1. Indeed, but ask you own circle and compare suicides with Covid.

        And be honest, do you really know and mix with 1,500+ people?

        1. No I don’t mix with 1,500 but out little town is maybe 5,000 and the municipality 25,000. It’s a very close knit community, you cannot do anything without everyone knowing about it so I cannot see that any locals died of covid without everyone being made aware.

          1. So, going back to my original observation; how many suicides are you and your immediate circle aware of and how many covid deaths?

            My money is that suicides far and away exceed covid.

            My comment is not a point scoring exercise, merely asking the question and indirectly suggesting that society is trying to solve the wrong problem at the moment

          2. I am not sure that I know of anyone that committed suicide beyond vague references to someone who knew someone who . . . Maybe suicides are covered up by families feeling shame about a relative taking that way out

            I was just thinking of the covid numbers and thinking that if that is the frequency then someone in my circle would know of someone who died or at least have a relative who died.

          3. Deaths (and illness) from SARS-CoV-2 are considerably greater in areas of the greatest population density so your little town may well have fewer than its “share”.

            The spread of suicides is not similarly affected.

          4. I think that’s a valid point. It’s still a taboo subject. Of all the funerals I’ve played for, I can think of only one suicide. And 40-odd years ago, a near neighbour blew his brains out with a 12-bore. I’m vaguely aware of one or two others: friends of friends of friends – i.e. no-one close.

            As for Covid deaths, I personally know no-one who has succumbed. A friend’s son’s girlfriend’s friend’s Mum died with it. Or possibly from it.

            Meanwhile, in a united parish with four village churches, I would normally expect to play for a couple of church funerals a month. This year, we’ve had four, none of which were covid-related. Go figure…

    5. You are right. I couldn’t live without music – my musical tastes are eclectic (as you may have noticed) and I find moving music cathartic, best enjoyed after a few glasses, preferably alone to avoid embarrassment!

      I hope that some of the people affected by the current troubles can find release in good music, whatever the genre.

      1. I have enough CDs to tile the sky… yet keep comomg back to just a few.
        One advantage of my old Ipod – put it on shuffle for the whole gadget, a genre, or whatever, and it will play you something you forgot you have – wonderful, that.

        1. I transferred a lot of CDs onto my PC then copied everything across to a USB drive. It was quite shocking to see that the music from a box of CDs too big to carry would fit onto a tiny USB.

          2. My mother has digitised her photograph collection. From 1860s up to the advent of digital cameras. A cupboard full of photo albums condensed down to a tiny USB.

            She isn’t discarding the albums – but the digital copies can be shared with the whole family.

      2. If music or a book can’t move you (yes often to tears) what the hell is the point,anything less is mere pabulum

    1. A chart where you compare the 2020 against the 2018 for each country would be interesting. Believe Sweden now has “under-deaths” – as in, thiose who were going to croak in the autumn anyway did so in the spring.

      1. That’s a tall order.
        ONS data for UK is freely available and reliable.
        Data from ECDC and Eurostat are dodgy and difficult to access respectively.
        My chart does have some limitations but offers some scope for discussion of the relative impact of European COVID-19 deaths compared with historic UK death rates.

  78. Has Doris finally grown a pair….?

    The ultimatum was delivered by Boris Johnson a few days ago; if there was no agreement by the mid-October Brussels summit, we would walk away from talks. In his speech, the Prime Minister said we must leave with an Australian-style deal, by which he means WTO terms (or No Deal as some would have it). But crucially, we have not left the room.

    https://www.express.co.uk/comment/expresscomment/1348851/brexit-news-nigel-farage-boris-johnson-eu-no-deal-latest

    1. As ever, Plum, a fascinating insight. All I can see on my screen is a grey splodge. Hope you are well.

        2. Hi Plum

          Emigrate to New Zealand! It used to be my favourite country alongside Nepal, both of which have been ruined.

          Oops! Wrong! NZ has now gone completely and irretrievably up the creek and my cousins thereof are bloody furious.

          Great-grandmother, of pioneering NZ stock, brought her three daughters back to UK once her husband died, so as to get them married off. A formidable lady, she did quite a good job. Three of her progeny had a starring or closely related role on 02/05/53. [Shameless Advertising: Buy a copy (now on the ‘Remainder’ stands) of ‘Lady in Waiting’ by Anne Glenconner, my 2nd cousin. She’s even funnier in life than in print. She’s rather unfair about her Mum, my Dad’s favourite 1st cousin who I thought was wonderful the few times I met her, and not nearly rude enough about her appalling husband. Rumour has it that there might be a follow-up volume but she’s understandably equivocal. My brother and I are agin it because she has too many stories to tell and might lose her marbles and tell altogether too much.

          After my above extravaganza of name-dropping, rest assured, Plum, that I have not the faintest clue as to what to do and passed the ‘Oh Sod It’ threshold years ago. We are too old. My solace is the prospect of occasional amusing lunches with the likes of equally bloody minded souls, although there are some NoTTLers who I would avoid like the plague. You are definitely on my ‘lunch list’ should we ever find ourselves in the same approximate vicinity.

          1. My father told me to emigrate to NZ or OZ years ago. he could see which way the wind was blowing. Did I listen to my dad? …No.. headstrong me knew better….
            I have days like that too….WTF can we do?….
            Thankfully living in Cornwall I can switch off from the real world and get on with enjoying my life to the full…..
            I soldier on…tennis is a distraction when playing allows and lunch with like minded people reminds me I am not alone….here’s to lunch and a sherry…..or two….Cheers Citroen1 !

          3. Keep on trucking, Plum.

            I take vicarious pleasure merely looking at the photographs of your garden.

          5. I’ll look out for the book, Citroen. It’s just the sort of thing that I’d enjoy and will sit happily among others similar in my library.

    2. 325685+ up ticks,
      Evening PT,
      There is always a latch lifter in their treachery prose
      is my belief,

      If the EU comes back “with a fundamental change of opinion” then the UK will listen. But says that doesn’t sound likely after the summit

      1. OK, so we remove one fishing boat from the French fleet to allow the EU unimpeded access to your EEZ. OK?
        Yes, OK.

    1. It actually worked very well here, during the first lockdown.

      You were stopped, you showed your attestation and then carried on.
      30 seconds.

          1. OTH, many proper nouns & adjectives in Swedish, e.g. days of the week, months, nationalities, start with a small letter… oktober, svensk (Swedish adj.), svenska (Swedish language).

    5. I was talking to my friend in France only yesterday and joked with him that he would need his papers in order again just like in March.
      He informed me he still has a supply of blank forms ready to fill out again. He suspects a national lockdown in France is only a question of when not if.
      Time will tell if he is correct in his assumption.

    6. Just as we have downloaded the badge from our government website saying we are medically exempt from wearing a mask. More should do it. In fact all should do it.

  81. Apropos my post below about the slammer murderer in France.

    I made a similar comment BTL on today’s article in The Grimes. After two hours, I had 31 thumbs. Then the comment was removed as it “offended our policy”.

    In other words, some woke person or, more likely, a slammer, had objected to the Mods – and that was me “cancelled”.

    Funny old world, eh?

  82. Food supply chain to hospitals, care homes, schools and prisons on brink of collapse, wholesalers warn. 17 october 2020.

    Food wholesalers have warned the Chancellor that their supply chain to hospitals, care homes, schools and prisons is on the brink of collapse due to restrictions on pubs and restaurants.

    Forcing customers to leave eating and drinking venues at 10pm, combined with reduced demand for hospitality services due to social distancing, has put unsustainable pressure on the industry, the Federation Of Wholesale Distributors and Food and Drink Federation argue.

    Apocalypse soon?

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/10/17/food-supply-chain-hospitals-care-homes-schools-prisons-brink/

      1. Supply chains for retail and wholesale are, frequently, very different. Things like flour being in 25kg bags for the trade but 1.5kg bags for the housewife. Eggs in 30 dozen boxes – not half dozen or dozen boxes. Prime cuts don’t, on the whole go to supermarkets – they go direct to restaurants.

        Morrisons packed flour from in store bakeries for sale on shelves and put 30 dozen boxes of eggs on display with empty half-dozen (pack your boxes) in their big stores – but it’s not so easy in small stores.

        Organic milk has a tiny footprint in the shops – it almost all goes into catering (mostly high-end); friends who produce the stuff had their on farm price drop to 5p per litre – and exhortations from their buyer to dump it rather than force them to collect. This in April and May when the spring grass was at its best and the “girls” were in full flow.

        Just when things were being re-jigged everyone was given the office to re-open – now there are threats of re-closure. The food trade, by definition, has very long lead-in times and is extremely inelastic.

          4. Although I was a weekly visitor to Aldi in Germany, I have never been to the ‘new’ Aldi in Hunts.

          6. I’m very familiar with 30 dozen boxes – the old wooden ones – I used to fill them every day back in my early teens when egg collecting was one of my regular chores.

            Nowadays the boxes are cardboard, so just the weight of the eggs to lift – not a lump of timber too.

          7. Why did I just know that someone would mention 10s or 15s (also available in some places)?

            Bet they don’t have them in boxes of 30 dozen though – which is the point of that sentence.

          9. And that’s why, when Morrisons had that size of box available – they were letting the customer pack their own 6, or 12 or whatever.

            But I used to collect about 3 times that many in a day and pack them. They were collected once a week (unless we had too much snow for the van to get up the hill – in which case they would be taken down the field by tractor and trailer to meet the van on the main road).

            The wooden crates were about 2’6″ by 1’3″ and stood about 1’6″ high (that’s a very rough size) so it would take up a fair bit of space in your pantry too.

            Nowadays egg units are huge, 100,000 birds is not unusual, but all the egg handling (as well as the feeding and cleaning out) is mechanised – no more teenage girls packing them by hand.

          10. And that’s why, when Morrisons had that size of box available – they were letting the customer pack their own 6, or 12 or whatever.

            But I used to collect about 3 times that many in a day and pack them. They were collected once a week (unless we had too much snow for the van to get up the hill – in which case they would be taken down the field by tractor and trailer to meet the van on the main road).

            The wooden crates were about 2’6″ by 1’3″ and stood about 1’6″ high (that’s a very rough size) so it would take up a fair bit of space in your pantry too.

            Nowadays egg units are huge, 100,000 birds is not unusual, but all the egg handling (as well as the feeding and cleaning out) is mechanised – no more teenage girls packing them by hand.

          12. I never did drop one, though I came close once or twice. ’twasn’t the thought of the mess – but the thought of what father would have had to say….

    1. Brilliant a MUST read for Nottlers everywhere. It should be compulsory reading for the entire British Cabinet!

      1. The author has got Chris Green MP (who resigned his Pps post last week) on his side, so he could be influential.

    3. Very interesting and very readable. I note that his comment on the make-up of SAGE is not dissimilar to my own a few days ago.

      1. Ah yes, you were so right, as always.

        If only you would communicate your analysis of the situation directly to the Cabinet Office, the Government might yet amend its policies and pull us back from the brink.

    4. Thank you for posting. The whole SAGE advice has been wrong headed from the start. They still take us for fools.

      Most of us know when we are being lied to. The government are most culpable for not seeking the advice of clinical immunologists. The UK leads the world in Immunology so why have they bypassed the expert scientists and relied instead on discredited mathematical modellers, such as Ferguson, whose track record at prediction is risible.

  90. Evening, all. The Zoom AGM went well this afternoon and I’ve managed to get my hair cut as well. There have been no Covid-19 deaths in Shropshire , but more than 70 positive cases confirmed, so I suspect we’re in for a rise in the risk categories. To my mind, it’s deaths (and those where C19 is the only cause, not a contributing factor) we should be worrying about. In other news, you are buggered if you’re on a waiting list, you’ll probably die (not of C19) first: https://www.shropshirestar.com/news/health/coronavirus-covid19/2020/10/17/year-long-treatment-waits-hit-record-highs-as-pandemic-hits-health-services/

        1. Exacto – as the barber commented! 🙂

          Not too sure about younger (really strange) cat, who proceeded to sniff at and, possibly, eat some of daddy’s fur.

          1. The black girl in the picture sheds to some degree all year round, but it’s most noticeable in spring. Not being the most house-proud creature on the planet I’m sometimes a bit slow to sweep it all up around her bed. One day this spring I’d left the back door open and then been detained by a phone call. When I went back and opened the kitchen door there were no fewer than three birds (both of a pair of blackbirds and a robin) inside the house, helping themselves to dog fur. So I had a sweep round and put a couple of big handfuls into an old flower pot and left it outside. An assortment of birds visited the “shop” in the following days and a surprising amount of it disappeared.

            I’ve never heard of a cat eating hair (other than its own which can cause problems in some long-haired breeds) but maybe he/she/it was just investigating and puzzled by the sudden appearance of fur which smelled of you.

          2. That was my take, but she is an odd one and eats most things: flies, moths, crane-flies, ants, spiders, bits of fluff…

            Earlier in the year, the birds cleared my “fur” off the lawn in no time.

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