Monday 11 January: Police should not alienate the public with heavy-handed enforcement

Posted on by Geoff Graham

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Today’s letters (visible only to DT subscribers) are here:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/2021/01/11/letters-police-should-not-alienate-public-heavy-handed-enforcement/

987 thoughts on “Monday 11 January: Police should not alienate the public with heavy-handed enforcement”

  1. This Ought To Make All Grandpas Feel Warm & Fuzzy

    A six-year-old goes to the hospital with her mother to visit her Grandpa.
    When they get to the hospital, she runs ahead of her mother and bursts into her Grandpa’s room.

    “Grandpa, Grandpa,” she says excitedly, “As soon as Mummy comes into the room, please make a noise like a frog!”

    “What?” said her Grandpa.

    “Make a noise like a frog – because Mummy said that as soon as you croak, we’re all going to Disney Land!

    1. Why is it called Conservative Woman? It seems it is read mainly by (and commented upon solely by) blokes!

        1. What does that mean? People have a sex (and there are but two). Only nouns have a ‘gender’.

          5. People have a sex (and there are but two).

            ‘Fraid that’s just not true. Roughly 1 in every 200 babies is born with one of the very many intersex conditions which are known, and every now and again a new one crops up (because diagnostics are so much better).

            Then there’s the fact that animals all have a sex two. And they also suffer from intersex conditions.

        2. What does that mean? People have a sex (and there are but two). Only nouns have a ‘gender’.

      2. ‘Morning, George, it’s got man in its title supporting the little Woman…

        I’ll get me tin hat!

  9. SIR – Here in a Derby suburb on the edge of a local park, there is a stall selling coffee and soup and attracting large groups, yet there has not been a policeman in sight.

    I do wish the Government (and the police) would send a consistent message on what is and what isn’t allowed. The majority of us will follow the rules – provided we know what the rules are.

    Terry Lloyd
    Derby

    Just to let you know, it is my intention to write a personal letter to the Chief Constable of Derbyshire, which will include Terry Lloyd’s letter, alongside the published reports from elsewhere in the county of late where heavy-handed force has been use in a most unnecessary manner.

    I shall report back anon if I get a response.

    1. So that’s the end of that stall. ‘Morning, Grizz! I know it’s hard, but sometimes silence is the best policy.

      1. Morning. Joe. Ah! I see your point. Even if I don’t mention that stall in my letter, I’m sure that many at the Derbyshire Constabulary HQ will read about in it the DT.

        Damned if we do …

      2. I suspect the heavy-handed approach is due to their resentment at having to walk the streets instead of being in the station tracking down social media “offences”.

          1. Morning, Harry.

            Not quite. They only edited superfluous bits from the first and final paragraphs. Thankfully they left the middle paragraph, which contained the gist of the message, entirely unaltered.

          2. Always give them something to change/edit out. They wouldn’t be doing their job otherwise….😉

  10. Morning all.

    SIR – You report on the two women who were fined £200 by Derbyshire police after driving into the countryside for a walk with cups of coffee.

    The case is now under review – but should such excessive enforcement occur again, the consequences for policing by consent and the public’s respect for the police are likely to be negative. A degree of common sense must be applied.

    Phil Coutie

    Exeter, Devon

    SIR – Here in a Derby suburb on the edge of a local park, there is a stall selling coffee and soup and attracting large groups, yet there has not been a policeman in sight.

    I do wish the Government (and the police) would send a consistent message on what is and what isn’t allowed. The majority of us will follow the rules – provided we know what the rules are.

    Terry Lloyd

    Derby

    SIR – It is disappointingly necessary to stress, yet again, the importance of the difference between the criminal law, as it applies to Covid-related restrictions on liberty and Government advice. The police must enforce the former, but have no powers whatever in relation to the latter.

    ADVERTISING

    Understanding might be improved by redrafting the Government’s web pages, which purport to set out “what you can and cannot do” and which are far from clear (some might say misleading) about this essential distinction.

    His Honour Charles Wide QC

    Peterborough

    SIR – The question of how far it is acceptable to travel is an important one for cyclists.

    For exercise, I cycle a round trip of 12 miles daily. If this activity were to remain “local”, I reckon I would have to do about 150 laps of our village green – somewhat monotonous.

    Stuart Miller

    Preston, Lancashire

    SIR – I suspect that the various police forces coming under pressure to enforce lockdown rules fairly, in a country where people are quick to spot injustice, would be assisted by the banning of groups of (largely) men roaming the country day in day out and legally flouting those rules in the name of football.

    Janice Coltman

    Morecambe, Lancashire

    SIR – There are some curious anomalies when it comes to what can and cannot be bought at the moment.

    In a local supermarket on Friday, we had no problem buying an interior design magazine along with our food shopping, but we were not allowed to buy a paperback children’s spelling book for our young grandson.

    At a time when children are not in school, all educational toys and books should be regarded as essential – or at least as essential as a magazine that explains how to make cushion covers.

    George Edwards

    Mumbles, Swansea

    3. A good point, Janice Coltman. Our local TV News yesterday featured extracts from some football match or other. Having watched the participants spitting, hugging, shaking hands and leaping on each other like copulating frogs in the Spring, I wondered how the organisers knew that the virus would not have any interest in their activities. (Rather like yours truly, in fact.)

      ‘Morning, Epi.

      1. Agreed, Anne, and Good morning.

        The current police farce are an out-of-control bunch of thugs. SA and SS seem to be their rôle models.

  11. Good morning, all. Fifty six years ago today, I was admitted as a solicitor. Seems like yesterday.

    1. So, what you’re saying is (© Cathy Newman) Du bist von gestern. You’re wet behind the ears.

    5. “When I was a babe and wept and slept,
      Time crept;
      When I was a boy and laughed and talked,
      Time walked.
      Then when the years saw me a man,
      Time ran.
      But as I older grew,
      Time flew.
      Soon, as I journey on,
      I’ll find time gone.
      May Christ have saved my soul, by then,
      Amen.”

      In terms of years, the Falklands Conflict in 1982 was closer to D-Day than 2021 is to the Falklands Conflict. (intervals of 38 and 39 years respectively; slightly convoluted, sorry)

      1. That is a very pertinent point you make there, Tim.

        During my school days and first job, the clock took forever to go around. My first thirty years seemed like a hundred. My last forty years have seemed to whizz by like a fortnight! How may I put a brake on the accelerating progress of that damned clock? 😟

        2. Morning Grizz, time goes like this….when you’re an infant there are 365 days in a year, when you are an adult there are 52 weeks in a year, when you are elderly there are 12 months in a year. over 80 and there are 4 seasons in a year

      2. Goodness!
        What a thought!
        Reflecting, my 9mm Walther P.38 is dated September 1941 and I bought it in 1980. I have owned it more than half it’s existence… now I feel old :-((

        1. We married in February 1964.
          When I was organising the invitation for our 50th, I realised we had actually been married for longer than the gap between our wedding day and the outbreak of WWI.

  12. Morning again

    Hanging on the phone

    SIR – I called my bank on a fairly important matter (Letters, January 9).

    After multiple security questions and a very long wait, a recorded voice said: “If your inquiry is urgent, please try later.” Then the call was terminated.

    Martin Moyes

    Holt, Wiltshire

    3. The same happens if you go into your account details on line and make an enquiry about a particular payment that you have no knowledge of. The days drift by……….

    4. My advice: change your bank!

      I have the personal desk telephone numbers and work mobile phone numbers of all the staff at my UK bank. Whenever I need to contact them they answer immediately, in person. On the odd occasion they are not available, one of their colleagues answers.

        1. I let inertia take over. They are all equally unpleasant, so why put yourself through the hassle?

      3. My choice of banks with a nearby branch is severely limited. Of the choice available, the one I’m with is the least inefficient and annoying – which doesn’t amount to much (I’ve tried the others and left them for this one).

  13. Morning all.
    After all the publicity regarding the two ladies who met up for a walk in Derbyshire, and where sudsqently fined for their non conformist behaviour.
    BBC Country File last night could not have been more naive, but possibly deliberately crass in showing film (taken before lockdown I would guess) of some Bame (not my choice of phrase) females kitting them selves out with over elaborate costumes excessories and especially hairstyles to go walking in the woods with presenter Anita Rani. What on earth are the bbc up to ? Have they completely lost any reference to the current situation or are they deliberately trying to stir up further trouble. And I couldn’t watch the most recent Country File political agitation propaganda reported by Tom Heap.
    No wonder their calendars don’t appear to be selling this year.

    1. Good morning, Eddy. I had the misfortune to see part of Blue Peter In A Field yesterday evening, but was about to start throwing things when they started on the Bames and their general absence from the countryside. I left Mrs HJ to it…

      1. Morning Hugh, my after rant to my good lady was regarding the mass invasion of he Dorset coastline early last year when after these out door loving people chose to go home (after not being even slightly confronted by the police) They collectively left behind huge piles of their transported rubbish including bottled urine and even human faeces. And that wasn’t the only place they all arrived at in an obviously prearranged procedure.

  14. Good morning from a Anglo Saxon Queen with longbow and axe .

    A dull and miserable day today, I’ve not been awake for that long,
    the Saxon Queen has been waking nearly two hours later then she has always previously woken . Not sure whether its just winter, there must be the influence of lockdown too .

    1. I looked out not too long after daybreak and witnessed a superb red sky sunrise.
      Not good for shepherd’s so I believe.

      1. That sounds like a beautiful winter sunrise but not good for shepherd’s who prefer evening .

    2. ‘Morning, Ethel. You will have to do better than that if those pesky Vikings are to be kept at bay. Shape up or be slaughtered!

      1. Good morning Hugh . Indeed so, I shall sharpen my axe after I’ve eaten some porridge with banana’s, cinnamon and honey ( good Anglo Saxon breakfast ) and Picts but I shan’t mention them.

    3. Mentally, I suspect there’s an element of “Well, what the bloody hell is there to get up FOR?”.

      1. I could have killed our window cleaner when he rocked up at 9 am.
        He’s returning this afternoon; I think he sensed the vibes.

      2. I certainly feel like that. I wouldn’t have got up early this morning if I hadn’t been expecting a visit from the Occupational Therapy team.

    4. It would be very tempting to go into hibernation until May, when the days are much longer, if we were able.

    5. ‘Morning, Ethel.

      I’ve been up since 03.30. Once I’ve put the wheelie-bin out, I’m going back to bed.

      1. Good morning Mr Viking. Now that’s very early, we put our wheelie _ bin out the night before. Have a nice sleep, don’t let the bed bugs bite .

        1. Actually, a very kind neighbour puts my bin out with his before he goes to work at 7 am. All I have to do is to top it up with the latest rubbish. Then I put both empty bins away in the afternoon.

  15. 328382+ up ticks,
    Morning Each,
    Well the political close shop voters have certainly done a number on old Blighty this time,Mohammed row the boat ashore is still very much in vogue along with super trawlers
    running a scorched seabed campaign kicking off the Gordian
    knot via johnson & the “deal” put in place.

    The “deal” was the latch lifter, the shirt tail trapped in the
    brexitexit door.

    The order of the day currently seems to be ” GET OF THAT BENCH & DOWN ON ONE KNEE, NOW”

    1. 328382+ up ticks,
      O2O,
      Looks like the truth will set you free has changed to “had to flee” Og, it certainly does Boo Boo.

      It left town with common sense, integrity & self respect via the polling booth.

  18. Good Moaning.
    Done a quick scan through the DT and the DM. Just add them to the list of depressing items I don’t need in my life.

      2. Does the Hammer House of Horror still exist in the film industry? If so its talent scouts should try and recruit Whitty who could be type cast in a series of Evil Lizard movies.

  20. Despite the Scottish government’s optimistic statements about rolling out the vaccine, current claimed performance of 30,000 vaccinations a week means it will take over 3 years to vaccinate the population.
    However, all the assurance of it being taken to people in care homes etc seem to have fallen by the wayside. The Pfizer vaccine is not only required to be kept at -70 degrees, it apparently deteriorates if jostled around. As all the roads in Scotland are potholed and rutted, that does not look good. So people have to go to “centres”. Old, infirm people who have to queue in the cold.
    But that’s all OK. Our chums in Holland tell us it will be 7 years before they are all vaccinated at their present rate.

    1. The residents and staff at my wifes care home have all had the jab yet I’m not allowed to see her even through a closed window which IMHO is a step too far

  21. Just had a bit of a brainwave,

    The next time the students or some other loony left organisation does a protest march in Westminster, get a few of Tommy Robinson’s supporters all dressed us as wasters and let them into Parliament, film them shouting causing a bit of a nuisance and fake a couple of deaths on all the tv channels, film it weeks before, nobody will know.
    Then blame Kier Starmer for supporting it, have him tried for treason, ban the Guardian, the BBB and Sky tv from broadcasting, purge the North London Metropolitan Elites, lock them all up.
    Job done, country saved.

    1. Or just take taxis. There is some film of a pre-war PM getting out of taxi in Downing Street and then paying the cabbie. Changed days. They now travel in armoured cars with armed bodyguards and often an escort car with more bodyguards.

      1. Hmm. with Feargal’s idea of putting them all in electric cars, the additional armour plating means a flat battery on the trip from Downing Street to Parliament. Again, another good idea.

  22. Good morning, my friends

    I was wrong. I thought it was a stupid gimmick putting Ian Botham in the House of Lords. How wrong I was – I must eat a large slice of humble pie.

    His comments in this article hit many nails on the head and he has the personality and strength of character to make his voice heard.

    Country people are sick of the woke BBC
    It’s time the director-general delivered on his promise to rein in virtue-signalling presenters

    IAN BOTHAM
    11 January 2021 • 6:00am
    Ian Botham
    Since I joined the House of Lords, a lot of people have been writing to me about the BBC. They say that it is turning against them – that it doesn’t see them, let alone listen to them. But is my inbox representative?

    According to a new YouGov poll, the answer is clearly yes. It found that only 4 per cent of the public thought that the BBC had improved at representing their values during 2020. A staggering 33 per cent said it had become worse. This is an organisation in big trouble. Any business facing numbers like those would take drastic action.

    The BBC was doing particularly badly in the countryside, from where many people write to me. They dislike how the corporation increasingly uses its programmes to promote the narrow “woke” views of its senior staff. They say it abuses its power to push these “urban progressive” ideas as if they were mainstream.

    They are anything but.

    My correspondents are encouraging me to speak out on their behalf. So here goes. I direct this message to the BBC’s new Director-General, Tim Davie, who is a principled guy. He spends his holidays in the countryside, so I hope this strikes a chord.

    The top item on the agenda is the BBC licence fee, which people over 75 are being forced to pay. Many of this vulnerable age group live in remote areas and rely on the BBC – especially now that we are back in lockdown. Yet millions are having to dig into their pockets as the licence is now only free through means testing. This is causing no end of worry.

    The BBC promised that it would offer a free licence to over-75s. I urge Mr Davie to ensure it keeps its word. Our senior citizens do not deserve to be impoverished or frightened by demands from BBC tax collectors.

    Next is the small army of presenters who use their BBC profiles to push their political and social views. Mr Davie pledged to put an end to this abuse, but it hasn’t totally stopped.

    The most obvious example is Chris Packham, the BBC’s main countryside presenter. Correspondents say that it appears that he forgets instructions and keeps using “his BBC platform to promote his views”. Mr Packham even has his own lobbying company, Wild Justice, which regularly attacks the well-thought-through ways the countryside has been traditionally managed.

    His vitriol is extraordinary. He has called those who work on grouse moors “satanic”, “evil” and “psychotic”, and yet he claims that he “would never voice an anti-shooting agenda”.

    His BBC influence allows him to push his extreme anti-countryside agenda, and he has forced farmers and gamekeepers to change how they look after nature. One gentleman told me that Mr Packham “is the greatest threat to song birds and ground nesting birds that the UK has ever seen”.

    Mr Packham has more impact on rural policy than any government minister. He is a very effective politician dressed up as a presenter. His power comes not from being elected, but largely from his BBC role. This is wrong, and is costing the BBC its reputation. Without its patronage, he would not have anything like the influence he has today.

    Mr Packham is not the only one. James Wong, who has presented the BBC’s Countryfile, recently wrote on Twitter: “UK gardening culture has racism baked into its DNA”. Surely this is exactly the sort of self-promoting gibberish that Mr Davie promised to stamp out. Who runs the BBC? Is it Mr Davie, or the presenters?

    Country people have long been tired of this. Yet the BBC just mouths empty platitudes. It appears too big to reform.

    There is another unaccountable institution that Britain got fed up with. The European Union and its officials in Brussels made the mistake of thinking that we would always grin and bear it. How wrong they were.

    The BBC dominates our culture and political debate. But those I hear from feel it has lost its legitimacy and despair of it. Mr Davie must move radically and quickly if they are not to feel even more alienated from his urban woke-run corporation.

    Reform of the BBC is a key issue for 2021. I want to help more country folk to get their voices heard on this. I look forward to Telegraph readers’ online comments on the subject. And for those over 75 who are concerned about the BBC’s broken promise on the licence fee, drop me an email at lord.botham@gmail.com.

    1. A counterbalance to that pesky footballer?
      Also, if the BBC is too big to reform, it must be broken up and sold – or made subscription-only.

      1. Subscription only would be appropriate. The methods are there and well established. The problem is the BBC mindset cannot understand this concept of the audience as customer. It’s audience so far has been itself. Changing that premise and realising it now must actually entertain people who’s views it doesn’t hold might scare it a bit.

        After all Disney tried to follow the same woke agenda and lost billions. It’s recovering by small, indie projects created by fans, for fans. If the BBC continues to promote a Left wing agenda it will fall flat on it’s face. The media need to learn that the world isn’t like the one in their heads.

        1. The US model for NPR and PBS would be appropriate.
          Not subscription, anyone can listen / watch but when it comes to funding they have to appeal to the audience for funding.

    3. You are not alone, Rastus, in thinking that his peerage was a stupid gimmick. I, too, am happy to be proved wrong.

  23. Tom Hughes, paratrooper who served at the Battle of the Bulge – obituary

    He helped Belgian villagers to recover the bodies of young men shot in reprisal by the SS and later worked for The Daily Telegraph

    By
    Telegraph Obituaries
    10 January 2021 • 2:22pm

    Tom Hughes, who has died aged 96, saw action with the 9th Parachute Battalion (9 Para) in the Battle of the Bulge and the forced crossing of the Rhine.

    On Christmas Eve 1944 Hughes and his comrades in 9 Para were looking forward to their Christmas dinner the following day. Instead, he found himself sleeping on the deck of an old Isle of Man ferry bound for Calais and then travelling by lorry to Belgium.

    A week earlier, the Germans had launched a major offensive through the densely forested Ardennes which became known as the Battle of the Bulge. Hughes’s Christmas dinner, he said later, was a cheese sandwich.

    9 Para, part of the 3rd Parachute Brigade, established a blocking position on the River Meuse. In January 1945, Hughes’s Bn was the first Allied combat unit to reach the small Belgian village of Bande after the enemy had retreated.

    Here they learnt that German troops had arrived in Bande a week after the start of the Ardennes offensive and that on Christmas Eve 1944 all the male residents of Bande and the neighbouring village of Grune had been rounded up for questioning. Earlier, in September, three Germans had been shot by the Belgian Resistance.

    About 30 young men had been taken away by a unit of the SS and shot. Only one man had managed to elude his captors and escape into the woods. Hughes and his comrades helped the villagers to recover the bodies from a partly demolished house where they had been thrown.

    The soldiers placed the bodies in coffins which were draped with the Belgian flag. Some of them served as pall-bearers. Others joined the relatives in the funeral procession.

    Thomas Rhys Hughes was born at Ebbw Vale, South Wales, on May 24 1924. His father was a pharmaceutical chemist who worked at Boots. When he became manager of the branch at Upper Norwood in London, his family moved there.

    Thomas was educated at Dulwich College and subsequently served in the Home Guard before being called up and posted to the Royal Artillery. He volunteered for the newly formed Parachute Regiment and was near the end of a five-week course when he broke his foot in training and spent two months in plaster.

    As a result, he could not accompany 9 Para in the Normandy landings in June 1944, but this may have saved his life because the unit suffered heavy casualties in the attack on the Merville Battery.

    9 Para was relieved in the line in February 1945 and returned to England to reconstitute. On March 24 he took part in Operation Varsity, the daylight parachute and glider assault into Germany which forced a crossing of the Rhine.

    His stick was delayed because the green light failed and the first man refused to jump. That man was pushed out of the way by the adjutant who was next. The rest followed but they landed several miles from their intended drop zone.

    After landing in a field, Hughes was approached by a group of German soldiers who wanted to surrender to him. He waved them away, but when he joined up with the rest of his comrades he found that they had 30 prisoners between them.

    Having secured its objectives on the Rhine, 6th Airborne Division was ordered to push on across northern Germany to Wismar on the Baltic coast in order to prevent a Russian advance into Denmark. The Division marched 278 miles in 37 days, fighting numerous battles on the way. Hughes was involved in a number of 9 Para’s fierce actions, notably at Greven and Wissingen. On May 2 the Division reached Wismar, where they met forward elements of the Red Army.

    After the war Hughes went with the battalion to Palestine, where they were involved in internal security duties. In 1946 he was demobilised and joined South London Press as a district reporter.

    After working as a sub-editor at Reuters, he joined the Foreign staff at the Daily Mail. For 20 years, he worked for The Daily Telegraph, variously on the Foreign desk, as Commonwealth correspondent, night foreign editor and assistant foreign editor.

    This period was broken, between 1976 and 1980, for an unpaid sabbatical in the Solomon Islands, Western Pacific, as senior information officer. Hughes was also a freelance contributor to the BBC as well as national newspapers and magazines.

    In 1989 he retired, but until 2015 he produced the Pacific Island Society magazine, The Outrigger. He was an active member of the 9th Parachute Battalion Reunion Club, a group of veterans and their families who travel to Normandy every year to the Merville Battery, now a thriving museum. Until as recently as August 2020 he edited The Red Beret newsletter.

    In 1958 Tom Hughes married Pamela Lawrence, who died in 2018. He is survived by their three daughters. The youngest, Elizabeth, was appointed OBE in the 2021 New Year’s Honours List for services to humanitarian crisis operations.

    Tom Hughes, born May 24 1924, died November 8 2020

    Interesting BTL comment:

    Carolyn Pascoe
    10 Jan 2021 4:39PM
    John Radford… my 22 year old brother had a dreadful operation when he was 13. I was in awe of him as the surgeons in cardio thoracic had to saw into his rib cage. He could not be given morphine only ketamine which made him hellishly sick. He wanted no “babying” (and would rather have been on a ward without young kids). I remember how stoic he was coming home with drains still attached and just a small pack of Codeine for pain relief.

    He took himself of to California for a year studying 2 years ago. He did not come home for a year (unlike some of the pampered homesick few) but took himself off to Alaska at the coldest time of the year and smoked and drank beer with some real “old timers” whilst ice fishing. He travelled down to Columbia and then to Mexico and Cuba all on his own with a bit of money he had earned as a pot washer in a Restaurant. I have no doubt at all that if we moved my same beloved brother back to 1940 he would have done whatever was expected of him

    He was also addicted to Band of Brothers when he was 14 and took the whole boxset on a road trip around Europe with us. Our Dad took him to visit the US “La Messe” museum in Bastogne as my brother was in awe of those young men in the Airborne division and Marines.

  24. 328382+ up ticks,
    Paper tiger paper tiger talk, read “bleach” as whitewash.
    Remove ALL terror suspects & foreign paedophiles, get your
    fat, living of the peoples toil, political arses down to Dover and reverse the invasion fleets direction of travel.

    breitbart,
    ‘Operation Bleach’: Boris Johnson Orders the Removal of Any References to the EU in British Laws

    1. The easiest thing – and most obvious – is to reduce VAT to 10%.

      After all, we don’t need EU permission. The biggest problem is that VAT has probably collapsed due to a lack of sales so the ‘fairest’ tax would be the worst to reduce.

  25. As regards what appears to be an ongoing shambles at the border in respect of ordinary trading, some things are coming to light. For my part, having looked at eBay in Germany and France there are many more sellers now saying that they will not send to the UK, thus placing us on a par with Haiti and Paraguay.
    One French seller advised me that there are no small parcel delivery services or couriers accepting parcels for delivery to the UK, except DHL. Those not accepting parcels include La Poste, the French government-owned postal service.

    Delays at the border have cost Scottish seafood exporters millions. I link to an article on this.
    However, here is the highlight:
    “Scottish food exporters are paying the price of a “ludicrous” decision by the UK government to waive checks on imports coming into Britain from Europe but not ask the same of the EU, says the chief executive of industry body Scotland Food & Drink.”

    Taking this together with the insane new VAT arrangements (and perhaps still more “anomalies to come to light) one begins to suspect a deliberate vicious subversion of post-Brexit trading.

    https://www.eveningexpress.co.uk/fp/lifestyle/food-and-drink/brexit-week-one-was-bad-week-two-will-be-worse-warns-food-industry-chief-amid-export-hold-ups/

    2. My daughter wanted a wooden climbing frame for her daughter at Christmas, and spoke to several companies in Britain about delivery. At the time Nikeliar was in anti-English mode (when is she not!) and they all said that they could not deliver to Scotland! She finally got one in Germany and it was delivered in 3 days!

  26. Well said Grizzly. Good to see that the DT is publishing his letters again.

    SIR – John A Tallis (Letters, January 8) argues against a cull of rose‑ringed parakeets.

    Let us take his advice at face value: leave them alone and let them spread throughout the country. Who cares if they wipe out dull native species such as house sparrows, tree sparrows, robins, wrens, dunnocks, blue tits, great tits, coal tits, marsh tits, willow tits, chaffinches, bramblings, greenfinches, willow warblers, wood warblers, chiffchaffs and redstarts, along with the countless other small songbirds that bore Mr Tallis with their refusal to emulate Freddie Mercury?

    The introduction of non-native species (plant and animal) has always led to disaster.

    1. Yo mr t

      BLM Bird’s Lives Matter.

      Tha above also applies of course to the Lesser Spotted Brit

    2. Yo mr t

      BLM Bird’s Lives Matter.

      The above also applies of course to the Lesser Spotted Brit

  27. Techie question.
    Does anyone know the correct term for the piece of plastic that looks like an open-ended condom with a ring round one end that is in a loo system to muffle the noise of the water refilling the cistern?
    Ours has disintegrated, and looking through plumbing websites is not one of the best ways to spend a grey Monday morning. The exact name would (I hope) shorten the search.

      1. Thank you. Given the swathes of sites that appear once you enter that in your searches, MB should be silenced for the rest of the day.

  28. ‘Morning, all.

    So the gloves have finally come off. Following the lifetime ban of the still serving President of the United States by Twitter, the free speech platform, “Parler”, has been kicked-off the servers run by the neo-fascist oligarch cartel of Twitter (Jack Dorsey), Amazon (Steve Bezos), Google (Sundar Pichai), YouTube (Susan Wojcicki) and Apple (Tim Cook). In a clearly coordinated attack, “Parler” went down at midnight after being given just twenty-four hours notice of the withdrawal of its servers.

    “Parler” had grown enormously since its founding two years ago as folk became increasingly pissed-off with the arbitrary censorship exercised by Silicon Valley and it was the number one “app” on the Google and Apple stores. At one fell swoop, these tech giants are not only trying to suppress free speech, they’re trying to eliminate the competition. I’m afraid Trump left it too late – he should have initiated Anti-Trust investigations into these corporations years ago.

    Here’s a statement from John Matze, the founder of “Parler”.

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/e3dad12a240253cdd6506c97044516df13cb66c1318bca8eb1a7dbd69004779b.png

    1. We have to remember that Trump has been really limited in his FIRST TERM by the fact that half his Cabinet and much of the White House have been RINOs/NeverTrumpers and in Congress most of the Republicans were against him and hoping to replace him with Pence.

      At least far more people and organisations have now revealed their true colours.

      I await some dramatic action(s) over the next 10 days. My particular wish is to see the creation of a “re-education camp” for “Fact Checkers” .

      1. 328382+ up ticks,
        Morning LD,
        The only difference being the USofA had one political patriotic power player in Trump, where as the UK had NONE.
        The political GB governance party’s
        although acting as opposition to each were on the same rubber stamping side.

    2. I hope that by some miracle Trump gets re-elected in 2024 and sets about breaking up these companies in the same way that the oil companies and other giants were dealt with in the past.
      Ideally also ensuring that Draconian fines are levied on the likes of the Oligarchs so that they think a million is a huge amount of money to be left with.

      1. 328382+ up ticks,
        S,
        Won’t happen,same as in the UK
        the electorate in GB say the governance party’s will pay at the next GE, this pretendee tory party has been proving for years payback NEVER comes around, in fact quite the reverse happens.

      2. Just making them decide if they’re publishers – and therefore responsible for their content, or a platform, in which case they’ve no rights to withdraw services but also no liability.

        At the moment they’re getting the best of both worlds in censoring who they dislike while avoiding the consequences.

      3. I doubt he will stand again. I do hope a Republican candidate with his ability to talk to the ‘deplorable’ is chosen for the next election. But a candidate with higher level of eloquence and deeper understanding of how words can be interpreted.

        1. The problem they have is that to drain the swamp a complete outsider is required.
          Trump filled that role and it scared both sides of the swamp witless.

    3. In a further curtailment of freedom, it is reported today that the reason why Pelosi wants to impeach Trump is not because of the Capitol riot but because she hopes that it will prevent him from running for President again. So much for a democracy that I thought was supposed to give the voters a choice!

      How to describe Pelosi? An embittered socialist, long past her sell-by date. This witch should get on her broomstick and fly into oblivion – the USA would be a better place if she did!

      1. No surprise there. She’s been fighting him from the day of his election. Her spite and envy are towering. She’s a typical Lefty nutter.

    1. Perhaps we need to invent a new word for ‘champagne socialists’ to reflect the fact that they are communists at heart. But then, communism was only for the proletariat who were terrified and duped into submission while the leaders led the lives of the bourgeoisie.

      By the way, I wonder how Nick Clegg is doing, raking in millions while he obviously supports this censorship by Facebook. After all, he is Vice-President for Global Affairs and Communications, no less!

    2. The annoyance is that the ideal of socialism is quite nice. However, the to each his needs rather precludes the wants of the individual.

      This is where socialists and communists get very confused. They never factor in the human element. They just assume because they want it, everyone else will as well. However, the people who want it are often those who really want what other people have *earned* but don’t want to themselves.

      A capitalist looks at a rich man and says ‘how did you earn that, because I want the chance to.
      A corporatist looks at a rich man and says ‘who got you that rich, because I want some as well’
      A socialist says ‘You’re rich. I want to take it from you and give it to other people I deem worthy regardless of merit.’
      A communist says I want to take your wealth from you and control how you got rich.’
      A Marxist says ‘I want everyone in your company to be as rich as you are, by taking your money and giving it to them. If I divide your wealth equally, everyone is made richer’

      The only one that works is capitalism. The downside is that some people will always be richer than others. The real problem is our society is corporatist.

      1. A socialist is a man who will generously share his sixpence in exchange for your shilling.

        1. Or,
          What is a Communist? One who has yearnings
          For equal division of unequal earnings;
          Idler or bungler, or both, he is willing
          To fork out his penny and pocket your shilling.

          Ebenezer Elliott

  30. My most successful ever comment on a Daily Telegraph article (2nd most popular to the Trump Derangement Syndrome article):

    J G Gibson
    10 Jan 2021 10:33PM
    Will someone explain to both sides the shared iidentity I have with the many 1000s of women wearing a full burqa here in Birmingham, none of whom have ever shown even a 1 in a 1000 inclination to exchange a word of common cultural banter with me.

    Delete177Like
    Reply

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/01/10/restore-shared-british-identity-avoid-fate-trumps-america/

      1. From a different angle – I want to be aware of who hates me. From as far away as possible.

      1. What i find very disturbing Bill is recently, as we have two medium size free car parks in the village, and they are now almost full every day. Consequently there are hundreds of people crowding onto the local foot and bridle paths and the paths are usually fairly narrow. And it’s very difficult to avoid being less than the required distance away from others on the paths. Masks are not required in the open countryside. (yet)
        I struggle if i have to wear a mask for more than15 minutes at a time, too much carbon-dioxide leaves me with a severe head ache.
        My concern is that plod will turn up soon and start directing procedures, as in shut the foot paths paths down.

  32. Bitcoin down 16% since Friday, FCA warning that it could drop to zero, Has the bubble burst?

    1. I dipped in and out of Bitcoin. I bought two at £300 and cashed them in when they got to £8000 each. No need to be greedy. It’s the greedy ones that get burnt.

  33. Police in England and Wales face crime targets in return for 20,000 new officers. 11 January 2021.

    Crime will have to be cut by up to 20% under radical plans drawn up by the government and discussed with police chiefs, the Guardian has learned.

    Ministers want to bring down rates of homicide, serious violent crime and a whole host of other offences across England and Wales. The reductions would be in return for government providing the money for 20,000 new officers, about the same number cut since 2010 after the Conservatives slashed police budgets.

    Dross + Dross = Dross!

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/jan/11/police-in-england-and-wales-face-targets-in-return-for-20000-new-officers

    1. Homicide? Don’t they mean murder? Anyhoo…they will just pretend that crime is down by not reporting it.

    2. Now if the justiciary were to hand down very long sentences that might help. However the government would have to build many big new prisons and that is never going to happen.

      1. Commit ten murders here you get to serve ten sentences at the same time – -America – you get one sentence after the other, keeping them in jail

        Get a driving ban here and while banned get another one – it starts as the first one ends – why can’t they do it with serious crimes?

        1. Indeed. I’ve never understood the logic used by the judiciary in imposing concurrent sentences for unrelated crimes, as though they were somehow committed simultaneously. I mean, using their argument I could steal £10,000 from a bank, get nicked, and demand to be sentenced on the basis of stealing £1 with 9,999 other offences taken into consideration.

          1. I’ve never been able to understand how being drunk is often offered in mitigation for offences, in an attempt to get a more lenient sentence.

            “My Lord, this offence was completely out of character. Unfortunately, my client had taken more drink than was wise … “

            Wonder if that would work when you’re charged with “drink-driving”!
            ;¬)

      2. 328382+ up ticks,
        Morning HP,
        The way I see it for going forward,
        success guaranteed, is if we lock up the judiciary / politico’s.

    3. For a start they could deport the foreigners who deliberately come here to commit rape or murder, knowing that will enable them to claim they’ll face persecution ( for their crime here ) if they are sent back. What happens – they get rewarded with a free life here for their crime. I do NOT care what happens to these scumbags if sent back.

    4. Good Lord. I thought crime today was not wearing a face nappy or wandering through a field with a chum who stays 6 feet away from you.

  34. The following has nothing to do with Brexit or Trump:

    I used occasionally to meet a man by the name of James Wentworth Day. He died in 1983.

    I remember being with him shooting in Cambridgeshire and on one occasion in particular many years ago and arguing politics as was – and is – my wont. Mr Day put a hand on my knee – which worried me a little at the time – and said, ‘My boy, the country should be governed by dukes and bishops and farmers,’ to which there was no obvious answer.

    There’s a video of him being interviewed by Daniel Farson in 1958.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXZv7lH9Ehc

    1. I’m truly surprised the entire Woke Universe hasn’t gone into a complete meltdown with that one Geoffrey!

    3. Just as well he’s not still around, one evening of watching the current television output would have given him a swift heart attack.

        1. So much for save the NHS, all those ambulances lined up outside A&E with apoplectic fit sufferers

      1. They are owners of land and producers of food. He probably didn’t include the tenant farmers.

      2. Mr Day acted landed old money. As it happens, I have discovered that his father was a trainer’s secretary at Newmarket (who left £1506 2s. 2d in his Will) and his grandfather was a hairdresser and perfumier.

        1. I thought that would be it. None of that brash new money that comes from industry.

          Imagine though if a country was managed by a group who had interests way beyond the latest woke cause or winning the next election, so much would be different.

          Trouble is his mixed marriage speech will forever see any idea that he came up with being tagged as racist.

    2. According to Summit News, they are considering making wearing masks everywhere and possibly allowing everyone out just once a week. I’d love to know that will work, given how many people are now buying goods and especially food online. Who’s going to deliver it to them?

  36. Joe Biden and the special relationship: What his inauguration means for the UK and Brexit. 11 January 2021.

    Mr Johnson has said his congratulatory phone call with Mr Biden after the election went well.

    He said: “It was an excellent conversation that really flowed over all the things that have traditionally united the UK and the US.

    “It was a return to the kind of business that we’re used to doing together…sticking up for democracy around the world, human rights, free trade, Nato and our joint security.”

    Sticking up for Democracy! That’s a good line. They should join Xi and China. They have a lot in common!

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/0/joe-biden-special-relationship-uk-boris-johnson-what-means-brexit/

      1. ‘Others may hate you. But those who hate you don’t win, unless you hate them. And then, you destroy yourself.’ was his best. Reference the left in the UK, who Aneurin Bevan injected with a poison that is slowly destroying them.

        2. I think that today is the anniversary of her first solo flight from Hawaii to the mainland US.

    3. 328392+ up ticks,
      Afternoon AS,
      If this johnson plays his cards right as on nearly getting us out of the eu maybe he could turn his talents to talking china into taking us UK, on as a beijing province.

    4. It was an excellent conversation, so nothing important was discussed and anything controversial was glossed over.

      Back to politicians being politicians.

    6. I bet that one of the first things Biden attempts, as far as the UK is concerned, is to disrupt/cause trouble over NI and the EU.

      2. The handing over of NI to the EU was a de facto breach of UK sovereignty. We’d have been better just handing it all to Eire.

        2. As my colleagues in Belfast are very quick to remind me, strictly speaking Eire is all 32 counties so we ought to distinguish NI and the Republic. However, your use is still the most common.

          1. I know. I use Eire because it upsets people from the Republic. “Every little helps.”

      3. That senile old W⚓ Biden will soon step-down – or be pushed down – to spend the rest of his days gibbering in some elite nursing home, thus leaving Kameltoe Harris to assume the Presidency.

        Then the septics will have a full-blown Marxist in charge, which was always the Democrats’ plan. Then God help the free world.
        :¬(

        1. Harris herself is just the puppet of Pelosi and her House colleagues. Biden is the front man to get them through the door and to take any heat during the rest of the pandemic before departing the scene for ‘health reasons’.

        2. He will survive for the minimum time needed for Harris to be allowed to step up but not be prevented from standing for two more full terms, about two years I believe.

  37. JohRedwood on taking backcontrol today.

    The
    establishment media has been concentrating on the Dover Calais route
    and expressing concern that there were no lorry queues there on our
    first Brexit days. Where were all the programmes to look at our options
    now we are free? The BBC , ever willing to interview me when they
    thought Brexit was in danger, wanted no statements from me of all the
    things we can now do as an independent country.

    So let me
    have another go at reminding them what they are missing, and how they
    are failing to inform their viewers and listeners.

    We take
    back control of our taxes. The Tampon tax goes, and I want to see the
    back of the taxes on green products from boiler controls to insulation,
    from heat pumps to draught excluder. Why did the Remain media defend
    these taxes?

    We take back control of our farms. We can now
    offer grants and loans to promote more British food to high standards.
    cutting the food miles. We need to win back lost market share in
    everything from pig meat to flowers and from salad crops to dairy. We
    can now ban live exports of animals and raise our welfare standards by
    so doing.

    We take back control of our trade policy. We can
    now hope to join the mighty Trans Pacific partnership of large and
    growing economies and move through that to a US trade treaty, denied to
    us during 48 years in the EU running our trade policy.

    We can
    take back control of our fishing grounds. Immediately the government
    will ban pulse fishing which damages our fish stocks and marine
    environment. There now needs to be a big move to expand capacity of our
    fishing fleet ready for our full control at the end of a further
    transition period. We also need to attract more food processing and fish
    freezing businesses to support the trawlers.

    We can take back
    control of our industrial grants and subsidy regimes. All too often in
    the EU they used grants and subsidies to divert investment away from the
    UK or even to achieve closure of a UK factory to be replaced by a
    facility elsewhere. Now we can spend our money wisely on helping rebuild
    lost manufacturing.

    We can take back control of our Freeport
    and Enterprise Zone policy, creating many more around the UK as part of
    the levelling up drive without falling foul of EU rules.

    We
    can as a nation resume our rightful place on world bodies, with our own
    vote and voice to be a force for the good, for peace, prosperity and
    democracy.

    1. That would be nice, but the EU will not allow it.
      Had the government been serious about Brexit there would for example, already be grant schemes in place for fish industry (from catching to processing and selling), and the farming industry including grants for market gardens and greenhouses for tomatoes and the like.
      But wait, we cannot give state aid without the permission of the EU.
      The government has had four years to build fishery protection vessels and has not done so.

      1. The NHS has had over six months to organise a comprehensive vaccination campaign, but now claims it has not done so.

        I wonder why?

        1. The NHS has also had plenty of time to rectify the shortcomings highlighted by Operation Cygnet. Instead, we are locked down to “save the NHS” – and don’t get me started on the lunacy of keeping the borders open while locking us down!

      2. We are only at the beginning of discovering the full extent of Johnson’s betrayal and capitulation.

        Already there is misery in both Northern Ireland and in the fishing industry where Johnson’s completely lack of honesty and moral fibre are most apparent.

        And the stupid deceived public applauded this bragging charlatan as a hero!

    2. 328382+ up ticks,
      Afternoon JN.
      Plenty of “we can” no “We have’s” next manifesto,plenty of “we will’s” no “we have’s” still put in an extra promise,pledge
      vow will keep the ovis happy.

    3. There was a letter from a remainer in my local rag asking what we had gained by leaving. Where had the twit been not to have taken in the advantages of being in charge of your own destiny and free to make decisions that suit your circumstances rather than those of 27 others that have nothing in common with you?

  38. Restore a shared British identity to avoid the fate of Trump’s America. 11 January 2021.

    This is exactly the space in which democracy and social stability suffer, and populists and extremists flourish. Where there is no sense of community, there is no trust. Without trust, there is deceit, irresponsibility, corruption and criminality. There is no longer even truth. Alternative communities choose their own facts – these days spread online – and follow leaders regardless of social norms. This is how, without evidence, millions of Americans believe their election was rigged and the mob was right to storm the Capitol.

    TOP COMMENT BELOW THE LINE

    Douglas McCabe10 Jan 2021 10:20PM.

    What we are witnessing is the inevitable destruction wreaked by left-liberalism, that gives rise to identity politics, and the death of community and patriotism. Since 1960 I have heard nothing other than vicious attacks by left-liberals on all the institutions of our country. The feminists even went after the Boy Scouts and forced it to go all feminine and anti-male. Anything to squeeze maleness and masculinity out of a very honest and un-threatening way for boys to be schooled in simple skills and the desirable values of community.

    The feminists also set out to destroy marriage and the stable family – and succeeded. So, why would any British man feel anything but alienation from a country that has discriminated against him and his sons for half a century and more.

    And then the left-liberals became hell-bent on pushing for the further destruction of our nation by their pressure for Britain to move to open-border immigration and usher in multi-culturalism – the greatest curse on Earth, that has locked most countries into never-ending bouts of social conflict.

    This is liberalism in all its ugliness. The destruction of community and national pride and solidarity. For what? I’m still trying to figure that one out, but one thing is clear to me, and that is that there are no politicians among the pygmies who inhabit our Houses of Horrors at Westminster who have the faintest interest in doing anything to halt the anti-community mob that populates the Establishment of this country. Not one person who is able or willing to take on the vested interests of the Left-Liberal wreckers who run our education system, our media, our justice system, and all our cultural institutions.

    Morning everyone. Mr McCabe is spot on here and hasn’t fallen into the trap; unlike the author of the article, into imagining that all this can be fixed with a bit of Westminster Duct Tape. It took centuries of Struggle and Blood to make the UK into a coherent Nation State which has been undone by Cultural Marxism in just a score of years. Worse is to come!

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/01/10/restore-shared-british-identity-avoid-fate-trumps-america/

    1. Morning, Araminta.

      The author of the piece lost me in the first sentence when he/she linked extremists and populists.

      1. “Populist” is the intellectually lazy all-purpose pejorative of choice these days. When we were young, it was “fascist”.

    2. 328382+ up ticks,
      Morning AS,
      There is more than one virus in play here in my book, three more came over the horizon three decades ago and became more visible on a weekly basis in revealing their true colours.
      The real killer virus is of a political nature
      as in, the lab/lib/con coalitionvirus.

      The sure antidote lays NOT in the clinic but in the polling booth.

      Could very well be a bromide solution jab
      world wide, calms the ovis, more submissive etc,etc.

    1. The virus was the enemy. Looks like the people have taken that role now, in the eyes of the authorities.

    2. Patel really has turned out to be an awful disappointment. Weak where she should strong i.e. illegal immigration and now siding with the hawks on their repressive lockdown measures. Power and control, it would appear, are powerful stimulants for her whereas doing what the people demanded, and she promised to do, are ignored. Turned out as a typical politician, all talk and no desire to do the right thing.

        1. How does that explain away her disappointing behaviour? If anything it reinforces her lack of integrity and performance in doing what she promised. If she really believed what she said and then was barred from carrying out her promises she should have resigned. That would be the honourable thing to do and decent people would admire and support her action. Now, she is seen as just another politician who for personal position and gain is sticking with the herd supping from the trough.

          1. It doesn’t Korky, it only emphasise what the electorate and the rest of the general public are up against.

  41. I’ve had a surfeit of doom and gloom for now. I’m going to read my book and might return later.

    Bye for now.

    3. I’ve just had to go back to bed with a comforting hot water bottle and paracetamol, my back is giving me a lot of gyp today.

      1. Me too, nothing like a bottie….sciatica returns….too much sitting around doing F all. Finally booked app. with an osteopath…Friday. Sherry calls…

    1. Reform of the BBC is a key issue for 2021. I want to help more country folk to get their voices heard on this. I look forward to Telegraph readers’ online comments on the subject. And for those over 75 who are concerned about the BBC’s broken promise on the licence fee, drop me an email at lord.botham@gmail.com.

      Botham for Prime Minister!

      1. Morning, Araminta.

        However, I don’t agree. When Ian was made England captain he failed. He found his niche in the ranks as a swatter of wayward bowling. He is an excellent footsoldier but we need someone with more leadership acumen to run the country.

        1. He is an excellent footsoldier but we need someone with more leadership acumen to run the country.

          Quite agree, Grizz. Botham would be a great personality to rally around but a PM needs many other personal attributes that Botham lacks. He would need to find a party that would give him the political space to grow support. Lib/Lab/Con would use and abuse him.

  44. The more I see of Prof. Whitty I think we have been invaded by aliens….

    Lunch – toast, pate, chicken and sliced apple with redcurrant jelly…..and sherry.
    Jeez…I must be ill talking food….FFS.

    1. Who was that bloke who thought there were lizard people among us? Perhaps, looking at Witless, he wasn’t wrong?

          4. It would be quite impossible to make a Spitting Image puppet even closely resembling that face. Any attempt at one would be far better looking than the reality.

    2. He has very sinister eyes, the right more so than the left, similar to Tony Blair’s. The eyes most definitely have it.

      1. I remember bunking off school in the late 50’s to watch Sci-fi movies,,,how we all laughed…..we’re not laughing now

        1. What goes around comes around, Plum – just sometimes it takes a little longer but eventually karma will get you.

    1. I fear that sites like this will be used by the types discussed in the article to find and cancel people like us.

      Posts will be examined for wrong-think, going back years and doors will be knocked upon.

      We are already seeing things dragged up from many years ago from Facebook, to disqualify people from jobs.

      1. “We are already seeing things dragged up from many years ago from Facebook, to disqualify people from jobs.” Those instances really worry me, although I blame the potential employers who appear to be too spineless to tell the accusers to F-off.

          1. I’d heard that too, but wonder how often it happens in practice. Maybe for high profile roles.

          2. I’ve heard instances of it being done for Graduate entry schemes, that’s fairly low level stuff.

        2. Would you really want to employ someone who was so stupid that they posted crap on FaceBook. I certainly wouldn’t. I’d want to be employing someone with a lot more sense.

          The sort of crap it was wouldn’t matter – it’s the idiocy that does them out of the job.

        1. How long will disqus as a platform last? It might depend on whether the PTB want to keep track on subversives or leave a few places for people to let off steam, relatively harmlessly.

          We’re small beer.

    2. It is very scary, vvof. It appears that you can think what you like, say what you like and read and write what you like, but only if “they” approve! Otherwise you gat cancelled!

    3. Big tech companies always go the same route.
      1. The rise, new and interesting, offering a contribution.
      2. The ascent into invincibility, conceit and arrogance.
      3. The shift to irrelevance as the world moves away from them
      4. The decline into respectable un-importance.
      IBM, Microsoft, Apple, Yahoo have all gone this route, Twitter and Facebook will go the same way. Facebook is already gone because no one under 40 uses it, dead man but still walking. Twitter rose on its celebrity support, but they are butterflies and they will move on.

  47. All this doom and gloom, here is a good news story (well the police think so)!

    Montreal invoked a lockdown curfew at the weekend, no going out after 8PM. As a special treat the police announced that for the first few days they would only be warning homeless people for being outside, not issuing fines.

    Do they not think this through? It was minus ten last night, not many will have chosen a cardboard box over a room somewhere and I would bet that very few of the campers could pay any kind of fine.
    Then they wonder why the police are not respected.

  48. The roads are very quiet here in North Yorks and Sainsbury’s was quieter than normal. The snow has disappeared now and I am going out for a much needed bike ride now. My son in the USA has just heard that the Judge in a case which he was awaiting has been dismissed. He had to dismiss 4000 workers on the spot after being ordered to do so by the client. The construction of the nuclear power plant he was managing was stopped and mothballed. The judge decided that he had no other option. He had already been in court for this a few years ago and spent a day defending himself and his firm. My son retired early, in midsummer 2020. Being a Scotsman he is very unhappy about the dismissals and it has hung over him for several years. A few of the other parties involved have received prison sentences.

  49. Anybody else noticed the sinister similarity between Mark Zuckerberg and Mad Handjob? There’s something not quite right about them, something strangely non-human about their faces.

    Seems to me just the sort of disguise a lizard might adopt, if it wanted to pass for human. Maybe David Icke was right all along.
    :¬(

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/6c4bedabf6e7ef4774070d5a17e567c7450ad1aec12faa5200f4e2ab0ecedd06.jpg https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/fc6fc8c9cbcb1e120633f87d19224475589de712dda015d54cb26865731b6fb2.jpg

        2. In your years in the army did you ever take part in the Edinburgh Tattoo or any other ceremonial processions? I presume you play the bagpipes but if you did take part in the Processions were you at the front keeping the troops in order whirling the long ceremonial stick. I enjoy watching the local parades on the Facebook clips which appear here from time to time.

          1. I like watching the Youtube videos of the Tattoo especially the end where they march to the Black Bear as this takes me back to my RAF apprentice days. I always smile at the shouts of “Oi” at the appropriate place…..nothing changes

          2. Sadly, I don’t play the pipes, C, nor have I ever marched at the head of a ceremonial procession whirling a stick about.

            Never took part in the Edinburgh Tattoo either, but I’ve got one tattoo – my regimental badge (Parachute Regiment) on my upper right-arm, the result of taking too much drink one day as a very young “green-eyed” soldier in Aldershot!
            ;¬)

    5. Why are ALL oligarchs and multi-billionaires incredibly ugly?

      Is it a mere coincidence or is there some blood connection?

      2. When you are that rich you don’t need to be attractive to attract women.

        Just look at lottery winners are suddenly found by the love of their life.

        1. If a middle-aged schoolmaster of only moderate means can get a lovely young woman like Caroline to fall in love with him and marry him then there must be hope for everyone!

  50. On the subject of tighter restrictions the maximum number of people who can attend a wedding in Scotland is 5. The Scottish government could hardly cut that number as that is the legal minimum: the celebrant/registrar, the couple being married and the two witnesses required by law.
    I was speaking to a young lady last week. Her wedding had been planned for May last year and was cancelled. It is now planned for May this year. She lives on a farm and they have arranged a marquee. They intend to go ahead regardless. I suggested that instead of a “moonlight flit” that they have a “moonlight wedding”.

  51. Good morning from a dull but so far dry Derbyshire with a rather mild 2°C in the yard.
    Well done to Grizz for getting his letter past the DT censors!

  52. Fears of NEW Beast From the East bringing winter chaos to Britain as Siberian air plunges across western Europe – with forecasters warning of daytime highs of -5C spreading across the continent. 11 January 2021.

    Forecasters have seen Sudden Stratospheric Warming event in the stratosphere above the Arctic.

    An SSW can reverse the jet stream below and plunge UK into polar temperatures coming from the east .

    The Beast from the East in 2018 hit the UK with snow blizzards and temperatures as low as 14C overnight.

    I don’t know where we would be without Global Warming!

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9132131/Fears-NEW-Beast-East-bringing-winter-chaos-Britain.html

    1. Don’t forget, Araminta, that I will cop that ‘beast’, with full force, before you do. ☹️

      2. Was practising at the weekend over here. Warmed up to -16C at Firstborn’s farm. Thank God for log fires.

      1. A bit of cold is good. Kills a lot of the slugs and other unwanted (also wanted, of course) bugs.

        1. Despite the recent cold, I noticed this morning that my roses & clematis are pushing out new green shoots.

          1. I think plants timing goes with length of daylight rather than temperature, but I can’t be 100% sure of that. Open to correction.

          2. Yes, they do to a certain extent, but weather has the final word.
            In this country, frogs’ breeding rituals are initiated by length of daylight; they begin during February. But if there is a very cold spell & all their ponds are frozen over, they can’t breed.

    1. Re the DM reply: because they want to see how long she survives after having had the vaccine.

        1. Perporting to be this year. But how are we to know when it was filmed ?
          I took it to be more scaremongering.

          1. Possibly true, I know someone whose father died before Xmas but can’t be cremated until Jan 21st due to backlog

          2. They seem to routinely take several weeks these days. My cousin died on Chriatmas Day (in 2016) and her funeral was 19th January.

          4. About three weeks for MIL last November.
            That was a cremation with no funeral service beforehand.

          6. That happened to my mother in 2013. She died on 25 Jan but wasn’t cremated until late Feb for the same reason. A huge backlog.

          7. Round here, there’s anywhere from a fortnight to month before a funeral. Christmas and New Year wouldn’t exactly speed things up.

      2. For photographic purposes, no doubt, before shifting them on to the normal resting places

      3. A normal winter sickness season can be built up to be the plague of the century in the media. We will only really know when we get the numbers of overall deaths from 2021 – and that will probably be raised by the number of neglected cancer patients!

  56. Vaccine scepticism in France reflects ‘dissatisfaction with political class’. 11 January 2021.

    Then came the Mediator scandal. The diabetic drug, widely but wrongly prescribed to those seeking to lose weight, was linked to between 500 and 1,200 deaths over more than three decades.

    Mediator’s manufacturer, Servier, was accused of charges including manslaughter, and 12 people ended up in the dock in a criminal trial last year, including officials who were also paid as consultants of pharmaceutical companies. The company and the individuals charged deny wrongdoing. Judgment is expected in March.

    This is interesting because it shows how long delayed may be the consequences of a faulty inoculation. As we all know the covid vaccines have been rushed through and it is not impossible that dire results may appear some way down the road.

    https://www.theguardian.com/global/2021/jan/11/vaccine-scepticism-in-france-reflects-dissatisfaction-with-political-class

    1. Which is exactly why I will forego my jab and donate to Matt Halfcock or Whitless or Liberty Vallance – he deserves a shot!

      2. When Mrs N was working for local Doctors, She assisted at the flue jab clinic givng up to 40 people a time the flu jab. not one of the Doctors had it.

        2. What did they tell the patients who asked though? 🙂
          One reason why my children had the MMR some twenty years ago was that my doctor said her children had had it. There was a bit of worry over it at the time. From what I have read since, it isn’t 100% safe, but still less risky than the illnesses it protects against

  57. Dinner [at dinner time (1300hrs): if you don’t believe me, ask a school dinner lady]:

    Cottage Pie. I’ve researched dozens of recipes, from famous chefs on the internet, before deciding that my own recipe knocks all theirs into a cocked hat.

    It were yum!

    2. Tend to eat Shephards Pie . Add a little cinnamon to it and i grate Cheddar cheese onto the mash. I’ve not made a Cottage Pie but have made a pie with cubes of braising beef
      with dijon mustard, onions and carrots in the gravy with a garlic mash.

      1. I also like Shepherd’s Pie (when I can get hold of lamb: not easy in Sweden).

        I sweated two finely chopped onions in a little lard, when soft I added two finely chopped cloves of garlic. I removed them from the pan then browned 500g beef mince. I then added some thyme, celery salt and black pepper before adding a whole can of Italian plum tomatoes. I cooked this slowly to reduce the liquid before adding the cooked onions and garlic and two tablespoons of Geo. Watkins’ Mushroom Ketchup.

        After I’d place the cooked mince into the dish I topped it with buttery mash and then grated cheddar cheese on top of the mash before baking it at 200ºC for 25 minutes. I served it with runner beans and steamed cauliflower.

          3. To pad out the meat, I add chopped leeks, squash, kohl-rabi, peppers, celery, celeriac…anything that isn’t leaves! All fried up in goose fat.

        2. …when soft… – is that when adopting an accent that uses words like clarse and grarse for class & grass?? ;-))
          Looks good, Grizz

        2. When I was young in the days with mum and dad that I didn’t value enough, we had breakfast, dinner, tea and supper was a bedtime drink with a snack.

          2. Me too, Sue. Supper was an occasional bonus.

            Funny thing was, with dad working a three-shift system mealtimes fluctuated. If he was on early shift or nights we would have dinner at teatime. He had his dinner at dinner time before going to work on afternoon shift.

            If it was school holidays mum would prepare a light snack at 1:00 p.m. and tell us that we would be having a light ‘lunch’ instead of dinner. To her, the word ‘lunch’ signified a light snack, never a proper meal.

          3. That is the correct use of the word “lunch.”
            We usually have dinner in the middle of the day because I don’t eat in the evenings. Fritefly common!

        3. Not quite.

          My father worked on a farm so
          breakfast was at some ungodly hour before the cows were milked.
          lunch was when we had a meal before going to school
          dinner was served by the dinner ladies at school
          and tea was at tea time.

          1. Most of the dairy farmers I know go out on a cup of tea/coffee and quick slice of toast. Breakfast is a cooked meal… after milking.

            I seldom eat breakfast nowadays, it just doesn’t taste the same unless you’ve done a couple of hours of outdoor manual labour beforehand. Back in the day I could devour 2 duck eggs and either cereals, or large quantities of toast (or sometimes both)… and I stayed thin.

      3. Breakfast, elevenses, luncheon, afternoon tea, canapés, 16 course dinner, supper, midnight snack – and my great-grandparents were still hungry!

    4. We’ve just had dinner.
      Carbonnade of Beef that included carrots, potatoes and parsnips served with braised red cabbage and sprouts. Lasted 3 days i.e. 6 meals.

        1. Salmon Teriyaki for supper tonight. Some spinach and steamed Newish potatoes. Bottle of Chablis. Oh…and a fur coat.

          5. When we were in China with a tour group one of the members was an old China hand and fluent In what I assume was mandarin.
            When we went to the local stop-off points to eat he would always have a discussion about the food. We had one time when he and the owners got into a very agitated debate. When we asked him to explain he said he was telling them not to add bear paws to whatever it was that we were being served.
            A very interesting trip on a number of levels.

    6. Peasant food doesn’t follow recipes. What you have goes into it, in proportions you like.

      1. I asked my Jamaican friend, Willie, once for a recipe from his wife. “Naa, man, her don’t do recipes: it’s aal in the head. Her know how much to put in!”

        1. MOH used to cook like that and it always turned out well. Me, I’m an “eek! there’s a fraction of an ounce too much of that” person who can’t do anything without the book of words 🙂

    7. Or 12:25 for the first sitting. Our school couldn’t get everyone into the dining-room at once, so you had early or late lunch.

  58. O/T. It’s not the polling station that risks the spread, it’s the count. I have attended more than 30.

    1. They won’t be bothering with counts in the future. The result will be known before the election takes place.

          1. If they’re good enough for that nice Mr Biden and his attractive carer, they’re good enough for me.

    2. I think I ought to cook a pot of that! Just before Christmas, I rather rashly bought a kilogram of a locally made blue cheese. It is very nice, but there is rather a lot of it!
      Does anyone have any other suggestions for cooking with blue cheese?

      1. Blue cheese also is very nice with pasta. Melted together with cream and butter
        ( not very healthy, mind you, a treat ). Its nice stuffed in chicken and which is the wrapped in pancetta .

        1. My family will freak at how unhealthy the pasta dish is, then gobble it up and ask for seconds!

        1. Not sure I fancy that. I like the cheesiness of those dishes. I’m thinking more of combining it with meat or vegetables.

          2. Yes, but it’s in a supporting role to the cheese in cauliflower cheese, in my opinion. I love cheese! The two dishes you mentioned are already perfect in their plain forms.

  60. Chris Whitty: NHS is facing its most dangerous moment ever. 11 January 2021.

    The NHS is facing the most dangerous moment in its history with the situation likely to get worse, England’s chief medical officer has warned.

    Professor Chris Whitty said the coming weeks would be the most critical point of the pandemic, with the number of Covid-19 patients in hospitals reaching 32,294 – more than double the total at the peak of the first wave.

    How is this “dangerous”? Is it going to explode like a Nuclear Weapon? Is it going to run amok in the streets? Medical facilities have often been overrun with a surfeit of patients requiring treatment. Wars , famines, and yes epidemics, are regular examples. Medical staff must just carry on as they have always done! The very worst that might happen is that patients will have to be triaged.
    .
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/01/11/prof-chris-whitty-nhs-dangerous-moment-ever/

      1. What a country we now live in! Such a thing would not even have been imagined twenty years ago!

          1. 328382+up ticks,
            Afternoon Atg,
            It has taken time to construct a near perfect
            country destroying disaster
            via the polling booth.

    2. Its ALL about the NHS never the people. The NHS should never have been made into a God. The managers have used it to do nothing. What actual planning and preperation have they done to deal with a pandemic. looks like nothing at all.

      1. Your lot have done more than our equivalent, they are still working out who needs to be vaccinated. Thankfully they have had about nine months notice that a vaccine is coming or they would still be pushing flu vaccinations.

        It gets me when they call in the army to manage the situation, suddenly “it can’t be done” becomes quite doable. There has to be a message there for who should be managing the country.

        1. I think that in most cases you get decent service from the health services.

          What would be bad is the US system if you cannot afford health insurance and do not qualify for Medicaid. My wife is friends with someone in Idaho, the friend had an operation a few months ago and is now struggling with the financial repercussions.

          1. There are far better functioning social healthcare systems in other countries though, like France, Germany, Austria.

        2. The NHS has its flaws, like any other big organisation, but when you really need it, it usually comes up trumps (oops, perhaps that is the wrong word).

        3. The register of my family is:
          My elder brother – died due to an NHS mistake
          My mother – died due to a mistake during NHS treatment
          Me – chronic illness not diagnosed until I paid for private treatment
          You have been luckier than most if you don’t have similar tales to tell. Most NHS fans have simply not experienced a properly functioning healthcare system, so they have nothing to compare it to.

  61. Youngher people still have to learn that freedom comes at a price. At times you have to “fight” for it.

    1. Time for a quote. Jefferson. “The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure.”

      Edit: punctuation.

      1. As obviously this whole thing is our fault for even existing, Bertolt Brecht has the solution.

        “Some party hack decreed that the people

        had lost the government’s confidence

        and could only regain it with redoubled effort.

        If that is the case, would it not be be simpler,

        If the government simply dissolved the people

        And elected another?”

      1. Bulls grow bigger than steers. Stallions grow bigger than geldings. Tups grow bigger than wethers. Testosterone is a big influencer of growth.

        Why would castrated cats grow bigger than entire ones? Have to say that, in my experience, they don’t.

    3. OI! GUS! PICKLES! HIDE! HE’S GOING TO CUT YOUR BITS OFF TOMORROW! DON’T SAY YOU WEREN’T WARNED!

    3. Plod taking a bit of a chance there. They should’ve handcuffed him – what if he’d have turned violent?

      1. Hi Geoffrey.

        Of course he is, but one can still enjoy a harmless joke at his expense.

          6. The problem for Boris is that people are so fed up that we’re well past the making jokes stage. Even with Whittless, the jokes have a serious tone to them in the background – I believe it is called ‘dark humour’.

      2. I despise the man.
        He’s taking enormous pleasure from his 15 minutes of fame and he’s secure in the knowledge that it is almost impossible to prove whether he is right or wrong as far as the virus itself is concerned. And he knows that the Government can’t be shown to have been wrong.
        Wrecking the economy, ruining people’s lives, harming young people’s education, shortening the lives of many who will have diseases that could have been put into remission increasing suicides/domestic violence, divorce rates likely to rise.

        And why?
        To save a few of the old and already very ill, who were in all likelihood at death’s door anyway.

        2. And all the while, of course, he is totally secure in his own job and future gold plated pension. No furlough for him or loss of employment, no sirree.

          3. He does have the look of a death head. Many years ago I remember seeing “To serve them all my Days” on TV and the actor playing the Headmaster prior to … oh blast I’ve forgotten his name … anyway the penultimate Head just comes to mind. Lovely book.

        3. Sos ,

          I will stick my neck out here , and I accept I will be pilloried .

          Whitty is doing his best in the worst circumstances . Some one has to stand up and speak , damned if he can damned if he can’t.

          The rules shouldn’t be loosened , but the British do what they want , we are not like countries in Europe where protestors get walloped and really controlled .

          People in the UK scream that their freedoms have been compromised , and there they are , protesting , clearing off on holiday , roaming the country in their camper vans , giving lunch to Grandma , drinking like crazy , hold parties , raves, play football, clear off to the countryside the beaches , shop as if shopping is going out of fashion and carry on with life as normal .

          You should have seen the day trippers in this part of the world during the New Year.

          The Labour party and some of Corbyns pals don’t follow normal procedures and seemed to have been encouraging rebelliousness.

          Who on earth would have you all preferred to give out strong messages .

          I think the NHS is a rumbling crumbling machine , autocratic , disorganised and the penpushers , for all their huge salaries don’t seem to have got a clue how to roll out this vaccine ..

          The lists have been left too late , they should have got priority patient lists together in the summer .

          Small rural surgeries are having to cope with a logistical nightmare .

          The British do NOT adhere very well to rules .. and common sense appears to be lacking .

          We are in a critically deteriorating situation , and poor young Professor Whitty knows it.

          2. You are correct that some poor sod has to do it, because that is the Government’s response and it needs its “Mouth of Sauron”.

            To me it appears that he is relishing what he is doing.

            He and the government have followed only one course of action in varying degrees. Lockdowns. They have refused point blank to accept or apparently even consider the advice of other experts, many much better qualified than those on the Sage committee and all the other committees with their silly acronyms.

            ALL the evidence so far shows that the worst hit are those at the end of their lives and that younger fitter people have very little chance of suffering serious reaction, let alone dying of this disease.

            And as to commenting on the NHS, small rural surgeries etc. etc, if the Government’s chief medical officer isn’t partly responsible for it, who is? And don’t tell me it’s just a recent appointment, I accept he’s not been long in charge but he’s been an advisor and been hand in glove with Ferguson for at least a decade.

      4. I wasn’t aware that he had any admirable charteristics. You should check out Carl Benjamin’s interview of James Delingpole – who went to the same school as Whitty, and he didn’t think much of him back then.

        Given Whitty’s actions, he deserves to have the mick taken out of him. Perhaps he should put himself in the shoes of ordinary people before trying to force the government into doing as he wants, especially as he appears to not understand the implications of effectively ruining the economy and thus everyone’s future for the sake of saving relatively few lives.

        Many people appear dutiful. It doesn’t mean they are up to the job or don’t have an agenda contrary to the common good – especially over the long term. Over the years, I’ve dealt with my fair share of scientists and clinicians, and whilst the vast majority are very accomplished in their field, they have far less of an appreciation of the Real World, because the nature of their work is very narrow by definition.

        That the SAGE members seem to know or care little about the longer term effects of their ‘policies’ is rather telling. Don’t they realise that in all likelihood, far more people will die from lost livelihoods, the effects of a severe decline in mental health and freedoms than from the virus itself – which by their own admission has only killed about 400 otherwise healthy people under the age of 60. perhaps these ‘experts’ (including from the NHS/PHE etc) should’ve put far more effort into proper procedures to reasonably protect the vulnerable without ruining everyone else’s chances in life.

        I think it was a huge mistake for SAGE etc to be given so much credibility and power without, for example, economists, physchologists and other experts from other fields, as well as government ministers themselves to weigh in, rather than just forcing ideas on ministers with a threat to go to the media or, it seems, Labour, if they weren’t followed to the letter.

        Each argument from each set of experts should never have been taken in isolation – they need to be weighed up dispasionately by ministers in the presence of those others at the same time as other concerns.

      2. I suspect that they are being very careful about what is released.

        If people start to question whether saving Granny is worth allowing baby Jane to die, they will be in serious trouble.

  68. Anyone shocked by the US Capitol attack has ignored an awful lot of warning signs. 11 January 2021.

    Let’s be clear: the Biden-Harris administration has exactly four years to repair some large part of the damage that’s been done – a short time to begin a massive and necessary project. Otherwise, these violent groups are going to rehearse, retry, recoup, try again and again – until they succeed. With or without Donald Trump, the violence, if it ever goes away, will come roaring back. Lawmakers like Josh Hawley, loudly voicing their objections to the 2020 election results, are already campaigning for the job of anti-democratic dictator in 2024. Unless some substantive changes are made – something more sweeping than the middle-of-the-road policy tweaks that seem to be in the offing – the next coup attempt may very well succeed.

    It wasn’t a coup, or even an attempt at one. That would require armed men on a vast scale and the neutralisation of the Military and Civil Forces. The writer is correct that they will be back but one suspects in a mutated form. This is because the demonstrators represent something much larger and more powerful than themselves. The voices of all disenfranchised Americans. Trump did not create them but gave them a voice on the national stage. The next one to harness their power and beliefs will probably be much smarter and more effective and will probably win!

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jan/11/us-capitol-attack-warning-signs-charlottesville-michigan

      1. They are probably lucky that the vast majority of serving and ex-military officers are either Republican voters or at least more centrist Democrats who don’t support the likes of Pelosi, Schumer, The Squad, CNN, etc, etc. It shows how derranged they (those Dems in charge) have got that they set their cap against an otherwise excellent presidential candidate in Tulsi Gabbard (whom I wouldn’t have feared had Trump lost to her) – especially as she is military.

    2. Its the Guardian!

      The establishment will be closing ranks now, making sure that no outsiders ever get a chance at Power. The talking heads may still be going at each other in congress but there will be chatter behind the scenes that is aimed at closing the loopholes. For a start I could see them demanding many years party membership before allowing someone to run

      Just ask ogga about the established parties in the UK.

      1. Just look at their chums in Big Tech and the financial industry now trying to permanently silence the political Right by simultaneously deplatforming many people, independent platforms (including Twitter’s main rival) and organisations.

        Those on the conervative right who recently bent the knee to keep their cushy jobs in the media may well get a temporary stay of execution, but I doubt if it will be a long one. Then they will come for anyone protesting at the loss of freedoms and free speech, whether they are right, centrist or centre left.

        1. This stranglehold on todays communication is extremely worrying, you just need the real left Dems like AOC to get some leverage in formalising controls that the unelected california mob interpret.

          The left in Canada are talking about banning Prod Boys, I don’t agree with the Proud Boys but as long as they don’t start pushing illegal acts, let them speak – I can always ignore them .

          It will be interesting to see if Trump can do anything this week to shut the social media sites down or at least issue an executive order imposing harsh restrictions that effectively shut them down.

      1. There never is.

        One thing that amused me about the Capitol “invasion” was Pelosi saying how they had to hide and how terrified they all were.
        Now she has a tiny inkling of what it feels like for a small business’s owners, when BLM come for a spot of looting and arson.

    4. My namesake has the right idea

      THREAD: I refuse to remain silent. My name is Vernon Jones, I am an outgoing State Representative in Georgia, a lifelong Democrat and the newest member of the Republican Party. (1/9)— Vernon Jones (@RepVernonJones) January 8, 2021

    5. If it was a coup (and it was not), it was the worst one ever. On the other hand, Pelosi going well beyong her powers in demanding the president’s executive authority (on the nuclear deterrant) be ignored on her say so certainly can be.

      If anyone is unhinged and needs removing from office, I’d say it’s her.

      1. Pelosi is a nasty piece of work and seems to be scared of Trump and what he might have on her. Her maiden name suggests a mafia connection. Hence the undue haste to remove Trump from office.

        Far worse scenes inside the Capitol
        have been perpetrated by disgruntled Democrats. Pelosi was almost certainly behind the Antifa led breach. Likewise the widespread looting and arson throughout 2020 in Democrat run cities such as Portland and Minneapolis is a truer indication of the evil that the Democrats embrace.

      2. I think the “coup” in Turkey against Erdogan was even more badly organised! That said, most of the perpetrators subsequently disappeared!

        1. It was a scam created by Erdogan to see who was against him. Then – when he realised just how bad it was, he arrested them all.

          Know your enemy.

      3. Pelosi should have been put out to pasture years ago, she just reinforces the dem / rep divide.

        All she is doing is playing politics to beat up on the republicans, there is now no stopping her.

    6. Of course it wasn’t a coup! Violent groups have been rioting and carrying out wanton destruction in nearly all states ever since the George Floyd episode. The culprits were nearly always Antifa and BLM, the latter being a far-left organisation with little to do with black lives, as can be confirmed by those who research its founders and its financial supporters. They were all vehemently anti-Trump, of course.

      Mr Biden says he wants to bring the country together. No hope of that with him in charge, I’m afraid! As you say, they will be back.

  69. The Saxon daughter of Alfred of Wessex shall at 4.30 be toasting crumpets upon the open fire ( very dark ages ) . She’ll have them soaked with slightly salted butter . And a pot of Assam tea ( lose leaf) . All very civilised.

      1. Toasted crumpets are one of the nicest things about winter. I sometimes like to place Cheddar cheese upon them and grill them until the cheese melts.

        3. I bought some crumpets (also known as pikelets) the other day and today I bought some muffins. I have rediscovered the joys of tea time.

    8. Before lockdown I invited a friend to tea; we had toast done over an open fire with lashings of butter and home-made jam. That’s something I’ll be willing to repeat any day 🙂

  70. Even more problematic than normal nurse to patient ratios becoming unsustainable is the news that patients are being required to tolerate blood oxygen levels of between 88% and 94%.

    Vital sign monitors are set to alarm at defined extremes which in the case of
    my Oximeter (and representative of hospital monitors) the default values are illustrated below:

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/6ee042aa81d30406fe2d858b5300466d5d13923a209fdff34f23105c60e88a9d.jpg

    One issue which is not often appreciated is Alarm Fatigue which is prevalent in any critical ward where a patient’s vital signs are unstable leading to excessive required attention to ensure avoidance of a relapse into cardiac arrest.

    The lowering of blood oxygen level targets to between 88% and 94% is going to put extra strain on the already overworked nursing staff leading to the inevitable the risk of higher mortalities.

    This is a time to avoid hospitalisation at all costs.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/01/11/hospitals-oxygen-supply-critical-level-due-surge-covid-patients/

        1. No Angie I didn’t miss it. Your last sentence implies that there will be times when hospitalisation is ok. My advice keep taking the apples! 😉

      1. Some hospitals are running out of oxygen supplies required for nasal catheters and ventilators required for increasing numbers of COVID patients.

        Aa ponted out on BBC news tonight a patient with a blood oxygen level between 88 and 94% would be considered for referal to hospital for oxygen assistacnce.
        With such low oxygen targets there would be no point in such a referal.

        2. Heh, mine dropped to below 80 during my clots. I’m tough! If tough is not being able to stand up and having to stop at the bottom of the stairs just to breathe.

          1. Blood oxygen levels in COVID patients are being observed to be far below those normally deemed aceptable in a hospital setting.

            However, whilst COVID patients are kept in a prone position and are not requred to climb stairs there is a limit to which the heart can compensate for the loss of lung function even with oxygen supplementation.

            Unfortnately the way in which COVID systemically promotes clotting inhibits the compensatory mechanisms of the human body.

    3. When in hosp over my blood clots the bloke beside me started convulsing and then wet himself, swiftly followed by pooing.

      I pressed my alarm (as moving meant walking with the blood thinner drip and, well, walking when I couldn’t stand) and … no one came. Bloke opposite pressed his and we waited as this bloke shook himself practically off his bed. More mobile chap opposite eventually had the foresight to lift the safet barriers to help the guy and tried to get a nurse himself only to come back saying they were busy.

      I appreciate they have a lot to do, but you buzz the alarm because you need help.

  71. My husband is about to start a zoom course on the Russian Revolution
    this coming Thursday. During the weekend I reminded him that whilst at university he did his dissertation on the Russian Revolution .. he said he didn’t but something similar. This morning he found many notes produced in his student days.
    I remarked upon his outstandingly beautiful and elegant hand writing, it looked as if a scribe produced the words, but it was how he wrote, the letters were exquisite upon the page.
    He still as nice handwriting but not quite like his student days. It made me think about the
    handwriting of students today, do they really care, especially as most writing is done via computer. The gift of beautiful handwriting might already be lost.

    1. I scribbled my lecture notes in my own shorthand, which I invented, based on grammar, because Pitman was too difficult with a ballpoint.

      These days, I’m sometimes mystified by my own shopping lists.

      1. I could never get to grips with Pitman’s shorthand. At the end of the year, I could still write faster in my own version of rapid note taking.

        1. I studied Pitman after I graduated, then after I retired, I thought I’d revive it as something to do; I got up to about 95 wpm, but never could break the 100 barrier. My writing got larger the faster I had to scrawl 🙁

    3. Up to the time when my mother died aged 105 she had exquisite handwriting, she’d won prizes for it when at school in the early 1900s and the skill had never left her

      1. How wonderful and a grand age too. I think people just took more care of things such as handwriting once. Its such a delight to see beautiful writing.

  72. Apols if this has already been posted:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/01/11/enough-governmental-scapegoating-public-covid-transmission/

    “Enough of this Governmental scapegoating of the public for Covid transmission

    It is the virus itself which is to blame – we are just the victims

    11 January 2021 • 12:14pm

    How much easier it is to blame the general public for flouting the rules than to admit that lockdown is a failed experiment in suppressing an infectious disease. Point to a photo showing people apparently crowded on a beach or in a park – actually taken with a telephoto lens to make it seem they are much closer than they actually are – call them ‘covidiots’, and you can try to avoid facing up to the reality that a modern industrialised society with high levels of inter-dependence simply can’t be locked down to the level it would need to be to suppress Covid 19, at least not the new, more transmissible strain.

    Every minister and scientific adviser interviewed over the weekend spun the same yarn: it’s all the public’s fault. You are not taking this seriously enough. If you don’t all change your behaviour then there’s an even tighter crackdown coming. Yet aside from a 25-strong football game that was stopped in East London on Sunday I have to read a report of any substantial breach of the rules. People are walking in parks because they have been told they are allowed to take daily exercise. In any case, as Chris Whitty admitted on the radio this morning, the chances of picking up the virus from a passing jogger are vanishingly small – it is indoor transmission where the real risk lies.

    Yet for many people it is impossible to avoid others in confined, indoor settings. It is easy to point your finger at people in crowded tube carriages; you shouldn’t be condemning them without know why each of them were travelling. Among them will have been healthcare staff, workers in food production and distribution, vital maintenance engineers needed to keep the lights on and the water running. Vulnerable people have to be cared for – although it would have made a huge difference if hospitals had not discharged patients, untested, into care homes early on in the crisis and care homes stopped doing as one in Middlesbrough was caught doing: demanding workers report for duty even if they have tested positive for Covid.

    A modern urban population can’t shut itself away and live on home-grown food as plague villages once did. For years, government of both colours have encouraged the development of high-rise, high-density, modest-sized flats. People who live in them can’t get away from other people even if they do stay at home – their windows are inches away from those of their neighbours. To get to the shops they must share space in lifts, stairwells and corridors. And of course, tiny flats make it all the more likely that it will spread within families. It is little wonder that the worst-affected boroughs have been those with large numbers of multi-generational households living in cramped homes.

    The government’s own figures were indicating that a lockdown wouldn’t end this wave of the epidemic. Last May, during the last lockdown, it estimated the ‘R’ number at between 0.7 and 0.9. The new strain, we are told, increases the ‘R’ number by between 0.4 and 0.7. It doesn’t require much in the way of maths to work out that even in the best case scenario those numbers add up to more than 1.

    We should get the vaccine out as quickly as we possibly can, and in the meantime minimise social contact to the bare minimum – as, indeed, the vast majority of us are already doing. But the government should stop blaming us and threatening us with ever-more draconian rules backed by severe fines. It is the virus which is to blame; we are the victims.”

    The Denial by Ross Clark is published by Lume Books

    1. My definition of covidiots are people with a confirmed positive test or ‘self-isolating’ who think that wearing a non N95 mask means that you can go out and about as normal.

    2. Norway is currently receiving 40,000 doses a week.
      Sounds good, eh?
      There are 5 million living here. At current delivery rate, it will take about 2 1/2 years to give everybody just one dose, all assuming no holdups in distribution, storage and injection.

      1. Can we come visit? Ontario efforts will have everyone vaccinated in about twelve years.

        Don’t worry, we are ramping up the program our local MPP just announced. I have sent him an email asking why the hell we should not ignore the travel and lockdown rules to fly down to Florida where we can get the vaccination now.

      2. It’s the Law of Large Numbers.

        People don’t have a clue just how many a million of something actually equates to.

        Let alone a billion, which the government spends as if it’s nothing.

        1. When were discussing things like that, I always like to translate the number into what it means, not just a figure. That way, you can put it into persoective and get an easy estimation of whether the thing will work or not.

    3. Norway is currently receiving 40,000 doses a week.
      Sounds good, eh?
      There are 5 million living here. At current delivery rate, it will take about 2 1/2 years to give everybody just one dose, all assuming no holdups in distribution, storage and injection.

    4. …and how many cases of ‘increased’ Covid infections are due to the faulty PCR tests recording false positives?

  73. One aspect of the multiple new vaccines that concerns me is the precedent that is being set with respect to rushing through the permissions for general release.

    When/if this is ever over I hope that we will revert to more rigorous testing.

    1. I’ll be passing on mine if and when I get the call, at least until any longer term testing (i.e. the public taking them) is complete. There’s a good reason why medicines normally take years to go through testing to approval, plus its why the drug companies said their professional indemnity policies wouldn’t cover the vaccines if they were released to the public only after a few months, and why governments are providing ‘cover’ instead.

      Would anyone put their trust in a new airplane, car, boiler or smoke alarm design that the manufacturers would on principle not cover with a warranty, but left it to the government? I think not.

      Just look up what happened when NHS staff took a similarly quickly-designed swine flu vaccine in the pandemic that wasn’t in 2010/11. And that was part of a hoax pandemic by the WHO and big pharma. Even Ch4 news brought it up.

      1. The UK Government has decreed that the citizens of the UK will become the greatest experiment ever, whether they like it or not.

      2. 328382+up ticks,
        Evening EA,
        Same as that, even if it had a long term pedigree I would be very,very wary then say NO.
        Many of these political weeping scabs are pushing it to hard and fast when they have shown NO concern for the peoples welfare
        before, quite the reverse.

    2. 328382+ up ticks,
      S,
      Will there be a need ? those remaining will
      be of a submissive nature & be programmed to self test.

        1. He was perfectly justified in showing up these thugs in uniform. They believe that the LAW does not apply to them. No masks; no 6 ft apart; no congregating; no eating in restaurants. Only to the long-suffering public.

          I am surprised at you Grizz – I thought you had been a proper cop.

          2. If you’d said Harry Callahan, I’d be impressed. He’d have shot the virus.

            More seriously, those police officers got up to intimidate.

          3. “More seriously, those police officers got up to intimidate.”

            And I suppose the actions of the camera operator were not?

          4. But regardless of that, let me ask you (and a few dozen more on here who enjoy a vast variety of different jobs, most of them kept secret) this question:

            How would you feel if you were followed around, whilst you were trying to do your job, by someone who was constantly filming you with their mobile phone and screeching all manner of questions at you?

            I’m hoping for some sensible answers but not expecting any on this forum.

  76. The BBC, NHS and Government have found the ideal way to reduce Covid Deaths

    Halfcock, S hitty and co spout on the TV at 1700, about how well THEY are coping

    It is followed by, on average 2,000 suicides an hour for the following 12 hours

    1. Hello OLT

      I read somewhere last week that private hospitals are still continuing to treat patients for cosmetic reasons and other non essential operations .

      Why hasn’t the government requisitioned places in private hospitals to treat serious illnesses like cancer . These places have all the modern equipment for MRI’s etc . a huge weight would be lifted for the many who are waiting for diagnosis.

      1. I think they have TB. My wife has been waiting to get an appointment at the hospital where they did a knee replacement in June 2019 and still has to use crutches to get about.

          1. I think they were requisitioned for nhs use but when it came to the crunch they were not actually used, Sue – for anything.

          3. I was told that our local private hospital was used for end of life care and routine chemo.
            Certainly, when I went in for a couple of check-ups in the Spring, it was like a morgue.
            A friend had her private hip op. bounced for 3 months from end of March until well into June.

          1. She has balance problems with her pain medication for arthritis. The physio told her he couldn’t do anything for her.

      2. I may be wrong, but I believe that not only were they requisitioned and paid for, they weren’t actually used during the first wave.

        Perhaps they are now.

    16. Well done P-T.
      This was a cracker of a thread, you’ve clearly stuck in your thumb and pulled out a Plum.

      1. Well, I did alter the title of my Latin grammar to Eating Grammar (channelling my inner Jennings).

          3. I did A Level Latin and thoroughly enjoyed it (a bit peculiar, me!). I always felt that translating Latin was like solving a puzzle. I’d probably have been okay in the Y Service 🙂

          4. You should have been a programmer! That’s a fair description of what we do – translating incomprehensible strings of text and solving the puzzle of what they actually do.
            And that’s only reading the customer’s description of what they want!

          5. Actually, the nuts and bolts of computing have never interested me. I’ve learned to use them (spreadsheets, data bases, word processing), but at the heart of it, they leave me cold.

          6. Using other people’s software is annoying – writing it is like doing crossword puzzles.

          8. Of course one has to use it – but it’s often not fun. I’ve given up reporting bugs to Microsoft, as they only fix the ones where you do all the work for them. They have a team of young people with Chinese names who speak very poor English and whose goal appears to be to close every ticket without fixing it.

      1. Dreadful ending…..

        “The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.”

        Animal Farm, George Orwell

  79. That’s me for this weird day. No sun; no rain; just grey and uninviting.

    Early start tomorrow to get G & P to the vet. As there are rumours that we will be forced to stay at home except for one day a week when we can go to the crem – we are risking a trip to the garden centre to get seed potatoes.

    Glass in hand – thank God.

    A demain.

          2. Thanks. I’m determined to see it through barring major calamity that sends me heading for the bottle. So far, I’ve only had a few relatively minor hiccups which I managed to cope with sans alcohol. Only 20 days to go!

        2. I made my own with my neighbour’s apples, it’s delicious.
          Importantly this time not too strong. This time I can drink 500ml with out slurring, shluering, shplerring. 😉

  81. Evening, all. Not quite so chilly as yesterday, but cold enough not to want to work outside. I managed to get my dog’s health care card signed without being stopped by plod wanting to know where I was going. I did go shopping afterwards anyway. I’d left my shopping list behind, so I went to Sainsbury’s (I only had two items to get from there – and they didn’t have one of them! – so I was fairly sure I’d remember what I wanted). There was a queue outside! Fortunately, there were only three people and they moved quickly (they were queueing up to use the exterior hand sanitiser instead of the one in the foyer), but for a moment I nearly turned around and went home. Once inside the store, there didn’t seem to be many people around at all.

    1. Ventured to Tesco, Guildford, yesterday. They now have ‘traffic lights” at the entrance, and the queue was long. I was the only passenger on the bus, but it had to circumnavigate the entire University of Surrey campus. Both ways.`

      1. Tesco in my local town has a traffic light system. It has always been on green when I’ve walked past (there isn’t anything I need to buy that I can’t get from elsewhere, so I don’t bother going in).

        1. The queue was half way round the car park. Generally, I shop at Waitrose in Guildford. Any queue is short, and fast moving. Unfortunately, they don’t stock my preferred Fairy non-bio washing liquid. That said, my nearest shop of any description is a Tesco Metro. I can get a train to Guildford, walk down the street to TM, buy a few bits, return to the station, and the same train will be waiting for the return journey. £3.10 return (with disabled railcard). Since the old place had no public transport whatever, living across the road from a station is a game changer. There’s also an occasional bus. Apparently…

    2. I believe you people are not aware that there is a curfew on and that you must wear masks at all times. You won’t be able to go shopping like that so I will take your order now. My companion, PC Trougher, is in the car booking your accommodation. The community officer will be with you shortly to show you how to fill in your claim forms. Enjoy your stay.

  83. India drew the Third Test with Australia. I see that Steve Smith, a fine and noble exponent of sportsmanship in all its forms, has been observed cheating again. I’m shocked, shocked I tell you. I have not forgotten the fake ‘catch’ that the Aussies lied about in England last summer.

    Question: What is the test to determine with reasonable certainty whether an Australia cricketer is cheating? Is he on the pitch, or not.

    1. A few years ago we stayed at an Air BnB in Australia.

      There was an episode of cheating then.

      I had to query a charge. Someone had somehow gained access to my booking and probably the host’s account. I was warning the hosts, by email, that there might be a problem on their account.

      He telephoned me to discus the issue, but before we even started to consider our mutual problem he apologised profusely for his compatriots’ cheating!

      1. Actually, I find the Australians AOK, I have done business in Australia and they have always been very straight and honest. Nice people to deal with. All that goes out the window when they pull on cricket kit.

        If I was the Indians I would start chanting “Cheat” to sledge Smith at every opportunity at the Gabba. He really, really won’t like it. He might cry.

        1. I have to declare (ho ho) an interest, two of my sons are over there and aiming to get citizenship.

          Had the Ozzies not changed the rules a few years ago I could have got it for them by direct descent.

          1. “The problem with Australia is not that so many are descended from criminals, but that so many are descended from prison officers” – Clive James.

          4. Yes, I’ve read it. Very interesting but a touch hyperbolic and definitely shades of ‘poor me’. A lot of Australians are embarrassed by it, but the stuff on Norfolk Island is entirely fair, and the general brutality with which women were treated in the early days.

          5. I’ve given 2 copies of it away to Aussie mates I’ve worked with. I think Aussies are generally great, but with a fair few arseholes. A bit like us I guess.

          6. Australia was in the early 1800s in every sense a subsidiary of the the UK. In England at that time, if a woman’s husband decide she needed a thrashing, that’s what she got. All classes in fact. It was accepted once in a while, but if he over did it, with the aristocracy her family would hire a professional duellist to pick a fight with him – which of course he had to accept or be labelled a a coward and banished, for the less exalted he would he stopped by a group of her family with 4x2s and ‘educated’. But, women had no legal remedy, it was not an offence. Women in Australia had no such protection and life was a living hell for very many of them.

    2. I could never cheat at a sport. I’m not a saint, it’s just that I always think it brings bad luck.

      1. A friend and his family were staying with us.

        Their youngest son was a particularly precocious and obnoxious little shit.

        One afternoon we played the card game “Cheat”.
        I put down my last card and said three two’s.
        CHEAT, CHEAT…
        I turned my card over and it was a six. “Three two’s are six, you lose.”

        The explosion and sulk that followed was amazing. Particularly after I pointed out that the whole point of the game was to cheat by fair means or foul.

      2. My late Gran used to cheat horribly at cards. You’d know she had cards that could go, but she’d say ‘I can’t go’.

        Ruddy woman. Bless you Nan!

    4. Shame it ain’t around Christmas – I could go with the ’11 Crims are cheating’ ditty again.

  84. Cheese and biscuits time.
    Had quite a lot left over from Christmas. Shortage of visitors.

          1. Not half bad.
            Peter Lehmann Barrosa portrait shiraz. 14.5%
            From a well trained son, for Christmas.

          2. Lehmann Barossa is great. They used to do one called Clancy’s, but I’ve not seen it for ages. YTS is consistent, and I prefer it to many other wines. I bought a magnum of Chateauneuf-de-Pape at Waitrose for Christmas, and it was just about drinkable.

          3. For helping out with various jobs about the house my eldest sister and hubby bought us a 3 bottle ‘wine tub’ from waitrose Italian wine I think it was around 26:00 good stuff.
            It reminded me of the wine boxes in Oz.
            We lived about two miles from McLaren vale and with a flask of coffee and a packed lunch with friends we use to take a tasting trip to the wineries quite often.
            It’s all changed now Geoff, hundreds of huge vats can be seen covering the area.
            I’ll let you know what the Italian tub is called.

          4. Italian wine tub….Terre di faiano Rosso Puglia Organic wine.
            Large cylindrical dark blue package easy open to administer the measured amounts.

        3. I’ve got some Somerset Brie, it’s really rather tasteless, such a disappointment, it’s nothing like the French stuff.

          3. I never buy Somerset Brie. As you say, it is disappointing. If I want Brie, I buy the real thing. I also buy good quality British cheese and I wouldn’t want a French equivalent (except that the French are seldom as stupid as to produce such a thing).

          5. On the basis that cheese is better than no cheese, I would probably have done the same if options were very limited.

        4. I’ve got some Somerset Brie, it’s really rather tasteless, such a disappointment, it’s nothing like the French stuff.

      1. Just a few short of the usual half dozen and the grand kids.
        I love children……but I couldn’t eat a whole one.

        That’s what I say out walking to silly parents who don’t know how to trust dogs.
        Dont worry, she wont hurt them, she loves children but …….

      2. I tell Junior’s friends that I’ll feed them to Mongo if they don’t behave.

        It doesn’t work. The blasted dog is more trouble than the children.

  85. 328382+ up ticks,
    May one ask, did those pretendee tory party / farage support / voters know the mass immigration invasion would continue after the partial exit after ALL concerned got johnson into the driving seat.

    breitbart,
    Some Things Never Change’: Over 100 Illegal Boat Migrants Brought Ashore in Britain Despite Brexit

  86. I’m suffering from tighter restrictions today, should have bought a pair of larger waist jeans.

  87. Is there any limit to the laws, curbs, restrictions and limitations that the government of the UK can put on its citizens? If so, where is the line drawn? Why is no one challenging in court the actions of the government?
    If there is no limit then we are chattels and slaves. In which case how can we really be democracy?

    3. I thought there had been an attempt to challenge government’s actions but the court refused to hear it. Can’t remember the details, could have been Simon Dolan?

      1. Also Reiner Fuellmich, a lawyer in Germany, for crimes against humanity? What has happened to him?

      1. Blair is reported as saying that their placemen are embedded everywhere now. So, with that and the effects of Common Purpose…..

    6. 328382+ up ticks,
      HP,
      You can have a form of democracy as long as you support / vote close shop lab/lib/con
      coalition party.

      Plus let us remember being a coalition it is labs turn next.

    7. Maybe they’re just testing the waters for how much they can get away with. They haven’t finished yet.

      1. My thoughts, too. They are waiting to see how much strain they can put on the populace before the links fail.

        1. SAGE meeting.
          “OK, we’re all agreed, next step is a nighttime curfew. If that’s swallowed we go for the one day a week only for leaving the house. And let’s start thinking more about rewards for informing on neighbours and family.”

          1. Yup. When I was having the three-way conversation out walking the dog yesterday (if you count the two dogs there were actually five of us ), one of us said, “we’re only allowed to go out once a day”, to which, pretty much in unison, the other two of us said, “who’s going to know?” I foolishly said, “I’d like to think that none of our neighbours would have joined the Stasi”, but actually, I’m not so sure.

          2. We are rapidly heading towards the cold war days of eastern Europe – keep your head down and trust no-one.

          3. I’ve stayed in the USSR before Glasnost’ – I’ve been saying for a while that we are rapidly getting there. That’s one of the advantages of being aged; I have a lot of experience, not all of it good.

          4. Thus dirt if thing seems to travel around the world like a Mexican wave in slow motion. No-one seems to learn from the mistakes

          5. Sorry about the reply….. it is my on-screen keyboard on my iPad…. if I type too fast the blasted thing skips to a key alongside. It should read ‘This sort of thing seems to travel……… with a full stop after ‘mistakes’. The iPad slipped forwards – I blame the red wine – and the reply zonked off into cyberspace before I had quite finished!

          9. “Oh, and don’t forget we’re all round at Dave’s for drinks and snacks at 9:30 this evening.”

        2. The ‘failing links’ could have disastrous and maybe deadly results for them. Think step ladders, lamp-posts and piano-wire.

          ‘Evening, Connors, what a jolly thought.

    9. There aren’t, really. Why not challenged? Umm… can you imagine a citizen bringing a case to court suggesting the government is acting abusively during a virus outbreak? Do you even think the judiciary would flicker before they threw it out?

    10. I will not wear a mask outside that is my limit. Its not about the virus its about control. keep the people in fear.

      1. Very macho, but it would be even more macho if you did this while walking along Hammonds Drive.

  88. Is there any limit to the laws, curbs, restrictions and limitations that the government of the UK can put on its citizens? If so, where is the line drawn? Why is no one challenging in court the actions of the government?
    If there is no limit then we are chattels and slaves. In which case how can we really be democracy?

    1. We don’t need the Chinese to impoverish our nation. Our own blasted government is doing that quite happily.

  91. The opening of University Challenge.

    It might just as well be a pub quiz team competition, judging by their average ages.

    1. Universities have mature students and postgraduate students. They are eligible for the UC team.

      1. I know that, it just strikes me that the original format has changed into the equivalent of a glorified pub quiz.
        Rather like the sports teams, which were once mainly the preserve of undergraduates but are also now full of post-grads

  92. Thought for the evening
    Democracy is really rule by mob.
    My gang is bigger than your gang.

    1. Apologies but no. Representative democracy becomes that, but real democracy is very different.

      However, all democracies rely upon an informed, motivated and intelligent voting base. I’d count everyone here such, but… we’re not really representative of the majority.

      2. Consider this:

        The United States Democrats are Socialists.
        They are, in the USA, a National Party.
        That makes them National Socialists.
        I wonder where I’ve heard that before.

        I rest my case.

        1. Doesn’t matter whether he is or isn’t. The response from that woman was appalling. I wouldn’t want someone who responds to anybody like that working for my company.

          1. I would certainly have had sharp words with her afterwards, but it appears that she was provoked and this was not to the customer’s initial enquiry.

            I look at it in the same way as the gay-cake episode, someone setting out to annoy the company/employee and then complaining when they actually got the response the provocation was aimed to get, hoping to harm the employee.

            Too many bosses roll over for the customer who isn’t always right .

        1. Well, all I get is a lot of white space after:

          “I suspect some one on here will know an expert who could assist this young woman’s plight?”

  97. Good post from Lawrence Fox.

    Why are we normalising the term “toxic” to describe a presidency that saw 100% reduction in foreign wars, peace deals brokered with both Korea and the Middle East and the greatest increase in minority employment representation in in the history of the United States?

    1. Anything good that Trump managed to do is in the process of being whitewashed from history.

      I believe that he made some big mistakes in recent months but the establishment are now making sure that no one else rocks the boat in years to come.

          1. Yo, Conway; I found that translating from English to Latin demanded precision and syntax …

      1. And he has played at that level. Always calling Biden Sleepy Joe,look how it has stuck and the proof for that is?

        Play in the gutter and thats what you get.

    5. If you have just stolen an election from the people, it makes sense to mock, jeer and ridicule in order to create a storm of emotion to hide the theft.

      There is an analysis of suspicious voting patterns here
      https://fsociety.substack.com/p/2020-election-could-trumps-claims-have-merit
      This is the kind of analysis that should be in the mainstream media if they were doing their job.

      I must say, I expected there to be official explanations of these vote graphs, in the same way that it was debunked that more than 100% of eligible voters had turned out. To date, there has been no explanation offered other than the obvious one (fraud). Therefore I take with a large pinch of salt all the hysteria about impeaching Trump.

      1. ♫ “With a toot on the flute,
        And a whistle on the descant-oh,
        Hopping in the middle,
        Like a herring on the griddle-oh,
        Up, down, hands around,
        Arse against the wall,
        Sure hadn’t we the gaiety,
        At Grizz’s wondrous ball.” ♫

          1. Yes. I never quite mastered the change of fingering for the treble, but I loved my tenor. It’s a wooden one, with a lovely soft tone.

            Sadly, as a self-taught musician, I was never really quite good enough. And having a business to run I did not have unlimited time to practise. But it was a very special experience for the few years that I managed to keep up with it.

          1. Nice thought, but I haven’t played for far too long. I really should see if I can still remember the fingering.

          2. I bought my Moeck recorder in 1984 at the same time as I bought an alto saxophone (same fingering). Weirdly I could remember the fingering from my schooldays (some things stay with you). The sad thing is that I could get a good tune out of the recorder but I never mastered the embouchure sufficiently in order to convert the disgusting foghorn sound, coming out of the sax, into music!

          3. I haven’t tried to play a sax, but I remember a friend trying to teach me to play her flute – and I could barely get a squeak out of the thing.

            I expect that the fingering would come back to me in an hour or two if I sat down with some simple music.

  101. Facebook shares down 4% losing $34 billion and Twitter down 12% losing more than $4 billion. Both platforms have lost hundreds of thousands of users following the de-platforming of President Trump.

    Gab appears to be one of the main social
    Media platforms to which folk are moving in droves.

    What goes around comes around rather quickly nowadays. Here is hoping that Trump has the dirt on Obama, Pelosi and the Italian job.

      1. Yup. It seems so obvious to the likes of us plebs but the power crazed politicos simply do not ‘get it’. We are not stupid.

        We have witnessed the massive fraud in the Presidential elections in America and the manipulation of news worthy of Communist China.

        In the UK we have worked out that the imposition of severe restrictions on our civil liberties have nothing whatever to do with a flu virus and everything to do with the sales of dodgy vaccines in order to further restrict our activities and steal our wealth.

        1. This last point was underlined by the headline in my local rag “get vaccinated and help the escape”. They will only allow us to “escape” when they have vaccinated us, whether we like it or not.

          1. The pressure will be on the non-vaccinated by the vaccinated and the media; we will be told that it is our civic duty (although if the frightened are vaccinated I cannot see what the problem is. And as it allegedly doesn’t work as a preventative from catching the virus, nor does it stop one from passing it on, what is the point?). The PTB will hopefully be wary about crossing the Nuremberg Code of Ethics line, number one being ‘informed, voluntary consent is essential.’

          2. They were at it again today on a non-Bbc channel which MOH had on while I was stoking the Rayburn. Vaccine this, vaccine that, when we’ve all been vaccinated, blah, blah, blah. It triggered my Tourette’s Syndrome again!

        2. “We are not stupid.”

          Actually ‘we’ are stupid. 75% of people in the UK have an IQ between 85 and 115. The median IQ is 100. In USA it’s 98. We’re pretty thick collectively.

          “We have witnessed the massive fraud in the Presidential elections in America and the manipulation of news worthy of Communist China.
          ”

          There’s no evidence of that. What you’ve witnessed is an outgoing POTUS claiming he’s been defrauded because he’s lost a democratic vote.

          “In the UK we have worked out that the imposition of severe restrictions on our civil liberties have nothing whatever to do with a flu virus and everything to do with the sales of dodgy vaccines in order to further restrict our activities and steal our wealth.”

          You’re right, it’s nothing to do with the flu virus. Congratulations. We are locked down to try cut the transmission rate of the Sars-Coronavirus-2 virus which can cause Covid-19. The vaccines are new, and not necessarily dodgy, you may find they are quite effective, but we don’t know for sure yet because they are pretty much untested. Who is ‘stealing our wealth’ and how?

      2. Many firms have got a message (not sure which one), they are bailing and distancing themselves from the Trump brand as quickly as they can.

        Wait until Trump tries out a parting executive directive against fb and twit, they will follow the Bitcoin valuation on a downward leap.

  104. Late Laff

    Bill Gates woke up in the morning and found that his Mexican housekeepers were gone.

    He asked his wife Melinda where they went, who replied that Steve Jobs
    showed up earlier and offered them the same work at his mansion for
    double their previous wage.
    Bill became furious. “Fucking Jobs, coming here and taking our immigrants!”

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