Wednesday 24 February: If the data defy the model, why not lift restrictions earlier than planned?

Posted on by Geoff Graham

An unofficial place to discuss the Telegraph letters, established when the DT website turned off its comments facility (now reinstated, but not as good as ours),
Intelligent, polite, good-humoured debate is welcome, whether on or off topic. Differing opinions are encouraged, but rudeness or personal attacks on other posters will not be tolerated. Posts which – in the opinion of the moderators – make this a less than cordial environment, are likely to be removed, without prior warning.  Persistent offenders will be banned.

Today’s letters (visible only to DT subscribers) are here:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/2021/02/24/lettersif-data-defy-model-not-lift-restrictions-earlier-planned/

654 thoughts on “Wednesday 24 February: If the data defy the model, why not lift restrictions earlier than planned?”

  3. He didn’t expect that….

    “In a surprise twist on the Alexei Navalny saga, and on the very day that it’s being widely reported Biden is preparing sanctions on Russia as punishment for his alleged poisoning by nerve agent last August, the human rights organisation Amnesty International has withdrawn its formal designation of Navalny as a “prisoner of conscience”.

    US state-funded Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty reports the following on Tuesday:

    Amnesty International has reportedly withdrawn its recent designation of Russian opposition politician Aleksei Navalny’s as a “prisoner of conscience” over his alleged advocacy of violence and discrimination and comments that included hate speech.

    Aleksandr Artemyev, the rights watchdog’s media manager for Russia and Eurasia, confirmed the decision to Mediazona on February 23 after the news was first reported by U.S. journalist Aaron Mate”

    1. Hate speech, eh? I expect he said, “Flucking Amnesty International – fat lot of help they were.”

      1. He’s probably saying that now whilst deeply regretting his previous utterances.

        Good Morning M.Thomas

    2. The MSM attempt to portray Navalny as some sort of Russian neoliberal for the purpose of attacking Putin but in actuality he is a Russian Nationalist with views very similar to Vlad!

  4. Another memorable day!

    Wednesday 24th February, 2021

    Sguest

    Congratulations – A venerable Four Score

    A Very Happy Birthday

    and may you have many more!

    With best wishes,

    Caroline and Rastus

    7. Thank you very much! So this is what it’s like to be an octogenarian! When I was 70 they said that 70 is the new 50. Therefore, I am really only 60!

      I am merely a chartered accountant – how boring! But, unlike those with green eye shades, I have had a life of wonderful memories, all over the world (3,154 flights to date) and high adventure, having been in all sorts of unusual events, not to mention wars, revolutions, civil strife and even prison (in Saudi Arabia). I have come through all of it unscathed, and I am very fortunate to be in excellent health, not having seen a doctor for five years, a dentist for 21 years and an optician never – I still don’t need glasses for reading or long distance!

      I don’t really deserve such kindness because I am only an intermittent contributor to this excellent forum. But I now find that the comments are so informative that who needs the DT?

      Thank you again for the kind wishes to all those who make such interesting, informative and amusing comments- much appreciated!

      1. Congrats on joining the distinguished club! I hope that you have as good a day as I had 6 weeks ago.

        1. Thank you. Based on tall these kind messages, the day has started off very well! I am glad to join you and other such distinguished people!

      5. Happy Birthday Sguest! Your comments are always a delight to read. Erudite and entertaining, and reflect your very interesting life. Long may it continue and best wishes for a lovely day! 🍾🎉🎂

      6. Doesn’t matter how much or little you contribute. We all hope you have the happiest of Birthdays.

          2. I will do all that when the lockdown is over! Today will be very low-key but at least we are not forbidden to eat or drink, so I will make the best of it!

      7. Happy Birthday, Sguest – have a wonderful day and may you make many more contributions to this blog! My apologies for being late to the party, everyone is already here, I see.

      8. Many Happies.
        Blimey, winter 1941 must have been a busy time.
        Did the popping out of all these sprogs cause the wartime NHS to collapse? Ummmm ….

        1. Many thanks! Despite being born during the war, the sprogs of those days were brought up well and ate nourishing food, if not much of it. No McDonalds in those days!

          3. The wartime generation were the healthiest population we’ve had thanks to the balanced diet provided by rationing.

  5. New UK laws needed to stop hate speech and extremism, says report. 24 February 2021.

    Other legal material, the report said, includes “fascist extremist organisation circulating pamphlets which promote false claims about a ‘white genocide’ intended to stir up hatred against a racial or religious group, but which are not threatening, abusive, or insulting”.

    This amounted to a “gaping chasm”, the report said, with Rowley adding: “Not only have our laws failed to keep pace with the evolving threat of modern-day extremism, current legal boundaries allow extremists to operate with impunity.

    Morning everyone. Extremism = People saying things we don’t like.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/feb/24/new-uk-laws-needed-to-stop-hate-speech-and-extremism-says-report

    1. Could importing about a million people a year of a different colour and culture – all of them intent on living THEIR ways, rules, laws etc and forcing them on us ( while happily taking our taxes ) – have anything to do with white people feeling they are to be wiped out ( by sheer numbers?) Could tv adverts showing nothing but mixed race couples with dark skinned kids – who will go on to produce yet MORE dark skinned kids etc etc have anything to do with that feeling? Why would all those people come here in the first place “for a better life” if that “better life” involves getting rid of whatever and whoever built the “better life” conditions that they claim they come for?

    2. Assorted sharks and their bank managers rub their hands.
      Police get up off their knees and polish their truncheons.

      2. My own thoughts entirely – except that last time, he had been and gone by 8 am and I didn’t even hear him!

    2. Morning, Bill. Today at between 8am and 8.30am I expect a visit from builders who will make good the holes in the kitchen floor created in order to find the source of the water leak. Leak started September last year and the leak was eventually found in late November and repaired by a local plumber in mid-December. After today’s “levelling” of the floor area, the next step will be to re-lay the laminate kitchen/diner floor (by another company), then back to today’s workmen who will return to re-paint the kitchen walls. Then I put all the furniture back in the kitchen/diner. Hopefully this will return me to normal by Easter at the latest – kitchen-wise that is. Six months of hassle to get the job done has not been fun.

        1. Good morning, Minty. Light at the end of the tunnel in sight at last. (Kitchen repairs, not lockdown.)

          :-))

      2. What a nightmare for you.

        I discovered a leak at the front of my bungalow. The people who laid the drive had cracked the lead water pipe as it enters the house.

        When the chap came to fix it he was appalled that the stop cock was buried under the newly tiled bathroom floor.

        These things are sent to try us.

      3. My cousins had a similar problem with a study-cum-general dumping ground.
        Bill and I looked at the ploughed up floor and could have wept for them.

        1. Well, Annie, I have to confess that I made a mistake. When the repairmen failed to arrive by 9.30am I rang them and discovered I had expected them to arrive today but apparently the date is March the 3rd, i.e. next Wednesday. Then at least another week for the new flooring to be laid, then at least another week for the re-painting. What is most annoying is that yesterday I finished moving everything from the kitchen to the living room, which means I can barely move. And I have to put up with this for almost one more month! Never mind, at least I can get out into the garden and get myself some backache digging and weeding!

  7. Headline in The Grimes:

    “Emmanuel Macron’s grand plan to be the next Charles de Gaulle”

    To misquote Senator Lloyd Bentsenin 1968:

    “Monsieur Macron, I knew General de Gaulle – you are no General do Gaulle”

      2. It is high time they made a remake of The Day of the Jackal and gave it a different ending. Maybe the role of the Jackal could be given to the nephew of the actor who played the part in the original film!

  8. HMS Queen Elizabeth faces a high risk of ‘incidents’ in the South China Sea. 24 February 2021.

    HMS Queen Elizabeth faces a high risk of “incidents” when it is deployed to the South China Sea, experts have warned.

    Moreover, Ms Nouwens cautioned that the “vast uptick in types and numbers of these exercises really increases the risk of miscalculation, misunderstanding and misinterpretation, and that’s something we should be careful of.”

    A weak country that cannot guard its own borders seeks confrontation with a burgeoning military and economic superpower in waters far from home. What could possibly go wrong? One is minded of the Russian Fleet where it sailed to be destroyed at Tsushima!

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/02/23/hms-queen-elizabeth-faces-high-risk-incidents-south-china-sea/

    1. I wonder what would happen if the Chinese warships fired on and destroyed the HMS Queen Elizabeth.

      Write them a stiff note?

      1. Don’t worry Phizzee.

        It will probably sink before the Chinese could intervene.

        The RN are reported to still have not repaired the leaks in HMS Prince of Wales, despite spending £39million.

        Does the HMS Queen Elizabeth have the same design defects?

          2. After running aground early in it’s career, the first Post War Ark Royal had a couple of sections filled with concrete to stop the leaks!

  10. Morning all

    Here are the lock down letters……

    SIR – The Prime Minister has said consistently that decisions about unlocking will rely on data. However, the latest decisions rely on more modelling by the same group of scientists whose previous predictions have been wildly inaccurate.

    I am not a scientist, but with current figures showing a significant drop in infections, deaths and hospital admissions, and with more vaccinations to come quickly, a projection of an additional 55,000 deaths if some restrictions are eased by Easter seems to me to be yet more scaremongering.

    The most remarkable fact is that the dates for review are apparently immovable. Therefore, if the data, which the Prime Minister says is sacrosanct, improve more rapidly than anticipated, we will not get the benefit.

    It is abundantly clear that these rules are made by people who do not live in the real world and are unlikely to be seriously affected by them.

    Peter Flesher

    Halifax, West Yorkshire

    SIR – Am I alone in wondering how we have reached the point where the Prime Minister can tell me I cannot kiss my husband of 50 years? How am I to explain to a dear man suffering from dementia that I may hold his hand and be near in full PPE, but not hug or kiss him, after being apart for a whole year?

    How am I to absorb this insult to our feelings and accommodate myself to this extraordinarily cruel challenge to natural behaviour? I can only believe this has been promoted by those with no experience of living with separation of this kind, and no understanding of how it affects those in care homes and their relatives in the community.

    Anna M Bratby

    Huntingdon

    SIR – Is it not strange that from March 8 one can meet a friend or family member outdoors to socialise, but not with a golf club or tennis racket in hand, even if participants have been vaccinated?

    Many thousands of retired people will feel this to be unjust, since these sports are well suited to social distancing. Perhaps the new freedoms will be nuanced in the next few days to remove such anomalies.

    Barry Bond

    Leigh-on-Sea, Essex

    SIR – Last week I went to my optician. This week I am going to my dentist. However, it appears that I shall be unable to go to my hairdresser until April. What is the logic behind this?

    Brian Howard

    Enfield, Middlesex

    SIR – I’m no doom-monger, but the R number (the reproduction number, giving the count for people infected by one person) is bound to increase when schools reopen.

    The R number is based on three variables, all of which are estimated, not calculated. One is the number of contacts a person has, so when schools reopen and people have more contacts, the R rate is guaranteed to increase.

    Chris Forth

    Harrow, Middlesex

    1. I seem to recall, about this time last year, another prediction of 55,000 deaths – is this the same model, I wonder?

      1. Last March a very senior civil servant forecast 8 million deaths with 12 months. Was that the same model?

    2. No dentists in Scotland, as drills and sprays (“aerosols”) not allowed. Fancy Bob Hope as your dentist with a hand drill.?

    3. Mr Flesher… yes? I’m not sure what your point is. Officialdom doesn’t live in the real world. The SAGE quango is paid by tax payers regardless. As is PHE. As are ministers. None of them suffer the consequences of their actions.

      Heck, they push through IR35 and care not a jot. They hike energy bills and slap theirs on expenses. Councils put up business rates and council tax but don’t pay it. The fiddle with nonsense like gender equality when their departments have more time than can be imagined because they produce no product, have no deadlines, no customers – certainly not customers they can bother with.

  11. Could Putin be a Middle East peacemaker? 24 February 2021.

    For more than half a century the Kremlin has been dealing with the Assad family, first with father Hafiz and then with his son Bashar. It is a relationship sealed in blood and no one doubts that if Bashar were toppled tomorrow, Vladimir Putin would throw a protective arm around him. A dacha outside Moscow, a personal shopper perhaps, and a team of well-armed guards to shield him from the International Criminal Court and other enemies.

    If it were not for Vlad the Syrian government would have been overthrown by the Western backed Jihadists to an accompanying blood bath and half a million refugees pouring over Europe’s borders!

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/putins-plan-to-make-peace-in-middle-east-qmwhzqckw

  12. SIR – In his role as CEO of the electric car company Tesla, Elon Musk has said: “If we do not solve the environment, we are all damned.”

    In this same role, Mr Musk has been instrumental in purchasing and promoting Bitcoin (Business, February 17), the digital currency that is consuming ever-increasing amounts of energy during its mining process.

    If, as is claimed, there is a glut of “spare” power in some countries, would it not be better to invest in sustainable programmes to harness it for the good of the globe?

    Tim Cozze-Young

    Shrewsbury

    1. I assume Tim Cozze-Young is referring to the amount of energy required to power and cool the servers when mining bitcoin. Not physically mining minerals.

      As to Elon Musk he is just another virtue signalling hypocrite getting immensely wealthy.

      1. Much less wealthy than two days ago… he lost a shedload of money on Bitcoin!
        HA! HA! HA!
        What an arse.

  13. Morning again

    PPE purchasing fiasco

    SIR – Matt Hancock, the Health Secretary, may like to bat away criticism over the purchasing of personal protective equipment as “second order” to saving lives (report, February 22).

    However, he might also like a dose of realism: we, the taxpayers, did not give him carte blanche to throw billions of pounds at people who did not even have to undergo rudimentary scrutiny of their experience in the sector, or of their ability to provide a usable product.

    Jeremy Claydon

    Empingham, Rutland

    1. Hancock will be reminded that he and Boris knew all along that each day, for every ten covid deaths,eight might have lived had they been given Ivermectin. Every day we waste hundreds are dead.

      1. I reckon about a half of all the fatalities in this “Pandemic” were caused by government action!

        2. Add in a large percentage of the other fifty percent to misattribution – see postings re seasonal flu – and there was not a pandemic. A nasty virus was doing the rounds killing off many of the old and infirm, behaving as a nasty virus would do.

      2. The reminder should be, “Why didn’t you act?” Preferably put to the pair of them in the highest court of the land and repeated ad nauseam until they break.

    2. Halfcock needs to be prosecuted for that contract – at best it was incompetent, which I doubt!

  14. The shameful targeting of black police officers. Leyla Sanai. 24 February 2021.

    I’m severely disabled, coffee-coloured, a migrant, a refugee and a woman. I was born to a Muslim family and I chose atheism as soon as I could think. To put it simply, I don’t need much convincing that for minority grievances to be ameliorated, meritocracy has to exist. Positions of power must be open to individuals from all backgrounds. Many people agree. But it’s disheartening that some activists appear to reject this way of thinking.

    More than 430 attacks against black and ethnic minority police officers occurred between June and September last year. This number represents an almost threefold increase on the previous four months. The thuggery of far right protestors should not be underestimated of course. But shamefully we must admit that some of the physical and verbal abuse doled out to police officers appears to have taken place during last summer’s BLM protests.

    Of course not. Though one wonders how she knows they were targeted when they were shoulder to shoulder and particularly as there were no “Far Right” protests last year. There were a lot of BLM demonstrations and a few by Black groups in military uniform but no Evil Whiteys!

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-shameful-targeting-of-black-police-officers

    1. If you are “severely disabled, coffee-coloured, a migrant, a refugee and a woman” how did you get through our very strict immigration controls and testing? For you are no use to this country whatsoever.

    2. Have there ever been ‘Far Right’ protests in the real world?

      I think the vast majority of such ‘Far Right’ violence is mostly that of the Left, or a minority response to the extreme viciousness of a Left wing mob.

  16. ‘Morning All

    Today’s #CovidClownWorld

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/946b4c4ecb5af68985a4a177ff30a12e2876a6c1207b8ad60b3a954365c514ec.jpg

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/66fe51b78d5f7af8e04c2ed8bc17f3c19d73096b1b687041625d4560c3288e51.png

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/c98b18415344cb194f7fd413f36bc2ce97957170db05aa4659e360d5d782e579.jpg

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/74a3b70e59f03c4839dfeac7684143d2aeca4f14715e9f176024aee2d6878d6b.jpg

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/6e12a43d0ac1f41ca71f622f6f4a51c65d3c20e033fc3cc036037314f5486fbc.png

    https://media.gab.com/system/media_attachments/files/066/629/177/original/8593734b0406cf54.jpg

    1. Vaccines work, but they don’t stop the transmission of viruses, nor do they stop the person vaccinated from getting ill.

      This fundamental ignorance is part of the problem. We were sold lock up as a panacea. Now we are sold vaccines. People understood neither. The lock up was for the benefit of the state. The second will not stop that same state from using lock up again.

  21. Royal family are keeping their ‘fingers crossed’ for Prince Philip, says Edward as his father, 99, ‘responds to treatment’ for an infection but will remain in hospital for ‘several days’. 24 February 2021.

    The Duke of Edinburgh is being treated for an ‘infection’ in hospital and will not leave for ‘several days’ but is ‘comfortable’, Buckingham Palace confirmed today.

    The announcement marked the first official update on Prince Philip’s health since he was admitted to King Edward VII Hospital in London on Tuesday last week. It came as Philip’s youngest child Prince Edward revealed the Royal Family were keeping their ‘fingers crossed’ for the Iron Duke – but he was doing ‘a lot better’.

    He’s a goner. I say with neither Malice nor Pleasure!

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/index.html

    2. If he were not a Duke he would already have been shuffled off to a hospice/peoples home to die alone.

      Not that i wish him ill.

      Good morning.

    3. He is a very old man who, after valiant service in the Royal Navy during WW2, has given a lifetime of service to our country.
      Sadly, it is time for us to let him slip anchor.

    4. I wouldn’t put it past him to rally to make his 100th – just so he could get a telegram from his wife! 🙂

  22. Daily Betrayal

    “Meanwhile, Professor John Lee has written a furious attack on this whole despicable situation. Relish this:

    “To justify keeping

    us in cold storage for another four months, the PM leaned on his

    reliable allies in Sage. The more Sage gets wrong, the more Mr Johnson

    clings to its view of the pandemic. Few politicians have any

    understanding of science, so they become captives of their most cautious

    adviser, and fail to question the validity of their data and advice.” (link)

    Professor Lee’s next observation deserves

    to be shouted from the rooftops. It should be slapped round our

    sit-at-home peacocks’ heads as well. Quoting what BJ said when

    presenting his, ahem: SAGE’s roadmap, Professor Lee continues (my

    emphasis):

    “Mr Johnson’s use of

    the word ‘fact’ is revealing in that context, as it suggests a

    fundamental ignorance of the uses and limitations of modelling. You

    do not deduce ‘facts’ from modelling, but ranges of possibilities,

    which by their very nature fluctuate wildly according to the assumptions

    used and the data submitted.” (link)

    And then Professor Lee really lets rip. After listing all those scare numbers from the scare models, he writes:

    “These figures are

    not facts. They are hypothetical and based on models which have, in the

    past, repeatedly been found wanting. Besides, this is not how modelling

    is supposed to be applied to political decision-making that affects the

    economic future of this country. If you allowed your life to be governed

    by worst-case scenarios, you would never drive a car or get on an

    aeroplane. Risk is there to be mitigated, not eliminated.” (link)

    The good professor then attacks the test regime – again, not mincing words when he writes that “It

    is infuriating to see ‘case’ numbers being reported as rising when the

    key determinant, the number of tests, is never given.” (link). Ah – but how else could the covid Politburo and their helpers in the MSM keep us scared? Read

    the whole thing and keep it for future reference, for example when you

    want to answer Sir John Redwoods appeal in his Diary this morning, to

    let him know what you think about a ‘’vaccine passport” (link).”

    Much more good stuff here

    https://independencedaily.co.uk/your-daily-betrayal-wednesday-24th-february-2021-day-52-of-lockdown-3/

    1. More than that. The complete inadequacy of the (secret) data is compounded by the inability to connect and directly correlate action taken, such as mask wearing and closing pubs, to any effect these might have on the progress of the disease. Each individual restriction and course of action needs to be matched to its resulting effect on halting the disease if they are to be of real, controllable use. This cannot be done. The parcel of restrictions is a sham. It is like throwing a dozen pots of coloured paint at a wall and hoping for a picture by Botticelli.

      1. No. His ancestors bravely resisted slave trading and the slave traders. They were all killed as a result of their bravery, he will claim.

        1. ‘Morning, Horace, “They were all killed as a result of their bravery, he will claim.”

          A pity that’s not true, otherwise he wouldn’t be here – and that would be a blessing.

    2. The Atlantic slave trade was instigated and run by Africans. They were by far the greatest beneficiaries of it.

    2. Months and weeks ago the Government was loudly denying that they would ever be providing a Vaccination Passport.

      The new Vaccination Passport now appears available only to those who own modern mobile ‘phones.

      …..well, at least that will keep the poor, the elderly and the ignorant out of aeroplanes and airport terminals, leaving more room for the Elite.

      https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/02/23/travel-news-holiday-restrictions-abroad-quarantine-hotels-reopen/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr

      2. Good Morning Janet – no word yet from Johnson concerning what restrictions and protocols will apply to the participants and their attendants who will be coming to Cornwall in mid June for the G7 get together.

          1. Yes. As SAGE decided to follow (get away with) the Chinese model of locking everyone down i expect to see the front doors of Cornish people nailed shut.

            The Chinese did that too.

          2. Of course there will. It has happened on all previous occasions. All buildings within sight of the hotel and grounds will be searched, as is likely for all premises in the vicinity. Some roads will be closed for the duration. As well as armed UK police and soldiers, there will be a number of foreigners carrying guns to protect the Presidents and the like. It won’t be as bad as a Commonwealth conference though.

      1. It could be Plum. Michael Gove, my son’s most hated man, is certainly identifiable despite the cartoon distortion of his features.

  25. The Irish Daughter

    An Irish daughter had not been home for over three years. Upon her return, her father yelled at her, “Where have ye been all this time? Why did ye not write to us? Not even a line. Why didn’t ye call? Can ye not understand what ye put yer old Mother thru?”

    The girl, crying, replied, Sniff, sniff….”Dad….I was too embarrassed, I became a prostitute.”

    “Ye what!!? Out of here, ye shameless hussy! Sinner! You’re a disgrace to this Catholic family, so yer are.”

    “OK, Daddy…as ye wish…I just came back to give Mammy this luxurious fur coat, title deed to an eight-bedroom mansion plus a $5 million cheque. For me little brother Seamus, this gold Rolex.
    And for ye Daddy, the sparkling new Mercedes limited edition convertible that’s parked outside, plus a membership to the Limerick Country Club.”

    She takes a breath and continues, “and an invitation for ye all to spend New Year’s Eve on board my new yacht in the Caribbean.”

    “Now what was it ye said ye had become?” says Dad.

    Girl, crying again, Sniff, sniff….”A prostitute Daddy!” Sniff, sniff.

    “Oh! BeJesus! Ye scared me half to death girl! I thought ye said a PROTESTANT. Come here and give yer old Daddy a big hug.”

    1. Hmm, as a grumpy old man the mask is really quite dangerous for the dog as it needs to let hot air out through it’s mouth.

  27. What a prat!

    https://twitter.com/talkRADIO/status/1364478358864732160

    https://twitter.com/talkRADIO/status/1364484806919258113

    Having fun with further voluntary weeks of mass testing and being masked all day?

    Or, as this useless government have shown in previous moves, they will probably relax the summer school rules only to impose those rules again in the Autumn term. Advice to government, if you’re going to be evil, please be consistent and not stupidly evil.

      1. Have you children? If they’ve children, their children’s children have already had their entire lives tax take already spent – in 1997.

        That is how indebted we are. Bizarrely, it is the state’s crushing grip that forces the water of tax out of it’s grasp. Things could be so different, so much better but through a combination of ‘this is how we do things’ to public ignorance, we go around the roundabout endlessly..

        1. No offspring. Neither has my brother as far as I know ( no contact for years but he’s older than me and he had none when he was near 40 – so clearly didn’t want any ). The way things are looking, I am glad – The future certainly isn’t bright – nor Orange – more a 3rd World brown.

      2. Britain’s WWII debt to the Americans was finally settled in 2006, so most of us on this site spent our entire working lives paying it off.
        This did not apply to our contemporaries in Germany and Japan; aka the countries that started it.

        1. Why are English politicians so useless at negotiating deals?

          After getting lumbered with WWll debt – and not getting Japan and Germany to contribute – we have shown how poorly we guard our own national self-interest and how easily we can be exploited.

          No wonder the Buffoonish Bonker signed up to such a shoddy WA and trade deal with the EU.

          And what will happen when we give Scotland independence? We have had to pay the EU billions in order to leave it – but we shall have to pay the Scots to leave the UK! Doubtless the canny Scots will get us to pay them enormous amounts of megadosh in perpetuity.

          1. The only explanation I’ve ever seen was the Yanks claimed we didn’t pay them back after WWI. That’s the dust-up they entered 3 years after everyone else.

      3. Has it been spent on anything worth having?

        Has anything been spent on anything worth having, or has it been cut to pay for waste, ostentation and backhanders?

    2. Back to Princess Alexandrina Victoria being extorted up and down stairs.
      The same smothering, dispiriting precautions against a million to one incident.

    3. I must have been dreaming – I thought Public Health England had been deservedly consigned to the scrap heap?

    1. I wonder if he was bored or he had lost a bet with his mates.

      Whatever the reason he has our thanks for cheering us all up.

      Morning BoB.

  30. Channel migrants should face ‘red list’ quarantine, say Tory MPs
    Fears voiced that high Covid rates in northern France could be carried into UK

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/02/23/channel-migrants-should-face-red-list-quarantine-say-tory-mps/

    I thought that the whole point of Brexit was:

    to take back control of our borders;
    to retain the territorial integrity of the UK of which Northern Ireland is a part;
    to regain our territorial waters for fishing;
    to get freer trade across borders without unnecessary paperwork (wasn’t this why they said no deal would be troublesome!)
    to get good arrangements for the financial services sector.

    Why are the politicians so reluctant to deport illegal immigrants and make life for them very uncomfortable and hard until they have gone?

    And why has Johnson given us such a pathetically inadequate Brexit?

    1. At heart, the state has never wanted to leave. As the state is the one arranging the withdrawal process, the result is inevitable.

      Why have we not simply deported illegal gimmigrants? Political weakness. They’re afraid of the Left wailing at them and the bad publicity.

      One thing they could do that wouldn’t be difficult is to remove legal aid from non-native citizens. That way if a lawyer wants to force us to take one of these criminals then they have to pay for it.

      1. 329689+ up ticks,
        Morning W,
        There is not a party within the lab/lib/con close shop that wants what you ask, and the peoples via the polling booth give their consent in backing those party’s.

      2. Those lawyers who want foreigh criminals to stay here should be made personally responsible for the migrants behaviour, costs, NHS treatment, etc. The lawyer should also have to accommodate the migrant in their OWN house, the migrant living there with them. Any crime committed by the migrant ( and then the migrant flees ) then the lawyer should be given the fine/sentence.

        1. If we deported all these (immigrant ) lawyers the problem is solved. The fact that these immigrants/refugees/asylum seekers and other dross have access to lawyers is wrong anyway

    2. 329689+ up ticks,
      Morning R,
      That was the original plan via UKIP on winning the referendum but those that knew better as like the
      lab/lib/con close shop/ supporters / voters, decided that a
      damage limitations campaign should be the course to take,leave it to the tory’s, the rest is history.

    3. Morning Rastus – “Operation Oak “as reported by the Independent yesterday is a Home Office plan to decant “asylum seekers” from the 9500 hotels they are occupying and “disperse” them into long term homes. Economic illegal immigrants should be sent home. The illegal immigrants are a bigger threat to the community than Covid

  31. David Kurten

    If you won the upcoming London mayoral election, what would you do in your first 30 days?

    Close down Sadiq Khan’s ‘Diversity Commission’ and ‘Online Hate Crime Hub’.

    Tear out all of Transport for London’s temporary StreetSpace schemes, road barriers and pop-up bicycle lanes.

    Re-focus the police on catching real criminals such as murderers,

    burglars, thugs and vandals, rather than wasting their time closing

    businesses and fining people for not wearing masks.

    Stop the rollout of the ULEZ (Ultra Low Emission Zone) expansion and border charge for vehicles driving into London.

    Many institutions across the country, if not all, have been

    indoctrinated by a form of cultural Marxism and common purpose. How

    would you eradicate that?

    We need to repeal Harriet Harman’s ‘Equality Act’ and Tony Blair’s

    ‘Human Rights Act’ and return to the legal situation where people have

    equal rights to enjoy our fundamental freedoms and equal opportunities,

    rather than the law being used to attempt to enforce equality of

    outcome.

    We must also repeal all anti-free speech laws and prevent ‘hate

    speech’ laws coming in. Criminal penalties must be based on the

    objective actions of the defendant, rather than the subjective feelings

    of the complainant, such as perceived hostility.

    https://www.conservativewoman.co.uk/david-kurten-my-heritage-party-is-the-only-home-for-true-conservatives/
    Reading the rest of the article to hell with being mayor,we need him as prime minister!!

      1. #MeToo, vw but, my biggest fear is that, between the Heritage Party, Reform and Reclaim, all that may happen is that they will split the vote and the usual suspects will sneak in on the back of that.

        There is a need for each and all the leaders of those parties to get together, agree a single manifesto and not stand against each other in any seat.

        2. 329689+ up ticks,
          Afternoon NtN,
          If the last little dust up was not enough due to false heros when farage split the vote showing out quite clearly as a pretendee tory asset, I do Not know what will drive the truth home.
          Battens leadership & actions showed what could be done only his success was cut
          short with UKIP once again on the rise.

          That UKIP / Batten success over a year induced fear into the political close shop politico’s members & voters.

        3. Good day, Nanners.

          There are almost as many
          Parties and Groups as there
          are, for example, UKIP members,
          all of them hell bent on promoting
          themselves; they are incapable of
          joining forces because they are so
          certain that, as individuals, they and
          only they are capable of being the
          big ‘I AM’…..their policies are very
          similar but they all lack the foresight
          and Patriotism this Country needs,
          [and voters want!]

    2. 329689+ up ticks,
      Morning Rik,
      Many of the peoples are really grasping at rhetorical straws.

      When listening to one Gerard Batten a proven
      patriotic leader who DID put rhetoric into action as can be witnessed was not on the cards because many wanted to believe he was / is a far right racist.

      I can see L, Fox & A M Waters getting kicked into touch
      in lieu of yet another lab/lib/con rhetorical hero as long as “the party” is in the despicable number ten.

    3. 30 days? only a couple of days would suffice for me. That’s how long I would need to issue the instructions to the appropriate people on threat of sacking (without recompense) if they failed.

    4. Does he want to destroy sixty years or more of Liberal, Socialist and Conservative endeavour? Does he want to erase the new, vibrant, culturally enriched British society? Does he want to squander the billions of pounds spent on creating Britannia Moderni and improving the social and financial standing of his hard working friends and associates? Does he want to turn the clock back fifty or sixty years to when Civil Servants were silently ensconced in their offices and policemen were seen on every street corner?
      .
      .
      ..
      Good! If he really does he can have my vote, and I suspect millions more from the long suffering plebs and impoverished masses. More power to his elbow.

  32. OIl man been and gone by 9.15. And the bill today was £95 less than the quote last week….

  35. Who is/has?:

    1. The biggest owner of farmland in the USA

    2. A huge investor in the shares of pharmaceutical companies in the years before 2020

    3. The world’s foremost expert on pandemics and vaccines … as judged by media appearances, on which

    4. He is never challenged because he has the media companies in his huge financial pockets.

    Yes, It’s BILL GATES:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvjwYgu1Mgg

    1. His wealth has shot up by $20Bn since the start of the pandemic. I certainly don’t recall more people buying Windows 10 or Microsoft Office during that time. I agree that his ‘Foundation’s donations’ to vaccine reacher are likely to be dwarfed by his own personal investments in those fims/organisations…and amazingly he is one of the chief advocates opf lockdowns, mask wearing, annual and booster vaccinations, COVID passports, restrictions of personal energy use and foreign travel (except the uber rich like him, who consumes about 100 – 1000x more carbon emissions than any of us per year).

      His dad was one of the bigwigs at the abortion ‘charity’ Planned Parenthood (and apparently was a eugenacist) and Bill is still a big player in/contributor to it, as well as to many nutty left wing ‘education’ organisations telling everyone they are ‘white supremacists’ etc whilst advocating for ‘population reductions’ through vaccinations etc.

      I wonder how much (other than the $3.4M to the telegraph) he ‘contributed’ to the Biden election ‘campaign’?

      Hmmmm.

  36. Just quickie, i have to got to another funeral this afternoon.
    Are we living in the real world ? The insanity of politics continues full steam ahead with more and more young men pouring across the channel. Who are then set up with free accommodation, fed watered and clothed by our tax payers. Meanwhile thousands of our own people,especially the lower paid have lost their jobs, we have just had another holiday in the UK cancelled. Our armed services is being cut in numbers dramatically more unemployment and still the illegals pour in a unannounced and are treated with more respect that our average long term citizens.
    And Welby was ion TV this morning announcing that church land will be offered for building projects for social housing. If this illegal passage was stopped there wouldn’t be any need to house all these people who have come here in the past 10 years. There are no jobs for them any where.

    1. Of course one doesn’t have to go as far as North America to find a bBC subscription service. Britbox, available on these very islands, is a mix of on-demand programmes from bBC and ITV for £6.99 per month. Yes, the bBC are already providing a subscription service for part of their programming.

      The bBC should just open a global subscription service. This may well match their current funding levels, if not increase them, and those who opt not to view the bBC dross can carry on viewing the dross on the other ‘freeview’ channels.

      1. There are already BC america channels available over here. If you want to watch reruns of old top car programs it is just what you want. Forget what they call selected programs, make it all available so that I can decide which programs to watch.

        If you think the BBC is bad, you should have seen the cbc coverage of the love fest between Trudeau and Biden yesterday. Talk about dumb and dumber!

  38. I’ve just noticed that the voice of 1471 has been changed as has the message. Some female with a strange accent now tells me that I have been phoned by a number at such a time/date. I miss the first part of the number while I put the handset to my good ear. Previously a nice gentleman told me in a clear voice that I had been called on particular time/date by a certain number. It was much better before.
    I know this is really trivial in the Great Scheme of Things, but I’m hoping that the BBC might wish to interview me, and I will become famous and garner millions of followers on Facebook, if I join Facebook, and become an Influencer paid lots of money to promote commercial rubbish.
    I won’t mention that last bit to the BBC though.

    1. Interestingly the opposite has happened to the temperature checker stands in the reception areas of BBC buildings. For the first few months a distinctly oriental female voice said “please plath closer” but now a clear English male voice states “access granted”.

    2. It’s always been a delightful female voice on 1471 for me from the first time I used it many years ago.

        2. Different exchange? Different country? I’m pretty sure the voice hasn’t changed since I first heard it.

  39. DM Story – https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9293097/Boris-Johnson-says-dog-stays-amid-rumours-losing-patience-feisty-Jack-Russell.html

    Dilyn stays! He’s unruly and not house-trained… but we love him: Boris Johnson sticks by pet dog amid rumours he is losing patience with the feisty Jack Russell

    No 10 Downing Street stinks of dog’s urine!

    Not training his dog properly is a disgrace. He has as little control over his dog as he has over his paramour. They should not be allowed to own a dog or to run a government.

          2. Ferrets whilst lovable little creatures piss everywhere. Boy do they stink.

            I once watched some ferret racing at a country show. When they got a bit tired they were taken back to their cages. It was funny seeing them climb into their little hammocks and go straight to sleep.

          3. Rats are fairly intelligent and, were it not for the damage caused and the disease risk, would be quite pleasant animals.
            And tamed ones certainly make good pets!

          5. I always feel a bit saddened when I’ve killed rats because they are often just at the wrong place at the wrong time.

          1. Their eating habits are a little strange as well Phil. Slop at home and 5 star cuisine when out!

          2. In my catering days we used to do quite a lot of functions at the local stately house which was used in the filming of Poldark ( the remake). The family there always wanted extra portions of whatever was on offer, so that they had enough for a couple of days. The main public rooms were quite well-kept but some of the other rooms were a tip, including the kitchen.

          3. Seems par for the course re the extra portions. One of my brothers in law is wealthy and you wouldn’t find anyone tighter and always looking for freebies.

          5. One of my friends who lived in a stately home kept parrots in the kitchen! They had free range. Unsurprisingly, their dropped food (never mind other deposits) caused a rat problem.

      2. The royal corgis are no more. HMQ decided against replacing them a few years ago as they departed to the great kennel in the sky.

  40. 329689+ up ticks,
    May one ask, who will put their hands up to supporting these governance parties in the last GE knowing the political closed shops treacherous track record of treachery in the past three decades.

    Can any indigenous with hands aloft explain their repeated hatred of these Isles?

    Madness in the Channel: Over 100 Illegal Migrants Brought Ashore in Two Days.

  41. Hi folks.

    Had a Morrisons delivery this week and bought a pot of their fresh crab. It was revolting.

    Now i know Morrisons food is normally of a high standard but this item didn’t come anywhere close.

    If you have ever tasted fresh Devon crab you wouldn’t touch this with a bargepole.

    It was branded as Ocean Fresh or Ocean isle. I looked further into this and none of it is caught from around the British coast. It comes from a different species of crab caught in the Indian ocean.

    I also checked the reviews on the Morrisons website and the majority thought it was tasteless mush.

    I know it comes down to price but this wasn’t anything like the real thing.

    I know i recommended Peskyfish the other day but they seem to be quite expensive. So i have started using these people who offer free delivery on orders over £60. https://www.hamiltonsfish.co.uk/

      1. Can’t be arsed. I’m dropping them anyway because of delivery costs. All the other supermarkets give free delivery if you spend over a certain amount. Morrisons don’t.

        Anyhoo, Aldi now deliver so i’m going with them.

        1. Sorry to hear that. Complaining helps other customers.

          I have never used (and will never use) any home delivery service from any supermarket. It is a drag but going to the shop once every couple of weeks suits us.

          1. I’ve never had deliveries either – going to Morrisons once a week is the highlight of my life at the moment!

          2. Understood. However i can’t walk at the moment so it is helpful to have the shopping delivered.

          7. Not really. If i walk to the kitchen and back i get stabbing pains in my foot. If i ignore it it keeps me awake at night. I have some crutches which i am getting used to and that should take the pressure off the foot.

            I have one more blood letting and tessting appointment next tuesday and then the Consultant Haematologist will be calling me 19th March.

            She will have all the results by then.

            It is not helped by having narrowing of the arteries in my left leg and having Polycythaemia at the same time.

            It’s a wait and see at the moment. The nurse did tell me if my foot begins to turn purple to call an ambulance immediately.

            Thanks for asking.

          11. Thanks. I’m quite calm about it all. This is what a life of debauchery gets you. Obviously it has been building up for some years and has now suddenly become acute.

            I have faith in my Consultants to advise the best outcome for me.

          12. I understand what you mean but every product carries a customer review. Which i should have looked at before purchase.

            I know some people don’t like it for a variety of reasons but in the case of Waitrose if you have a complaint they normally give you a full refund.

            I bought a leg of lamb for Easter Sunday and on the day it had just gone out of date. I explained to them that i was sure it was still perfectly edible and was just letting them know but they gave me a full refund anyway. So there is such a thing as a free lunch.

        2. Sorry to hear that. Complaining helps other customers.

          I have never used (and will never use) any home delivery service from any supermarket. It is a drag but going to the shop once every couple of weeks suits us.

      1. I thought they were reasonably priced given the competition. Some of the wholesalers charge £9.95 for delivery.

    3. It looks like a good site. Thank you. Every time I accessed Peskyfish at the behest of the email I discovered my interests were already sold out!

        1. I admit, I’m disappointed in them based on your post, Fizzy. I’ll have to pay more attention. Slacking in class, should do better.

          1. It was a brand i was unfamiliar with.
            I am happy to pay a premium for the real McCoy.

            Typically a product like Morecambe bay shrimp will cost £4 or £5 for 50gms. A very small amount but a superior product.

            I was so annoyed with Morrisons that i sourced some white crab meat from Hamilton’s of Salcamb. That cost £17 for 250gms. At least it is the real thing.

  42. Family of dead man say they’ll ‘miss him terribly’

    The family of a Stockton man who died at the weekend have paid tribute to him, saying he was a “very popular and well-known person”.
    In a statement his family said: “He was a kind-natured person and when he was younger he used to help elderly neighbours with shopping and errands.
    “He also used to work in a local restaurant which he really enjoyed.

    Adam Chawla suffered “significant injuries” at a home on Eleanor Place in Stockton on Friday 19 April. He died in hospital on Sunday.
    .
    .
    .
    .
    Three men aged 50, 40 and 29 have been charged with Mr Chawla’s murder and are due before Teesside Magistrates’ Court.

    Why is it always the nice ones that get stabbed at home by their neighbours who loved them dearly? It’s a mystery.

      1. That all depends upon his intentions. A hook is an unintentional draw. A fade is an intentional slice.

    5. Just seen the cop on tv explaining there was no signs of skid or anything – car just suddenly veered off the road . . . . . ???

  45. Great comments and responses on the Letters Page BTL area today – especially the thread on scientists/clinicians/experts and the postcode lottery/flaws of the NHS, including excellent contributions from our very own Anne Allan.

      1. I stand corrected and now updated. Ta. I’m going blame my lunch lack of lunch for the deliberate nmistake. 🙂

        [edit 2] Seems I was more hungry than I first though – I thought I’d only included one mistake, and deliberately!

      2. Ta ever so, NtN.
        That’s the only thing over which my late Ma-in-Law and I were in complete agreement.
        I don’t know why I’m so touchy as my maiden name, being of East Riding origin, was usually spelt wrongly in yer Essex as well, so I should be well used to it.

  46. A dangerous threat to Scotland’s way of life

    A blurring of boundaries around the state’s role has caused controversy before, but none so troubling as that now engulfing the Crown Office

    TELEGRAPH VIEW • 24 February 2021 • 7:00am

    A shocking picture of Scotland’s political life is being exposed by the bitter personal battle between its former first minister Alex Salmond and the present incumbent, Nicola Sturgeon.

    It is even overshadowing his claim that she should resign for misleading the Scottish Parliament and of being party to a conspiracy against him. She denies both, but as a Holyrood committee of inquiry, which has an SNP convenor and a nationalist majority, hears evidence, a more dangerous threat to Scotland’s way of life has been revealed.

    It is that, under the SNP, Scotland has become a virtual one-party state. The party not only controls the levers of power but its tentacles spread across all the cultural and social – as well as political – aspects of life. This blurring of the boundaries concerning the proper role of government has caused controversies in the past, but none as troubling as that now engulfing the Crown Office, Scotland’s prosecuting authority.

    Critics allege that it has become an arm of the SNP after a lengthy dispute over its refusal to reveal evidence that Mr Salmond says is crucial to his case. The Holyrood authorities had already taken the unprecedented step of ordering the Crown Office to obey the inquiry’s demand to produce the required evidence but, even then, it took a High Court judgment to allow the relevant evidence to be produced.

    Yesterday, the Crown Office demanded large-scale redactions, it said to protect the anonymity of complainants, but only after it had been released to the media on Monday. Mr Salmond predictably chose to repeat his concerns “about the interference of the Crown Office in a parliamentary inquiry”. The implications behind such a charge are shocking.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/2021/02/24/dangerous-threat-scotlands-way-life/

    1. I wish some Nottler would explain this affair to me. Is it as I suspect some double dealing worthy of Scotland’s past?

      1. BTL:

        Atticus tou Vorra 24 Feb 2021 1:37PM
        Let me get this straight, the Crown Office is run by someone in Nicola Sturgeon’s government and when allegations are made against Nicola Sturgeon this same office says they are inadmissible but will not say why. Err…surely that cannot stand up to legal scrutiny? If it does, then Scotland’s parliament and legal system are not fit for purpose since it opens door for legal dictatorship.

        alex ferguson 24 Feb 2021 1:44PM
        Sturgeon said Salmond had to provide evidence that she lied to parliament. When he did, she decreed that the called for evidence was banned if there was any criticism of our dear leader. What’s different from North Korea?

          1. The inquiry committee has been examining what went wrong with the government’s internal investigation into sexual harassment complaints against Mr Salmond that were made by two female civil servants. The government had to pay legal expenses of more than £500,000 to Mr Salmond after it admitted it had acted unlawfully during the investigation. Mr Salmond was later cleared of 13 charges of sexual assault against a total of nine women after a High Court trial last year.

            https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-56181114

          2. I couldn’t actually be bothered to work it out for myself! I had a nasty turn last year when I thought some sadist had painted her onto the inside of my television screen!

          6. The poison’s in the tumbler for the nasty bottom fumbler, the glass near my arse has the Irn-bru that’s true.

          7. The poison’s in the tumbler for the nasty bottom fumbler, the glass near my arse has the Irn-bru that’s true.

          1. Yes. the Tories, now at their zenith, will challenge the SNP on independence. As half the country support independence, the Tories will lose.
            I have advised them to challenge the SNP on performance in office and never mention independence. But they are not listening…

        3. One has to keep in mind that the positions of Justice Minister, Lord Advocate General*, Chief Constable, and Head of the Civil Service in Scotland are all in the gift of the First Minister. Moreover with an effective overall majority (with the inclusion of the Greens), an iron grip on the Scottish Cabinet and the SNP Party, nothing Sturgeon says will be countered.

          *Whoops – I came over all English there for a moment…

        4. Atticus.
          There is no one to make a challenge, it seems. Nor does anyone seem to know that the rise of Sturgeon parallels that of a certain legally elected Chancellor of Germany.

          1. If it were C16 Edinburgh, Salmond would have landed with a painful splat just outside Holyrood gardens.


      2. And be these juggling fiends no more believed,
        That palter with us in a double sense,
        That keep the word of promise to our ear,
        And break it to our hope.

        The next time we see Macbeth his gory head is on a stake borne aloft by the Thane of Fife.

        I nominate Migraine, Wee Krankie and Carrie Nutnut to play the Three Weird Sisters in a pantomime production of the Scottish play

    2. Shouldn’t the Lord Advocate at least be forced to resign over this?

      It would be typical of a premier to throw someone under the bus, Sturgeon must already have her sights on him.

      1. They would all have to go under the bus. There has been no review of the conduct of the parties to the trial. There was full media coverage of the lead up to the trial and Salmond was pretty much condemned before it started. Witnesses, that is the complainants (alleged victims), allegedly met to agree their stories and were also coached in how to give their evidence. All allegedly, of course. A jury of plain folk threw the whole thing out.
        The list of possible charges against the Sturgeon crew is going on endless, but no charges will ever be brought.

        1. which is why the lord advocate should be concerned about his position because they are not going.

          When Trudeau and his cabinet tried to do a bit of justice thwarting, it was the Auditor General that took the fall.

          1. I imagine that they are all hoping that if they stick together and keep on deleting, redacting and delaying they will all survive. If the SNP retain their position or improve it at the May elections, all will be well for them. They think. It might also be game over for the Union.

    3. The DT and national Press seem to have just woken up to this scandal which has been ongoing for about two years. If this had taken place in a well run country the government would have fallen.
      The appropriate thing would have been for Westminster to step in and do some house cleaning. Holyrood exists only by the permission of Westminster.
      Too bad no one in London has the guts.

      1. Yes, Horace, and Good afternoon. A good time to dissolve the Wee Pretendy Parliament and the other Assemblies, all of whom have proved that running a piss-up in a brewery is beyond them.

    6. The SNP’s founders were Nazi sympathisers. They’re just carrying on the tradition.
      If ScotsNasties get an overall majority again, the state will go ahead with its plans to allocate a ‘minder’ to each child who will train up the little cherub to report on discussions round the family table.
      Salmond is deliberately holding out so that the Scots become more aware of what’s going on so they will be hanging on his every utterance. Like him or loathe him, the Wee Eck has more brains in his little finger (no, NOT that one) than the rest of the Wee Pretendy Parliament put together.
      Meanwhile, crack open the deep fried popcorn.

    1. If you believe any politician sat in Westminster in the parliamentary session then more fool you. If you believe anything that the buffoon utters then you you deserve all that comes your way.
      Take the time to sit back and examine his track record so far, HS2, BBC, BLM, illegal cross channel invaders, Covid inaccurate graphs and figures stroked to fit his and SAGE’s agenda, his Green Agenda and finally Brexit or should I say BINO and what a poor deal he seems to have accepted.
      The Conservative Party seems happy with the state of affairs, I wonder if all those who voted for him and his party feel the same.

      1. The ‘deal’ is a disaster. Boris has been out manoeuvred and managed to get a “deal” that is even worse than his WA was!

        What astonished me was that Nigel Farage, whom I had previously thought was sensible, said that the deal was acceptable when he had had no time to examine it or think about it properly.

        1. Evening Rastus, he now has had enough time to study the deal and admit his 1st thoughts were misjudged but he hasn’t.
          I consider this a sign of weakness from him, perhaps after 20+ years the fight has gone out of him.
          The fact is Johnson has made a pigs ear out of Brexit.

          1. Who is surprised by that, vvof? He never meant it when he said he’d leave with no deal (“dead in a ditch”, remember?).

          2. Evening Conners, I remember and it is no surprise to me, which is why he never had my vote at the last GE.

      2. 329689+ up ticks,
        Afternoon VVOF,
        My back comments qualifies me as being a NON believer in anything with a lab/lib/con tag especially since the 25/6/2016.

        Many of the current voters are old stagers, family tree voters, then you have the nostril grippers,also the best of the worst brigade none of them voting to benefit the Country first, but the party.

        Not very many rhetorical raised hands.

        1. Surely the same applies to anyone voting for “Taketheknee” Starmer’s party or the LibDems.

          1. Indeed. Voting for anything, Independent, UKIP, Reform, even the bloomin Communists is better than returning that shower again!

      1. 329689+ up ticks,
        Afternoon P,
        Any ruling politico who wanted to remain a ruling politico / party
        would have made damn sure such issues were highlighted & sorted with much ado about “that’s the way we handle things”
        But this group are working to a well concealed agenda and don’t seem to give a damn what the ovis think, as if immune to any ovis
        re-action, maybe they know the electorate to well.

  48. I know this Bill Gates is one of the richest people in the word. What I hear and see of him he is a very dangerous idiot.

    1. One needs certain traits to become a billionaire. Namely megalomania with psychopathic tendencies.

        1. I was taught, from an early age, that money is not the sort of thing about which a gentleman should concern himself.

          3. Ha! the Last of the Spendthrifts you mean. Nobody gets to keep a castle and half a county in the family for nigh on a thousand years without concerning themselves about the readies.

      2. That’s my feeling too. Look how many genuinely intelligent people (everyone on here, natch) aren’t as rich as Gates.

      2. I called him a dangerous and that is what I think of him. Dangerous because he is so wealthy. and an idiot in many of the things he says, in my opinion of course.

      3. I called him a dangerous and that is what I think of him. Dangerous because he is so wealthy. and an idiot in many of the things he says, in my opinion of course.

      4. When I first heard him talking, I was astonished how stupid he sounded. He is a college dropout who got lucky. I would say he has a streak of low cunning rather than being very intelligent.

    3. Deluded, in that because he has been so successful, he knows everything and is the only clever person on the planet.
      Dangerous, as you write, Johnny.

    2. 19 C here at lunch time today, south Cambs. I had to discard my fleece when taking the dog for a walk, it was so hot. Strong wind blowing.

      1. Indeed – just a few miles south over the county border it’s been glorious sunny weather today, if a tad windy. I had a lovely 75 min walk this morning, getting some much needed (natural) vitamin D and exercise.

      2. Indeed – just a few miles south over the county border it’s been glorious sunny weather today, if a tad windy. I had a lovely 75 min walk this morning, getting some much needed (natural) vitamin D and exercise.

      3. Good afternoon pm ,

        Weather was warm this morning , we managed to do stuff in the garden , and make a trip to the tip , and give the dogs a good run, but what an idiot I am , put the washing machine on at 8am, and forgot to put the washing on the line to dry .. just realised when I went into the utility room at 1500hrs to put the dog food in the dishes and saw the red light flashing on the machine !

        After our visit to the tip with the garden rubbish and a few other bits and pieces , the wind got up and became quite chilly as we gave the dogs their run on the heath and had our walk, feeling really stiff and achy now and rather cold.

        Cup of tea time , and Moh is fast asleep !

        1. It was warm when I was outside hacking the buddleia again – very windy. The bedclothes and bath towel dried on the line – they looked ready to blow away.

          Cloudy though and unpleasantly windy so I only stayed outside for an hour or so.

        2. Good evening, Belle – you got a lot done with your day, regardless of the forgotten washing! l did the same with our towels, washed overnight, I didn’t realise until mid afternoon, I had forgotten all about them, when I decided it was too late. However, tomorrow is another day and hopefully it will be similar to today.

          Two other web sites you might be interested in with regard to yesterday’s conversation:
          White Stuff
          BrandAlley

          The latter is a sell-off of branded goods, sometimes at ridiculous prices compared with the shops. But you cannot hang around, items may have a limited time for release and they go quickly. Anything from garments to bedding to ‘jewellery’.
          I find that I cannot buy from any one place these days as many things no longer suit me. As long as I can make myself presentable on occasion that is all I care about! Kettlewell Colours is probably my favourite port of call but it is likely between seasons at the moment. I have completely given up on M&S.

          1. Good evening pm

            Very happy to browse the new links you have provided . Thankyou .
            I have given up on M+S as well.

            Over the past year I have put on a few pounds , comfort chomping. Moh remains the same slender self he always has been .

            I love bright happy colours , and M+S seem to to want women to look like GPO parcels , browns and camels and greys or chocolate bars .. their styling is quite dull .

            Do you often wonder where some buy their clothes from.. I love Pru Leith’s clothes , she wears some lovely styles and colours , but I suspect they cost a bomb , but I wish there were little notes saying … and Pru Leith was wearing today… blah blah blah ..

            I wear scarves, and have a pile of them , different textures , but usually long ones which I can wrap around my neck , summer or winter..

            Fashion has flown out of the window!

          2. Yes, I have always wished I knew where people get their clothes…. I have been comfort eating as well over the winter months, winter always wants to make me eat more anyway regardless of lockdowns. Baked potatoes are my downfall, I just love potatoes, the perfect accompaniment to butter. And toast with honey…. honey with ginger is delicious (Sainsbury). Come the beginning of March I will go into reduction mode (much later last year because of lockdown – images of homemade rice pudding kept floating into my mind) – all the carbs, the potatoes and toast will go. Breakfast will be tinned grapefruit in apple juice (any supermarket) and lunch will be fruit and yoghurt. It is hard for the first few days but then I get used to it and motivated by looser waistbands.

    4. I think it’s going to get colder at the weekend. I’m pretty sure we will have more snow before the end of March, although it was very mild today.

  51. Watching the BBC earlier I wondered who is responsible for every government statement on the lockdown being accompanied by (half the screen filled with) gigantically magnified pictures of the (ugly) Covid19 Virus?

        1. Apologies.
          No idea why, it works OK here in France and usually it’s the other way around.
          Both the picture and the link work

          1. For me, the picture worked, the video was ‘unavailable’ – presumably some geoblocking doo-dah. I’m beginning to think that VPNs are quite good, if you get the right one. That’s until governments deem them illegal and ban their use…

    2. I thought it said ‘eclipse of the son’, I was expecting to see a piccy of Megan standing in front of Ginger.

      2. Can the term ‘culturally diverse’ be applied to the ancestral white urban scum who litter our ditches and hedgerows here in NN8?

    2. The Glock information is important, I guess.
      Personally, I don’t like them. Too easy to pull the trigger in a stressful situation, and there’s no safety other than a wee release within the trigger. I prefer my Walther P99 AS, where you can decock the firing mechanism, requiring a double-action pull for the first shot. As with a revolver. Less likely to poop off a shot due to too much excitement, IMHO.

    3. To get away from them, just do as we used to against the Daleks – run up some stairs. I’d like to see them follow!

      1. Newton. Action & reaction.
        From school: M1V1 =M2V2
        Man: 100kg. Bullet 8,3 grams. Bullet 370 m/s, man about 2cm/s.

          1. 100kg? Huh. Lots equipment, plus I carnt be arsed to work out what a Paki plod might weigh.

    5. I thought all the Pakistani criminals were over here on benefits. Who are this lot going to arrest/shoot?

  55. COVID-19 NEWS

    SAGE advisors have warned the Government that despite the ongoing roll-out of the vaccine and the falling case numbers, a spike in Covid-19 infections can be expected in mid-September.

    The 19th of September is designated as “Talk Like a Pirate Day” and it is feared that if last year’s celebrations and the concomitant social-mixing are repeated, the Aaarrr-number will see a sharp rise, precipitating yet another lockdown.

    5. They are just so clever these sage people, cannnot understand why they get so much wrong.

  56. HAPPY HOUR – worth recording…

    11.25pm Talking Pictures – A Kind of Loving –
    1962 British kitchen sink drama film directed by John Schlesinger, based on the 1960 novel by Stan Barstow. Alan Bates, June Ritchie and Thora Hird.

    BBC2 afternoon films from the 1930/40’s..
    Thanks Aunty we’re not all old codgers likely to fall asleep through boredom!

    2. British movies of that era – c1960 – were about as romantic as the kitchen sink, sweetie ! … x

  57. Dramatic sunset – just as I sign off. It should be fine tomorrow. And with less breeze.

    A demain

  58. I had quite a surreal day, yesterday. For a number of years I have enjoyed occasional access to a number of former police colleagues on a couple of private FaceBook sites. I don’t tend to spend much time online, on any site, these days so I’ve been remiss at contacting those old colleagues.

    Yesterday afternoon I received a text message from my youngest brother in Dubai. He mentioned a chap’s name and asked me if it meant anything to me. Immediately I told him that the name belonged to an former colleague and friend. He then went on to say that this man had tracked Roger down and asked him if I was OK? It turns out that dozens upon dozens of my former colleagues, all my age and older, had been worried about me due to my silence. They wanted to know if I was OK.

    I logged on to the FaceBook site and found myself inundated by a tidal wave of well-wishing from a whole host of ex-colleagues, and some more from many other former officers who have never even met me! To say I was almost overwhelmed is an understatement. Every time I returned a greeting another one popped up from someone else. I was greeted by one chap who I trained with, back in 1973–74, but have never come across since! Another thanked me for being his tutor constable … 40 years ago!

    Phew!

    And, on that note, many thanks also to the group of lovely NoTTLers who sent me a birthday card, and another big thanks to Philip and Dolly who sent me another! There has been nothing in the post here for well over a week and then everything turned up today. Thank you all so very much. It is most appreciated.

    I’m still feeling quite choked. It’s been emotional!

    Cheers, to one and all! 🍷😊

      1. It always perplexed me why Boney M would wish to sing about a brown girl’s ring!

        I couldn’t take my mind off bowel movements! 😖

    2. Brilliant Grizz! What a way to turn 70! Finding a large chunk of your past still exists! I hope they bring you much happiness and laughter – the memories will come flooding back!

      1. I was quite choked, Sue. Some of them I’ve not seen for a lifetime and they still remember me!

    1. When my last and final employer invited me to declare my religion and sexual preference I politely told them to fuck orf by pointing out: “The NHS recognises 52 religions, as I haven’t tried all of them yet how could I possibly know?…..

      1. Whereas the reason you were fired had something to do with your sexual preference?…

        Sorree, open goal irresistible.

        1. Don’t worry. I resigned and retired ‘hurt’ because I could no longer stand the Proto-Woke idiocy that was coming down the tracks,,,,

          1. There are times when I think that that is the whole point of this idiocy, to get rid of people who know what they are doing and to replace them with people who will break whatever they are supposed to be using.

          2. That would require a degree of intelligence and planning. I’m with Grizz on this one it’s down to pure innate stupidity..

        1. With all the various permutations in this Gender Laissez-faire society I wouldn’t mind better there are 52 preferences logged by the NHS which would of course be 51 too many for me!

          1. I signed up to the Church of Country Sports before the Hunting Ban – I doubt the NHS recognises that 🙂

    2. To get a job there, these days, you have to demonstrate an ability to limbo-dance under a worm.

      1. AND to be able to bugger it and be buggered by it while whistling candle in the wind by Elton John.

      1. The first person he should remove is himself.
        Pale, male, stale and so woke that he must be a racist, any-phobe, non-disabled, hypocrite.

    4. I find it genuinely disconcerting.

      There’s a reason German law prevents such lists. What’s it for? Oh look, that bloke is gay. Who cares? It’s a lifestyle choice. I dislike such gathering on principle. It’s wrong, no matter the intent.

      1. Quite.

        Just imagine if in 20 years time we are under a regime that thinks that such people should be thrown off tall buildings.

        I’ll bet they will be really, really grateful that their employer insisted that they “came out”

      2. If I remember rightly she didn’t have a kind word for one of our English Ales:

        “Lady Macbeth. We fail. But screw your courage to the sticking place,.

      4. Good idea. It doesn’t end well for her; particularly after she’s nasty to her pet dog, Spot.

    1. Nothing. Thereson May signed the UN Invasion Pact, so there is nothing for them to do. All migration is legal.

    2. I think that The Home Office staff take a ministerial edict to mean a suggestion via the Chinese Whispers method detailed on Yes, Minister.

    4. The infuriating thing is that international law is not remotely complicated.

      They are not refugees. They are not asylum seekers. They are not immigrants. They’re just freeloaders. Lock them up and when there’s two or three hundred herd them on to a ferry and send them back to France.

    5. Following orders that originate from No10.
      I have found from life experience that those in charge issues policy directives which others must follow or be sacked.
      Why would you expect anything different concerning our uninvited guests?

  67. The data has defied the model for 11 months. The state is – for reasons I don’t understand – happy with this situation.

      3. We could, in honour of your birthday, rename Empire Day as NOTTL Empire Day, and celebrate at the same time the fact that within the empire there are a significant number of Traditional Values Women…

  69. From today’s R4 Six O’Clock News:

    MPs have been told that 178 asylum seekers contracted coronavirus while being house at a disused military barracks in Kent. Details were given to the Commons Home Affairs Committee. The MPs were clearly shocked. The most senior civil servant at the HO, Matthew Rycroft, was asked by the committee chair Yvette Cooper MP about reports of a mass Covid outbreak. She responded to him thus:

    “Oh my God you had 178 cases at a centre which had dormitory accommodation of over 20 people (sic).”

    “On what planet did you think in the middle of a Covid crisis it was safe or sensible to put over 20 people in a dormitory so they’re all sleeping together in the same room with the same air overnight, each night?”

    “OK, so that’s alright then so there were 2 metres between the bed.”

    Mr Rycroft did not ask Pixie Cooper-Balls why, almost 6 years on, she hadn’t taken some of the load as she pledged to do:
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-3239347/Refugees-welcome-Age-Stupid-Yvette-Cooper-s-pledge-migrant-family-proof-noisy-emotion-replaced-quiet-intelligence-writes-RICHARD-LITTLEJOHN.html

    And, it seems, no one asked why they were here…

    1. I don’t suppose it occurred to her that they might already have the disease before they arrived.

        1. For my money?

          I think the virus is mutating in a “normal” pattern and that similar mutations are happening all over the planet.

          The only factor that is relevant is where the researchers/analysts spot it first and name it.

          1. I am not yet convinced that they have even isolated the virus. The scientific community are divided on the principal issues and regrettably those opposing mass experimental vaccination as a remedy are cancelled on mainstream social media.

            Apart from Sweden and a few Baltic states, every government around the world appear to have bought into the face nappy and lockdown nonsense. Major financial influencers are behind this.

          2. I am not yet convinced that they have even isolated the virus. The scientific community are divided on the principal issues and regrettably those opposing mass experimental vaccination as a remedy are cancelled on mainstream social media.

            Apart from Sweden and a few Baltic states, every government around the world appear to have bought into the face nappy and lockdown nonsense. Major financial influencers are behind this.

  70. 10 minutes go or longer I answered a reply to poppiesmum ..
    I then tried to get back on here , and found I had to sign back in .. I usually do this via my Twitter account , just by clicking the Twitter icon ..

    Disqus popped up and said there was a problem and suggested I sign in via disqus .. have just done so , but not . Now I have tried to click on my icon for replies and there is a lengthy sign on procedure .. I would rather click on with my Twitter which I have used forever .. has anyone else had any problems?

    1. I always go through Disqus log on. No problems for me although some posts do disappear. On the bright side i can now load pics without any trouble.

      1. yes but I want to sign in via Twitter , it keeps things neat and clean , I can answer you on here , but not on the main frame, something has really gone wrong .

    2. I almost never have to log in with the laptop- it’s always there. I’m using my phone at the moment and when it tells me to log in I just click on the D for disqus. I have to do again if I go to a Twitter link and back again but I’m getting used to it.

  71. Well that’s me done for this evening i wish you all a pleasant and relaxing time.

    I’m off to watch ‘Edukatin’ Reeta.

    TTFN

          1. I never studied music, Maggie; I did postgrad research in physical chemistry (reaction kinetics) at TCD – a lot of sailing in Dublin Bay – and hunting in Counties Wicklow and Wexford …

  72. Off topic.
    Has anyone been watching the hatchet-job on Trump on BBC 2?

    For me, Trump was infinitely a better proposition than Clinton.

    It was a shame that the USA could only come up with dross and drosser; but having said that, the constant attacks on someone who was right surprisingly often are getting my back up.

    Biden is playing with fire in a petrol tanker, and his policies so far suggest that he won’t mind the explosion.

    1. Another one?! You’d think by the number of Orange Man Bad articles and programmes that Trump was still in office!

      Biden just re-opened those (according to AOC) ‘concentration camps’ (which weren’t) for trafficked kids from central/south America (which Biden said were terrible, Harris protesting against, despite his old boss Obama instituting and Trump improving conditions in) and now has STOPPED deporting the child traffickers, many of whom do so for kiddie fiddlers.

      The leftist US MSM say nothing on this. Rank hypocrisy. Not even reported in the UK media, especially the Telegraph.

      1. I look for things that vanish from the MSM.

        Maxwell has vanished, my suspicion is that it’s because a whole herd of senior Democrats, Clinton and the like, would have been hung out to dry.

        1. I wonder if Maxwell will get added to the list of former associates of the Clintons who ‘tops themselves’?

        2. She’s offering to give up her UK & French Citizenship so she can get bail and live under house arrest and not be able to skip the country. A rolling stone gathers no moss ad

    2. Biden hasn’t a clue what he is signing. His Executive Orders were drafted two or more years ago by Obama. The fake election has been planned over the past four years and the characters put in place by the elites.

  73. Evening, everyone. What a quaint idea taking notice of the actual data rather than flawed modelling.

    2. It was one of the reasons why, despite liking science as a child, I went into engineering instead. That and Star Trek in its various guises. I liked solving problems and seeing the results.

      Not seeing the evidence and believing just the theory one of the many failings of those on the political Left, and why so many academics – including scientists, are of that persuasion, whilst engineers tend to be more conservative – because they deal in the real world, which has concequences to actions, which need to be viewed, recorded and learned from.

      1. Joe public: “It didn’t work the first three times, what makes you think it will work now?”

        Politician: “I’m following the science”

      2. I came top in Physics in my first year at Grammar School, but I eventually chose arts because I preferred languages (and art, of course). I ended up with a Sociology degree (State Socialist Societies – to use my Russian). I always felt that social science was a misnomer if ever there was one.

  75. Is everyone else having problems here .. one minute I haven’t been able to comment or sign in , and the next minute i can .. then when I click to the replies I have to sign in, I just don’t understand what is going on .

    3. Yes, looking at internet problems, there a lot of irate people who have lost connections and it seems to be regional.
      BT is getting a lot stick at the moment but it is just one provider on the basic backbone run by OpenReach so it could be common to other providers.

      1. I dunno – he’s been regaling us with tales and photos of his pussies scampering around his estate…..

      2. I dunno – he’s been regaling us with tales and photos of his pussies scampering around his estate…..

  79. I am undergoing self inflicted torture. I promised a friend I would watch an episode of something called Married at First Sight. (On E4. Nuff said). He watches it every week and said I shouldn’t judge it without watching it which was a fair comment.

    My eyes are bleeding and my ears have fallen off.
    I have never seen a group of more self obsessed people in my life. So far, it has been an hour of them taking it in turn to talk about themselves and their feelings.
    The production makes it even worse. Music playing continua,ly with one dramatic crescendo do after another interspersed with suspenseful strings to manipulate your emotions.

    Pleeese, make it stop.

    1. Another reason to defund the BBC. The doom goblin is looking thinner, perhaps she’s given up meat?

    2. Another reason to defund the BBC. The doom goblin is looking thinner, perhaps she’s given up meat?

    3. Could have been worse. Could have been Jim’l Fix It badges.

      Edit: Come to think of it I have seen Blue Peter paraphernalia up for valuation on Flog It but so far have never seen a Jim’l Fix It medallion.

      I wonder why. Both are now historical artefacts.

      Edit: Remember Michael Aspel who read the BBC News and shagged everything in sight including Valerie Singleton, Jan Leeming and quite a few others from the wonderful BBC fraternity.

    1. And it is part of the Frankfurt School agenda, one of the eleven aims – support the perpetrator of a crime against the victim. Presumably because it adds to the sense of disorientation and dislocation and general confusion felt by the victim and the wider population. All contributing to the weakening and break-down of our society.

    2. Economists should always be looking at incentives whether at the individual or collective level. Clearly it is very good for (the legal) business if criminals are out of prison committing crimes. This could be countered by making judges pay and pensions subject to penalty when a criminal who they gave less than a maximum sentence reappears in court. …..

    1. Just me I reckon and you.

      And Kaypea.

      To tell the truth I stopped posting earlier in the evening because my posts were ridiculed and downvoted. The persons responsible generally left the site between 9.00 and 10.00 pm.

      Now those three bastards have been banned or whatever I might try to look in earlier of an evening.

      It is always nice to hear people’s stories and learn from their acumen as opposed to being deliberately targeted by those who disagree with your views.

        1. I do apologise. You, like me are a night bird.

          I do hope that your personal circumstances have improved. So much is sent to try us and you are not alone believe me.

          1. Yes, I am very much a night owl. I am sure I am not alone; we never know what problems others have – something I try to get over to MOH. Sometimes, however, it’s hard not to let it get me down.

      2. The third person banned recently was Gunner – I didn’t see any of his posts before he went, but usually he’s zapped for bad language.

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