814 thoughts on “Friday 18 October: With an historic agreement achieved it is for MPs to put country before party”

    1. And to you.
      A bit bleary eyed this morning, not a very settled night.
      So, what of the Boris Deal?
      Is it a fair deal for Britain or is it a rehashed and reheated May Deal Surrender?
      Time will tell.

      3. Time? About ten seconds reading the top BTL comments on any Telegraph article that allows the serfs to squeak.

      5. It’s a stitch up and BRINO. I only hope it’s voted down, then Bojo has got a deal so the Benn Surrender Act is nullified, but the EU says no extension anyway and with one bound we are free at Halloween.

    3. Good morning, Peddy. Are you as confused about the Boris/EU deal as I am? The instant it was announced all the pundits and politicians started screaming that it was brilliant and/or terrible. Remainers, of course, hate any deal en masse. But Leavers seem to be as confused as I am. Some (who view Boris favourably) consider it a master-stroke; others (convinced we will never really leave) are equally sure that his deal is a Surrender Document, not much (if at all) better than that of Theresa May.

      Once it was announced yesterday the actual document was printed in one of the online papers, but I found it far too complicated to understand. Now opinions differ: one person opined that the £39 billion “divorce fee” would still have to be paid, yet another claimed it had been reduced to “just” £33 billion. Then one person claimed we had not regained our fishing rights, but another claimed that we had. The Brexit Party seems to have split into a For/Against Boris’ Deal party, with one wing saying “It’s not perfect but it’s good enough” and the other wing saying “Anything less than perfection is unacceptable and betrays those who voted Leave in the Referendum”. I personally am more of a pragmatist (“Nothing in life is perfect”) but I must confess that at present I am totally confused.

      All I can say is that in the 3-plus years since Article 50 was triggered the EU adopted the stance that negotiations would occur in their preferred order: first a discussion and conclusion of future trading agreements and only then how and when we would leave. This was accepted without demur by Mrs May – a fatal mistake. Now, Boris has reversed that order. We (apparently) will leave at the end of this month and only then will we start to discuss trading terms, with a 14 month period in which to do it and in a strong position from which to negotiate. After all, if no agreement can be reached we can always do a Charles de Gaulle, say “Non” and walk away.

      By presenting Parliament (flooded with Remainers) with a simple option: “Accept my deal or we leave without a deal”, Boris – in my view – has cleverly negated the Benn Surrender Act which would have forced him (had a deal not been concluded) to ask for an extension which would have served no-one. Furthermore, if the Remainers had refused to support this deal then they in effect would have been accepting a clean break (No Deal). It seems to me to be a win-win situation for Boris and his Government, and he will “undoubtedly” shortly announce a new General Election. I put the word “undoubtedly” in inverted commas, because in this current climate its seems that the situation changes almost by the hour and anything could happen.

      But if I am right and a rapid General Election clears Parliament of the odious Remainer MPs then, with a strong majority, the next (Conservative) government can proceed with moving the country forward unimpeded.

      1. A brilliant summing-up, Elsie. I feel the same way & wish that all the mindless speculators on here would STFU.

        There are one or two on here who repeat the same rubbish several times a day, day in, day out.

      2. Martin Howe QC has said that the deal is far from perfect and there are worrying clauses in it. For me, that sets warning bells clanging. One cannot, unfortunately, expect the EU to deal fairly and as it will be the ECJ which is the arbiter of disputes, I foresee the phrase “level playing field”, substituted for “EU alignment”, will be open to interpretation which won’t be in our favour. It strikes me very much as being like the Treaty which was the Constitution in all but name; a word tweaked here and there, but essentially the same. People, however, are so sick of it they will grasp at any straw to get “a deal” over the line, regardless of the consequences in the future. I myself voted for “no deal” (ie a clean exit). I won’t accept BRINO.

        1. A fair enough view, Conners, but I find it impossible to judge. I take your point about not accepting BRINO as a substitute for Brexit, but – even though it is a crucial decision for the future of our country – sometimes discretion is better than valour. In principle I would never give over my cash if threatened, but a gun to my head would certainly change my mind. And I believe that leaving the EU with Boris’ “deal” is the first step in moving forwards. I reckon it would lead to a General Election, which in turn would drain the swamp of Remainers and thus help us all to move forward. To simply reject his deal “on principle” would in my mind just lead to more and more uncertainty and chaos. And I don’t see a more suitable replacement PM. Anyhow, that’s enough from me today as I have lots more of other jobs to do. Play nicely (© Bill Thomas) and see you all tomorrow.

          1. Happy completion of your jobs, Elsie. My worry is once trapped in, we won’t get out. I don’t have sufficient confidence in voters to overcome their inertia and vote for something new and radical in order to drain the swamp. I foresee, “oh that nice Mr Johnson, he’s got us a deal so I’ll vote for him”. Then he reneges once elected and no one can do anything about it. I have become terribly cynical in my old age. I am reminded of the joke where the Devil is showing a newly departed soul around H3ll. The doors of the lift open at the bottom and it’s all beautifully sunlit, pretty girls wander around with free drinks and everyone looks happy. The punter is amazed and mutters that it wasn’t at all what he had been told. He went back up to make up his mind and thought that Heaven looked quite nice, but H3ll was more exciting, so he chose H3ll. When he arrived at the bottom of the shaft and the doors opened, however, the place was black and sulphurous. People were in rags and miserable. No pretty girls with drinks, only old hags. The punter protested that this wasn’t what he’d been offered. “Ah, yes,” replied the Devil. “Yesterday we were campaigning, but today you’ve voted”.

          2. “My worry is once trapped in, we won’t get out.” So your solution is to reject the deal and apply for another extension? Or for Boris to resign? And how would that help improve matters?

          3. No, my solution is to get out on October 31st. Run the clock down, filibuster, go to gaol, if necessary. Invoke the Civil Contingencies Act, if need be. Point to Magna Carta and lawful rebellion. Short of nuking Brussels I’d do anything to avoid staying in.

  2. I wonder why Brussels demands legal immunity for all EU personnel governing Britain during the “transition period”, which seemingly could go on forever.. ?

    1. Legal immunity for legislators is the sort of arrangement one expects from a banana republic.

      1. Ideal for any inside trading billionaire investors who could use legislators for their own benefit.

    2. Immunity for EC bureaucrats/functionaries/officials is a key aspect of all EU Treaties since the year dot.
      Taxation privileges also they have about which they keep schtum.

  3. Good morning all. A chilly start to the day.

    Question. Are remainiacs happy with the “deal”? If so – it is a disaster.

    1. One of the twenty one Tory remainiacs was interviewed by the BBC this morning, and he “guaranteed” that all twenty one would be voting for the deal.

      There’s the message, loud and clear!

      1. Dominic Raab was supporting it on BBC Radio 4 News this morning but Letwin was saying he would only vote for WA2 if Benn’s Bil to delay Brexit was left on the table.

      2. I am much obliged to my learned friend for her helpful clarification.

        Sickening, isn’t it?

    1. You are obviously very keen on Caroline Lucas to maintain her two days in a row…{:¬))

    2. Good for you; it’ll keep your mind off all this nonsensical Brexit speculation.

      Morning, Delboy. Feeling better?

      1. Yep. I have accepted that it will take some time to return to normality and I am trying to enjoy life under the restrictions that have been placed on me.

      2. I think that there is the answer to my earlier question to you. Most of today’s comment (from the MSM, NoTTLers and the general public) is pure nonsensical speculation. Let’s wait and see.

  5. Mprning All

    Spiked on the Ecoloons

    For more than a week now the XR elitists have been disrupting

    everyday life. They’ve stopped flights from taking off, preventing

    people from going on well-earned holidays or visiting loved ones abroad.

    They’ve clogged up roads in city centres, irritating cab drivers and

    people on buses. And they’ve stormed Smithfield meat market and

    Billingsgate fish market – smug middle-class vegans lecturing

    hard-working traders about the correct way to think and live.

    But today their sneering campaigning went too far. Today they

    disrupted the Tube. Yes, this mass, largely electric public-transport

    system used by millions of people is the latest target of these arrogant

    disrupters of the masses’ lives. And people got pissed off. Really

    pissed off.

    https://www.spiked-online.com/2019/10/17/finally-a-rebellion-against-extinction-rebellion/

    Meanwhile,Mystic Rik is still on form Briish Transport Police (noticeable by their absence) are going after the public that dealt with the nutters

    https://twitter.com/ADroiteGirl/status/1184934045932834817

    Replies are not supportive…………

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/5e85f0826a02514b1f56a17863de0cb35e9f37297912791507cf5514a861c61b.jpg

    1. Morning Rik. The Thought Police appealing for help! I wouldn’t send them Jack the Rippers phone number!

      1. To celebrate this fantastic brexit deal, I bought a shirt made from golden retriever fur .

        The wife says I look quite fetching in it .

      2. Well done Bob,have some more ammo
        It seems a pity that the elderly gentlemanh who was soooooo concerned about his grandchlidren that he glued himself to a DLR train hadn’t taken action much earlier
        And glued hinself to a Kebab shop in Rotherham

        1. Why didn’t the tube just set off as per the timetable? I know that those protesters on the roof would have been knocked senseless when they hit the tunnel and that the Superglue Gang would have ended up without an arm (or two?) but self-inflicted wounds are just that. If I change to the wrong lane and drive my car head on into a juggernaut thundering in the opposite direction, I can hardly blame the other driver or sue him, even if I should survive the crash.

          1. My sentiments exactly, Elsie. The message should be “place yourself in danger and we will oblige”!

      4. Why can I only see a very large space?
        Is it a symbolic representation of the Remainers’ brains?

    4. ‘Morning, Rik. I wondered how long it would be before the perlice went after the victims and not the perpetrators. I reckon yesterday’s antics will be far more effective than any number of arrests. Finally the tide is turning against the eco-loons, no thanks to the so-called forces of law and order, whose pathetic response has only served to encourage law-breaking on an unprecedented scale.

    5. I understand it was said the protester “panicked” and kicked out. Silly prat shouldn’t have put himself in such a situation in the first place. Notably two of the protesters were a Catholic friar and a seventy-odd year old Anglican vicarette. Just shows what’s happened to the Churches of late.

  6. Ding dong…..

    Remainers like the Boris deal alert………

    Matt Chorley @MattChorley

    Remainer Stuart Rose, who was chairman of the main Britain Stronger in Europe campaign against Brexit, tells @BBCr4today he backs Johnson’s deal. “We have got to move on… reflect on pros and cons… lean in…” Big PR boost for the PM.

    1. Yes Polly, but he is not in a position to vote tomorrow. It is our disgusting traitorous MPs who need to be persuaded.

    2. Stuart Rose is an irrelevance.
      Whether he was for or against the current deal, I really wouldn’t bother.
      Pay heed to the likes of Bill Cash and Martin Howe.

  7. Good morning from a Saxon Queen .

    The most important thing is to get over the Brèxit line by the 31/ 10/ 19
    It’ll be the start of a long road, deals can be changed and we can
    pick at the things we don’t like and remove them at our choosing
    if they don’t benefit us.
    An extension beyond the 31/ 10 / 19 would lead to another referendum
    etc .. taking years and there are powerful forces still trying to prevent
    It in its entirety. The most important thing is to get over the line
    on the 31st to just get it done and then progress from there instead
    Of constant battles with those who’d rattle away about detentions
    and other referendums.. assuming parliament will support it
    there is still the no deal option if push comes to shove.

      1. Given where we were it is a very good deal. If May had not messed things up and we had not had MP’s trying to undermine the negotiations the deal could have been improved upon but it is a perfectly acceptable deal. Just not as good as it could have been

        1. Enjoy arguing with the EU for years about free trade and having to give up most or all new freedoms to get it.

          When it’s all done by about 2025 or later, Brits look likely to be back where they started.

          No Deal is the only solution.

          1. I am afraid you are totally wrong. No deal does not resolve the NI border issue nor does it resolve obtaining a trade deal with the EU

            Under Boris’s dea;l there is an 15 month transition windows where trade talks take place. That is ample time as long as you have someone that can and wants to reach a deal

          2. The EU shows no sign of wanting a genuine deal but every sign of wanting to rip off and punish Britain.

            I think you’re far too trusting and credulous.

          3. WE have the choice well except NI. WE can at the end of the 15 months choose to trade with the EU on WTO terms and there is nothing they can do about it. In my view that would be a bad choice and reaching a trade deal with the EU would be far more sensible and we are now in a very strong negotiating position as the EU exports far more to use than we do to them.

          5. Thjat is simply wrong. If we go to WTO there is nothing at all the EU can do as the agreement allows it

          8. Economics and trade are only a part of our relationship with the EU.

            Many people voted on the sovereignty issues which have not been properly resolved by Johnson’s surrender WA.

          9. And if the EU takes the stance that they refuse to give way on anything, what then? Yet another 15 months wasted.

            The deal gives windows alright, open windows to cause as much damage to the UK as they possibly can and all under the auspices of the European Court as the final arbiter.

          11. So why not now, which removes the EU’s ability to do quite as much damage.

            I get the impression that you want the UK to be as badly harmed as possible.

          12. First we have not left yet and second during the transition period we carry on trading with the EU tariff free so it is pointless to do anything before then

          14. The French love the EU and simply ignore EU rules that they don’t like.

            We should be very much more French in our approach to the EU before or after we leave either for real or just nominally.

          15. Our greatest danger is the enemy within.
            Time for a spot of Cicero:

            “A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear.”

            ― Marcus Tullius Cicero

          16. The probability is if Boris gets this deal through he will try to get a general election as otherwise the other parties will try to block every piece of legislation

          17. Yes. Blocking a general election has been part of the strategy of the enemy within.
            A very understandable action from their point of view.

          20. Martin Selmayr said some time ago that the price of Brexit is the loss of Northern Ireland.

            He’s absolutely right, isn’t he!

          22. No deal automatically puts high tariffs on food and cars. Why an earth would you want to choose to do that when we can trade with the EU for th next 15 months tariffs free

          23. Are you deliberately missing the point (again)? We can import food from the rest of the world. We can import cars from the rest of the world. we will decide what tariffs are applied.
            These are amongst the benefits of leaving.

        2. If Boris Johnson was made Prime Minster 3 years ago
          instead of us wasting time with Theresa Mayhem then
          we’d already have left by now. It’s a perfectly acceptable
          deal and one we can change along the line for us.
          We can’t change anything if it’s a case of another 3 years
          listening to those bleat on about another referendum.

          2. ‘Morning, Ethel, “If Boris Johnson was made Prime Minster 3 years ago instead of us wasting time with Theresa Mayhem…”

            You may blame back-stabby Gove for that.

          3. And there is every reason to suppose that a second ‘Leave’ referendum will be disregarded, just like the first one – unless, of course, it goes the way the establishment desires.

      2. Leaving on the 31/ 10 / 19 is imperative Polly,
        It’s the start of a long road where many changes will
        Of course need to be made and we can drop things
        we don’t like, probably many things. But we really
        have to cross the line by the 31/ 10/ 19 or Brèxit
        Will never happen at all, It’ll go on for many more
        years with calls for another referendum.
        Of course if parliament are going to be difficult,
        there is always the no deal option, no one can
        say Boris Johnson rushed out without a deal
        but if needs must.

        3. Morning, Alf’s Daughter.
          The deal’s not perfect. It’s a start; the first step on a long road.
          But it does alter our relationship with the EU (a declining moribund organisation that will soon implode).
          Getting out is the equivalent of escaping a burning building but having to leave some precious belongings behind. Take a deep breath and start all over again.

          1. Unfortunately Anne, May’s deal made us responsible for part of the EU’s debts if (when?) the EU implodes.

          2. We will see.
            I await the verdict of people with more time and a better grasp of the minutiae.

          4. Yes, the British public have been fooled. Have you seen the crowing of delight on the BBC website?

            “The EU and UK have reached an agreement widely hailed by European leaders as a significant step. But the deal still has to get past the UK Parliament, so why does Europe appear so keen?

            1) Lots of it is the same

            Ninety-five per cent of this revised deal is the deal agreed with Prime Minister Boris Johnson’s predecessor, Theresa May, during two years of painstaking negotiations.”

          5. For the sake of my blood pressure, I avoid the Beeb at all costs, whether online or on TV. I am annoyed enough at being forced to fund it in order to watch other channels.

          6. I don’t want to leave behind fish and farming. Fish will become kippers and our wheat will become toast.

    2. ‘Morning, Ethel. Better still would be a GE, to restore the majority, or better, that May squandered in one of the worst campaigns in living memory.

    1. Why not? They’ve apparently convinced another sap of a British PM that their WA/PD, with slight amendments, is a good deal. From what has leaked out, “Taking back control,” is the last thing Johnson has achieved. Moving the ‘level playing field’ from the WA to the PD FTA negotiations will be claimed by Johnson as a success but with his desire for a FTA at any cost this move is smoke and mirrors. I’m awaiting Lawyers for Britain to destroy this deal as they did May’s mess.

        1. Doesn’t take Brain of Britain to work that out, Bill. ‘Team Boris’ in Brussels had learned nothing from the May/Robbins debacle or maybe they had no desire to.

  9. Are the Greens called that because they are Green behind the Ears?

    I was listening to the Greens deputy leader being interviewed on LBC over Boris’s Brexit deal. To say it was embarrassing would be a gross understatement. She came out with all sorts of ridiculous and false claims ie their would be massive disruption at Dover. The deal makes it very clear that their will be no delays and goods will flow through Dover freely. her next attempt was delays at the NI border that was even more bizarre as there will be no border
    She then went on about us not being in regulatory compliance with the EU . which is more nonsense and on day 1 we will be after that it is a choice for example if a small company is making a product only for the UK market they would not need to comply with EU standard but only UK standards
    She seem to think as well that as we may not be in regulatory compliance we could not export goods to the EU. She clearly knows nothing at all about how compliance works just because you have regulatory alignment does not mean a product is approved. The way the EU system works for most goods you have to self declare a product meets the relevant EU legislation you do this by producing a Technical File and a Signed Declaration olf Conformity. The other bit being you put a CE label on the product Being in regulatory alignment or not is totally irrelevant

    I just hope these Green idiots never gain power . AS an aside I have found out what has happened to one of their previous leaders Natalie Bennett. They have put her in the Lords. How an earth they can put someone that in my view has about Zero competence in their I do not know.. She is now a part of the process for scrutinising UK legislation

    1. Chukkus Yermoney was given free rein on Toady earlier…6% drop in wages…6.5% drop in something else…back to the 2008 crash all over again…blah blah blah…

      What a prat.

  11. What do you dislike about Boris Deal (Details please)

    What do you like about Boris Deal (Details please)

    1. What I like is the fact that the EU has ruled out any possible extension, so I’m praying that the Saturday Morning Pictures attendees throw out the Boris ‘Deal’ and, because there’s no extension and no time for GE or more referenda, we leave by default on Hallowe’en with only a WTO Deal.

      What’s not to like – especialy the Remainer and Lefty faces lookig like they’ve all been sucking lemons.

      1. I like it, NTN, except that the EU is not renowned for sticking by its own rules or pronouncements (unless it’s “we hate democracy” and “ever closer union”).

        2. Maybe we should have independence referendums in both Scotland and Northern Ireland before the next general election. I don’t know how intense the Welsh hatred of the English is but maybe we should have an independence referendum in Wales too.

          2. It is not about hate. It is about being modestly proud of your country. It is about wishing to be independent. It is about looking after your own affairs for your own benefit.
            Just as the UK voted for independence from the EU. We do not hate Europeans. We love some of them; the chic, the fashionable, the strictly correct, the colourful. We just don’t want them to tell us what to do.

      2. That though is simply wrong. May deal kept us in the Customs Union and single market and had a backstop we could not get out of and it had a 2 year transition period

        With Boris deal we are out of the EU on the 1st November. WE are out of the Customs Union and Single market on that date, From that date we can negotiate and implement trade deals (There are some differences for NI) THe transition period is 15 months

        1. “…From that date we can negotiate and implement trade deals…”

          Untrue. See WA for details, please.

    3. These strikes are a test, to see if yr neighbour shuts his/her shop.
      The prison sentences for the regional Catalan politicians were severe by English standards, but they had been spending loads of public money on stuff that was not allowed, so criminal charges were inevitable.

    1. Exactly, and the desperate lemming like rush for a vote tomorrow looks like a total stitch up.

    2. I made the point some years ago that the bumstop was a red herring wrapped up in an enema in order to be plopped out in triumph as the panacea for Brexit constipation when an otherwise inadequate WA was agreed. Many Nottlers agreed with me at the time.

      1. Yes I think a lot of us have seen this coming for a long time. No matter how long an extension, a deal is always done at the last minute with maximum drama. The backstop is removed at the last minute, a famous victory is declared and we enter into vassal status.

        It is amazing to me that none of the MSM has mentioned anything unsavoury in the WA, all the focus is on the backstop. It is only smaller sites likes NOTTL, TCW, Brexit Central etc which tell the whole story.

  15. Morning, Campers.
    this article particularly hit home after talking last night to an exhausted friend who works as a project manager in London. Thanks to the Crusties his day has now increased from 13 hours to 15. And precious little work can be done at the barricaded building because the lorries can’t get through to deliver the goods.

    Jan Moir in the DM.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7586393/Londoners-fed-XR-matters-hands.html

    “Enough is enough. Following a long, hot summer of delays and travel frustrations caused by Extinction Rebellion and their preposterous protesters, fed-up Londoners yesterday took matters into their own hands.

    After two protesters attempted to shut down the Jubilee Line by climbing on top of a train at Canning Town, they were dragged down by furious commuters. An uprising at last! Hurrah.

    The well-dressed men — in nice jackets and shoes, one of them had a bouncy ponytail — had scrambled up to unfurl a banner that read: ‘Business As Usual — Death.’

    That was enraging enough in itself: it was in reference to the commerce carried out in the nearby City of London. While eco-warriors may turn their noses up at capitalism, this is what stops this country from turning into one giant mud field, with a few turnips rotting in the gutters where Kent once stood.

    Enough is enough. Following a long, hot summer of delays and travel frustrations caused by Extinction Rebellion and their preposterous protesters, fed-up Londoners yesterday took matters into their own hands

    After two protesters attempted to shut down the Jubilee Line by climbing on top of a train at Canning Town, they were dragged down by furious commuters. An uprising at last! Hurrah

    The well-dressed men — in nice jackets and shoes, one of them had a bouncy ponytail — had scrambled up to unfurl a banner that read: ‘Business As Usual — Death’

    However, the only business going down at Canning Town was the bubbling frustration of the commuters. Who are as mad as hell and are not going to take this any more.

    Look at them. They are the normals, the everyday civilians, the overlooked ordinary Joes just trying to get to work. Or desperate to get home after a draining night shift.

    Hard-working people who never get a favour or a lucky break or the opportunity to smugly tell everyone about how they have just offset their carbon footprint and have solar panels on the swimming pool roof.

    The only footprints they make are on the commuter trudge to and from work — only this time to find themselves thwarted by smug do-gooders protesting about the state of the planet. Somebody threw a cup of tea over them right at the beginning, so matters were clearly fraught.

    One of the rabble was Mark Ovland, 36, who gave up his full-time Buddhist teacher training studies this year to join XR as a ‘full-time protester’. Full-time waste of space, more like. I wonder who is funding his disputatious lifestyle? You don’t need me to tell you. Probably all of us.

    However, the only business going down at Canning Town was the bubbling frustration of the commuters. Who are as mad as hell and are not going to take this any more

    Ovland was booted off the train roof by a furious-looking bloke in a tracksuit top. Even Buddha himself couldn’t save him from falling into the maw of the crowd.

    He could have been beaten to a pulp by travellers driven mad by the fact they had missed their connection, had not other commuters formed a protective ring of padded jackets around him.

    I mean, hang on chaps. We might be angry but we are still British.

    I don’t condone the violence and the ugly scenes, but I have to be honest. I wanted to cheer the pugnacious commuters to the rafters. For ordinary citizens were doing what the police have so dismally failed to do this year, which was to stop one of these XR events in its tracks. One has to wonder why this XR mob were always treated with such kid gloves, even as the city ground to a halt around them.

    One thrilled-looking granny who had glued herself to the top of a train yesterday had a safety helmet popped on her head, a harness wrapped around her body and clearly a nice chat and a laugh with the police officers who unglued her.

    These demonstrators put themselves in harm’s way. They should not be treated by the police like naughty children while law-abiding citizens are expected to suck up the disturbance without complaint.

    The right to protest ends when you violate the rights of others to go about their daily business. That is not protest, it is civil disobedience.

    There is no way that holding up commuters is going to make them sympathetic to your cause — surely Extinction Rebellion and their pathetic celebrity eco-terrorist chums must see this is a warning of what is to come?

    Certainly, my patience ran out long ago. There is a lot of good in their cause, but they preach an apocalyptic rhetoric of death, claiming billions of people are going to die soon because of climate change.

    Billions? Come off it. Co-founder Roger Hallam even promises that ‘your children are going to die of starvation’ unless the economy is completely transformed in five years.

    They talk of imminent catastrophe, mass suffering and deaths, but science doesn’t back this up. (Hallam has said it is ‘great fun taking down capitalists’. So at least he’s honest about that.)

    The alarmist language is bad enough, but a lot of goodwill is being washed away by their hardline stance and the utter ghastliness of many of their supporters.

    The well-to-do grandparents, the trust fund kids, the anarchists, the Octavias, the Ruperts, the Buddhist students, the grungsters, the unemployed, the bored, the Benedict Cumberbatches and the rest.

    The elites are on the wrong side on this one, supporting this mass, inchoate movement so fond of hysterics and superglue.

    Once, XR fought against public indifference. Now, they must contend with public rage. Good.”

    2. “There is a lot of good in their cause”. Intolerance eventually leads to “Arbeit macht frei”.

    3. “They should not be treated by the police like naughty children while
      law-abiding citizens are expected to suck up the disturbance without
      complaint.”

      Naughty children deserve all the slaps they get.

      As for the billions going to die of starvation – perhaps we need a population cull – we are shewn the billions who need our water-aid and food-aid money on the nightly charidee shows, so what’s new.

      1. Hardly any of these charity adverts are specific. Who are the people at risk – are they all wide-eyed children? How many of them? Where are they – specifically village/town/district/country? Who else is giving them aid – our Government with our money?
        How much of donations is spent on admin/travel/salaries of executives and CEO?

        1. There is one particularly noxious advert (possibly Oxfam) which claims “no child is born to die”. What? Nobody is immortal. We are ALL of us born to die! Death and taxes are the only inevitabilities in life!

    4. One has to wonder why this XR mob were always treated with such kid gloves, even as the city ground to a halt around them.

      You should read Nottl Jan. The last free speech publication in the UK!

    1. A quote regarding Johnson, from David Cameron:

      “The thing about the greased piglet is that he manages to slip through other people’s hands where mere mortals fail.”

  17. Good Morning Nottlers.
    Now I understand why Parliament must convene and vote on the Sabbath.
    Monday is Trafalgar Day.

  19. Good morning thinkers

    Reposting my comment from yesterday evening.

    One thing that alarms me re Brexit , if it is a reality .. We are kettled in with some of the stabby stabby nasties and Allah praising Halal chomping, kiddy fiddlers, Eastern European scammers, murderers, thieves abusers and the rest .. and there is no chance of repatriating the rubbish that has accumulated at the tax payers expense ..

    So if we are going to be on our own , how do we deal with the disaster that has descended on us re all this criminal activity ?

    1. One step at a time, Belle.
      Let’s get out first. Work can quietly be done in the background.

        1. Actually, no I don’t.
          I’m as cynical as the next b’stard, but occasionally, there is a case to be made for positive thinking.
          Now off to do my mature office junior day, so play nicely, Folks.

          2. An injection Bill?

            We had our flu jabs a couple of days ago .. village chemist shop had an appointment system .. no waiting around ..Better than waiting in busy doctor’s surgery . The chemist was efficient , clean with jab , and I didn’t feel a thing!

    2. ‘Morning, Mags, cheer up, it looks like the population at large are about to take the law into their own hands. After they’ve seen off the Extinction Revellers, they may well turn on the, “stabby stabby nasties and Allah praising Halal chomping, kiddy fiddlers, Eastern European scammers, murderers, thieves abusers and the rest…”

      The Police have demonstrated that, while becoming a ‘service’ (to the crims) they remain as much a farce as the Keystone Cops.

  20. Where is Priti Awful? Why isn’t she out and about castigating the Anarchists, the slammer kiddy fiddlers etc etc?

    Another useless “minister”.

    1. For Heaven’s sake, Willum, the woman has only been in office for a short time.
      I would also add that the Crusties are doing a very good job of condemning themselves. It ill be very difficult for them to play the victim card after this week.
      The Met (among other police ‘authorities’) needs a through cleanse, but the rot has taken such a deep hold that a few short weeks isn’t long enough.
      We need to apply the equivalent of Round-Up to most of the British establishment.

      1. Sorry if I touched a nerve, Anne.

        We’ll have to agree to differ. Mrs Patel said that she would sort out the perlice and make criminals fearful. Fine.

        For over a week, chunks of London have been blocked by the anarchists. The public has been very badly affected.
        The perlice have done very little – and that far too late.

        The Home Office is responsible for police in England and Wales. I would have expected the Home Secretary – even though she has only been in office a short time – to have come out in public and castigated the anarchists (of course) AND the police for their hopelessness in dealing with the situation.

  21. Deal or no deal?

    By JOHNREDWOOD | Published: OCTOBER 18, 2019

    The Withdrawal Agreement is unchanged, so I have no need to update my comments on it which set out the problems with it, especially concerning the powers of the ECJ and the money.

    The Political Declaration is improved. It now makes it clearer that any joint military actions requires the consent of the UK government. More emphasis is given to basing a future trade relationship around a Free Trade Agreement.

    The Declaration whilst confirming we become an independent coastal state for fishing purposes puts our fish back into play with the prospect of a new fishing quota and access based agreement with the EU.

    It suggests the future agreement is based on an EU Association Agreement, designed to get countries to converge with the EU prior to joining. This is not a good model. The ECJ remains supreme over issues of EU law in any dispute.

    The reworked Northern Ireland protocol raises the issue of how could Northern Ireland extricate from following EU rules and customs practices?

    This is an important question, as this draft Withdrawal Treaty does not have an Article 50 allowing unilateral exit .

    1. The UK declared an ‘independent coastal state’ is good but comes with caveats. From https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld201617/ldselect/ldeucom/78/7806.htm
      concerning continued obligations after a Brexit. Just 2 points regarding EU access.

      “Accessing the Exclusive Economic Zone EEZ
      35.Another fundamental change relates to access to fishing in the UK EEZ. Under international law, any decision to allow foreign vessels access to fish in UK waters will be a matter for bilateral negotiation and agreement between the UK and other coastal states. In the words of Prof Churchill:

      “There is a distinction between what is said in the UN Convention on the Law of the Sea and what tends to happen in practice. … as far as the Convention is concerned … if in a particular coastal state’s EEZ the coastal state is capable of harvesting the entire allowable catch, it is under no obligation to allow any other fishermen from other states to fish there, so it can take the whole of the allowable catch. Where an obligation to admit other fishers comes in—again, this is on the theory of the convention—that is where the coastal state does not take the whole of the allowable catch and there is a surplus. It must admit other states to the surplus, but again it has a discretion … but only where there is a surplus.”52

      36.Prof Barnes concurred, noting that “there are obligations to provide a surplus where we cannot catch [the TAC], so, regardless of whether we are in or out of Europe, that would still apply”.53 Where such a surplus exists, Article 62(3) of UNCLOS will require the UK to minimise the economic dislocation in states whose nationals have habitually fished in a given EEZ and have made substantial efforts in research and identification of stocks.54 The NEF argued that EU Member States were likely to draw on this article to claim a right of continued access to fishing in the UK EEZ if the UK were to close off access entirely.55 This point was also raised by Dr Bryce Stewart, Lecturer at the University of York, who noted: “For the last 30 years, a lot of European nations have been fishing in British EEZs”.”

  22. Brexit: ‘Devil in the detail’ as Northern Ireland business chiefs give deal a wary welcome

    Former DUP Finance Minister Simon Hamilton gave the Brexit deal a cautious welcome yesterday as ex-party colleagues rejected it on the basis of customs, consent and VAT provisions.
    Mr Hamilton is now chief executive of the Belfast Chamber of Trade, one of many business groups to give the agreement a tentatively favourable reception.
    Entrepreneur Bill Wolsey, whose Beannchor company owns a string of hotels, pizza restaurants and bars, said the pact was better than a no-deal Brexit.
    Mr Wolsey also urged local politicians to turn it to Northern Ireland’s advantage.

    1. It’s a scene from “The Shawshank Redemption” where the prisoner Andy has just escaped from prison.

      1. Morning Aeneas thanksfor the explanation. I have missed that film which I see gets good reports. I shall hunt it down.

    1. Enjoy!
      How long do you get there, and do you have free time?
      St Olav’s Cathedral is nice, as is a bar called Cardinal about 5 mins walk away. Take your gold card.

      1. Just a day unfortunately, and I’m suffering a dreadful lurgie sustained after spending two hours on stag between 2 and 4am waiting for the Northern Lights to make an appearance, which they did not.

      2. It looks a very attractive town from the little I’ve seen. We’re sailing at 1630h so can’t re-enact your last stand.

  25. Morning

    SIR – You ask whether it is too much for MPs to put country before party. We may very soon discover that the answer to your question is “Yes”.

    Justice Hawkins
    Nottingham

    SIR – At long last a deal agreed. But before the ink is dry on the paper the usual suspects are lining up to rubbish it. I’m losing the will to live.

    John Taylor
    Purley, Surrey

    SIR – After three years of negotiations, the British Government and the EU have at last agreed a Brexit deal.

    However, opposition parties, notably the SNP, Labour and the Liberal Democrats, will never accept this or any other agreement, whatever its contents, as they want to remain in the EU – ignoring the decision made by the British people.

    A J C Gorman
    Ickenham, Middlesex

    1. AJC, this “deal” ignores the decision made by the British people, which was to leave, without a deal, and regain our freedom and control over our country. How can we do that when we are still subject to the ECJ?

  26. Savile Row in firing line as US tariffs hit the UK

    Sean Dixon, co-founder of Richard James, says the Savile Row tailor feels “a bit like collateral damage”.
    He and the other bespoke tailoring firms who line the world-famous London street feel bruised because, from Friday, every suit they sell to the US faces a new export tax of 25%.

    The street has had little time to prepare for the tariff, which almost doubles the tax on an exported suit from roughly 13% to 25%.
    On 2 October, the World Trade Organisation (WTO) gave the US permission to impose taxes on $7.5bn (£5.8bn) of goods it imports from the EU.

    2. Sales of luxury goods are price inelastic. That means sales are little affected by price rises. Savile Row tailoring, where a suit will cost between £5000 and sky’s the limit, might be described as luxury goods.

    4. They should be in favour of leaving then, as since we’re no longer part of the EU we can have our own tariff rate.

  27. SIR – Family members and even old friends have fallen out over Brexit. In America the same has happened over President Trump. I cannot recall a time when otherwise intelligent folk have become so personal and vindictive over matters on which their influence is so limited. What should these things portend?

    John Pritchard
    Ingatestone, Essex

  28. Daily Brexit Betrayal

    Sir John Redwood, unmissable as always, has his usual, terse Diary entry, writing this morning:

    “The Withdrawal Agreement is unchanged, so I have no

    need to update my comments on it which set out the problems with it,

    especially concerning the powers of the ECJ and the money.”

    He then points out:

    “It [the Political Declaration] suggests the

    future agreement is based on an EU Association Agreement, designed to

    get countries to converge with the EU prior to joining. This is not a

    good model. The ECJ remains supreme over issues of EU law in any

    dispute.”

    Right there is the crucial point for us ‘hard core’

    Leavers. Nigel Farage’s rejection of the thing now makes more sense and

    should not be interpreted as sour grapes. Meanwhile some of the Spartans

    have broken rank while others, wisely, kept their powder dry:

    https://independencedaily.co.uk/your-daily-brexit-betrayal-friday-18th-october-2019/

  29. The Turning Point for Extinction Rebellion

    With their prolonged disruptive protests they had been losing support. Their protests at Canary Wharf though was the big turning point and most people no longer support them. They may regain a bit of support but they are probably a spent force now and are seen for what they are which i anarchists

    2. Earlier in the year, he was to be the saviour accoding to NTTL generally. How the mighty have fallen in estimation.

      2. What has happened to Jacob Rees-Mogg is a quandary. He has more money than many deities, so he cannot be bribed. When you have people like that who won’t be bought and have principles, the globalists stop pretending to be nice and can get quite nasty.

        Jacob has several children, and those who start wars killing millions of people are not squeamish about issuing threats. We have seen several “prominent people” who were embarrassing to the elites die in a number of ways.

        I am disappointed with the words that are coming out of his mouth now, but he was a “good guy” in the past. He looked honestly shocked when he realised that Theresa May was working for the EU to sell out our country. Quite a few of the ERG, but not all, have suddenly “seen the light” and converted to this terrible deal.

        Or someone has threatened them with a sudden end to their existence. This is the enemy that we face.

          1. I did see one member of the ERG, whose name I do not know, on the news as he was walking down the street. He was having none of it and clearly is one of the few real Conservatives left. So there are still some about.

    3. You are being too kind, he knows that this deal has unfavourable ramifications for the country if voted through.

      His loyalty is to party before country, in that respect there is nothing to differentiate him with the rest of them with just a few honourable exceptions.

      I pray such behaviour is punished at the ballot box soon.

  32. No one

    has the power to close illegal schools, the head of Ofsted has admitted,

    as it emerged that a headteacher who has been prosecuted vowed to

    continue operating.

    Amanda Spielman, the chief inspector, said that inspectors, local

    authorities and the Department for Education are all unable to shut down

    unregistered schools even when they are breaking the law.

    Her comments came after Nadia Ali, the headmistress of Ambassadors

    High in Streatham, south London, said the school will remain open.

    Last month Ms Ali and her father were both convicted under section 96

    of the Education and Skills Act after a court heard that they were

    running a full-time school “without the legal authority to do so”.

    The south London school, which describes itself as having an Islamic

    ethos, says it charges £2,500 a year per pupil and had 45 children on

    the roll at the time of its last inspection.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/10/17/no-one-has-power-close-illegal-schools-head-ofsted-admits/
    Slammers “We don’t need no stinking legal authority” “We are above the law”

  33. SIR – Once Brexit is resolved, we will need something new to argue about.

    Rejoin?

    Simon Shneerson
    Chorleywood, Hertfordshire

    As someone who deliberated for a long time before the Referendum vote, the question which persuaded me to vote Leave was “If we were not already in the EU, would I want to join it?”

      2. Actually, Betamax genuinely was the better system. It just didn’t have the smarts when it came to marketing. The same cannot be said for the EU, which is appalling but has a lot of media support.

  34. Tooba Gondal, 25, who is being held by Syrian rebel fighters close to the Turkish border, says she “wants her nightmare to end”, in her first interview since she fled from a Kurdish-run detention camp over the weekend.

    “I want to go home, see my family,” the former Goldsmiths, University of London, student said via WhatsApp messages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/10/17/british-isil-matchmaker-pleads-return-uk-escape-kurdish-run/
    Aye Right,I have a better idea,let’s send all your family out there for a visit,a permanent one

    1. There are some really stupid people out there. Did she not think through how going to help a terrorist organisation in a war zone might pan out? That people get killed and maimed, often horribly? That people are mean to each other?

      1. Cut her some slack, Ol! She’s a snowflake and spent most of her life in her “safe space”. Well, now she’s grown up. Welcome to reality, pet.

  35. DT letters BTL:

    Horton Hawkesbury 18 Oct 2019 12:21AM

    John Taylor: “At long last a deal agreed. But before the ink is dry on the paper the usual suspects are lining up to rubbish it.”

    That’s because it is the same rubbish as before but in a new bin bag.

  36. Apologies if this has been posted already:
    Martin Howe analysis today:

    “Many Brexit-supporting politicians voted for the May deal because they thought it was preferable to the risk of not getting Brexit through at all. But the improvements show it was right to reject the May deal. So I can understand a political judgment that the revised deal is tolerable as a price for the greater prize of regaining our freedom.
    The problem, however, is that, by law, the UK cannot ratify an Article 50 Withdrawal Agreement without an implementing Act of Parliament. A Bill has been drafted with 175 clauses and multiple schedules.
    The Government will have no control over what amendments are tabled by the last-ditch anti-Brexit majority in both Houses. Amendments could be made – for example either for a second referendum, or requiring the Government to negotiate changes to the deal – which would turn a just-tolerable deal into a disastrous one.”

    2. The sooner it’s rejected, the sooner we leave with NO DEAL on Hallowe’en.

      The EU has ruled out any further extension, thus obviating the need for Boris to write his pleading letter – we know the answer – thank God.

        1. Trust them not.
          There will ALWAYS be a get out clause, they still hope we’ll withdraw article 50 notice.

        2. It is just doing what the EU always does, playing games and spinning wheels within wheels. If this disastrous deal that Boris is pretending is leaving the EU gets through, then champagne corks will be popping in Brussels. The deal that they tried to get through 3 times with Theresa May will finally be passed and the United Kingdom will be tied to them for years.

          If something unforeseen happens, such as Downing Street being wiped from the face of the map by the spirit of King Arthur, then the EU will suddenly say “An extension is fine! Just keep following our rules and paying our bills.” As we know, the EU never says what it means, they always come at you sideways.

          https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/15f492e4c78790d44e93c258d20573f6dcb094bb52a076663cbe7aa3b1fa82c0.jpg

    3. To summarise, the problem with Boris’s deal is the anti-Brexit majority in Parliament. Well, I reckon the solution is now self-evident and it involves both constituency associations and the electorate.

      1. I reckon that all those who voted for A50 – all 498 of them – should be obliged to vote with the government tomorrow.

        Just a thought, or more of a fantasy if I’m honest…

        Instead of that, no doubt the usual suspects have gone scuttling off to a court somewhere, with the middle finger extended in our direction.

  38. Trump’s disgrace in the Middle East is the death of an empire. Vladimir Putin is Caesar now. 16 ours ago.

    No, I am not suggesting that the American empire will leave us quite like this. But last week’s deplorable abandonment of the Kurds, Trump’s wickedness in allowing the Turks – and their wretched “Arab” allies – to slaughter their way into northern Syria, will have the same effect as it did in antiquity. If you can no longer trust Rome, to which other empire do you turn?

    Well, Putin’s, of course. Tyrant he may be – but at least he’s sane. And his legions stayed out of the war in Syria and saved the Assad regime. They cleared the highways of Isis mines – they restored the roads, sometimes (incredibly) what were once Roman roads – and they learned Arabic. Perhaps, indeed, Putin now plays the role of the later Roman empire of the east, the Christian one which survived in>

    Morning everyone. Fisk, one suspects, would be glad to see the back of the American Empire regardless but even with Trump’s Syrian blunder it still remains the World’s most powerful State in every meaningful measure. A guide to this can be seen in yesterday’s meeting with Erdogan by Pence and Pompeo which judging by its result (instant capitulation) must have scared the bejazus (You don’t send both the Vice President and Secretary of State to exchange pleasantries) out of the Turkish President. The oddity of this is that it has compounded the original mistake. A pause in hostilities on the Syrian border is just what Putin wants in order to fudge a deal between Turkey and Syria while Erdogan has been politically humiliated in front of his domestic support. The Turkish President is going to Moscow next week where Vlad will soothe his pride and tell him that he can still come out ahead if he settles with Assad and allies himself with Russia and Iran to counteract American meddling in the Middle East. He will agree. What other choice does he have? As to Putin, he’s not yet Caesar, except perhaps in his political gifts; more Sertorius in his opposition to the world’s predominant power.

    https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/trump-putin-middle-east-syria-turkey-empire-washington-rome-a9159756.html

      1. Auric Goldfinger? Oddjob? Rosa Klebb? The Barclay Brothers? Polly Parrot? Jeremy Corbyn? Jean Claude Juncker? Jean Paul Belmondo? Peddy? Socrates? Anne Allen’s Spartie?

    2. Trump inherited a total Charlie Foxtrot from the previous administration. Pushing to support the drive for a regime change in Syria was to ignore EVERY lesson the West ought to have learned and opened the country to ISIS.
      Agreed, his attempts to rectify the situation have been more than a bit cackhanded, but his aims are correct.

    1. Farage: “It feels like the darkest moment I’ve seen”.
      …..

      “We are headed into the worst period of politcal humiliation our nation has ever seen.”

    2. Some excellent points, not least one made by Claire Fox at 17:07 – “we’ve got to change politics for good”.

      Yes, and how.

      When the likes of Dame Louise Ellman, MP, say that Corbyn isn’t fit to be prime minister, it shows the depths to which British politics has sunk.

      We need a massive clearout of the old system and its gravy-trainers and a more honest and less partisan system.

      Bring it on.

        1. I don’t know, Hugh, but do feel the debacle of the past few years has shone a light on how broken our current system is.

        2. Wasn’t one of the remainiacs elected by a version of primaries? Be careful what you wish for.

  40. I am going to try and ignore Bill Jackson II before my head explodes. I suspect that those who have suggested that there is more than one Bill Jackson are correct. Just as Japanese print artists bequeathed their persona, their signature, to their pupil as for example, Hiroshige did, so Bill Jackson is now team of highly trained operatives… hmmm. I’ll stop there.
    In other non news from the BBC; a football match in Barcelona “may be postponed because of fears of civil unrest“. I thought there already had been civil unrest.
    Of much greater interest to the BBC is the gun battle in Culiacán, Mexico, which the authorities lost. While the fighting may have been pretty spectacularly violent it is of little consequence here. The street fighting in Catalonia is of real importance to us as the Catalans and the Spanish are members of the same very tightly-knit EU community as we are. Heavy-handed, anti-democratic policing in the EU should be of concern to our state broadcaster and every citizen of the UK. We all have “European Union” on our passports.
    Here at home. (Nice word “home”, conjuring up visions of a cottage fireside, toasted crumpets, cardigans, knitting, pipe-smoking bygone days. Ah well.)
    Here at home “police have made a record number of arrests in a week-long push to tackle so-called county lines drug gangs:. So far so good. The figures quoted; “Officers arrested 743 people and seized drugs worth over £400,000, 12 guns and dozens of other weapons.”
    Now do the sums. The value of the seizures is the equivalent of £538 per person arrested. Rather trivial. I’ve seen “Breaking Bad”.
    The report does not mention how many police were involved, nor for how long. Say 500 police for a fortnight, @ £1000 a week per officer. That equates to £1m that this operation has cost. I am fairly sure that this is a gross underestimate.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/50096390
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-50092641
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-50085470

    PS The BBC have blanked out the street number of the house to protect the civil and legal rights of the arrested, suspected, alleged, armed drug dealer.

    1. I suspect that those who have suggested that there is more than one Bill Jackson are correct.

      I’ve always thought Bill was a Mossad Bot Horace!

        1. Yes Richard. You only have to contrast his fluent and cogent posts of the last two days with his usual dysfunctional spelling and grammar!

    2. Bill Jackson keeps this forum going…
      Since the B….T boll*cks we’re all suffering from B….T Derangement Syndrome….

      Keep posting BJ…. your witty homour is appreciated

        1. I can’t remember the last time i had one of those. Still, I was never any good at cards. Twist, Bust, Fukkit.

        1. I’m sure they’ll be there aplenty on the armbands of the milice sent in by Brussels at Madrid’s request.

  42. A very inspiring read in ‘The Telegraph’

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/dda0831828cbe0ca4182e1d01280c928f636efc3c998e8e30a31a24687893f44.jpg

    Tony Hopkins, who has died aged 94, was a merchant seaman who survived being torpedoed in the Second World War and later pioneered shipping links with China.

    At about 0230 on September 5 1942, the 18-year-old Hopkins was on his second sea voyage, a midshipman in the Blue Funnel Line’s cargo liner Myrmidon, under Captain Alexander Mann Caird, just short of the Equator, when the German U-506 fired a salvo of torpedoes, one of which struck Myrmidon portside forward.

    Hopkins, who had come off watch at midnight, was woken by a vivid flash and a simultaneous explosion, followed by alarm bells. His first thought was what to wear – his best uniform, which would get spoilt in the boats, or old clothes and a warm sweater: prudence won over pride.

    Hopkins’s lifeboat was secured on chocks on the main deck forward, and as Myrmidon sank there was no difficulty in launching it into the calm sea. Nine other lifeboats were also launched safely with their full complement of 129 passengers, 106 crew and 10 gunners.

    Shortly afterwards, in the eerie light of a rising moon, the ship’s bows went under, her stern rose high in the air, and Myrmidon disappeared. As her funnel dipped into the sea there was a long, sad blast from the ship’s siren, a woman passenger in Hopkins’s boat remarking: “That’s poor Captain Caird sounding the whistle as his ship goes down!”

    In fact Caird survived after swimming in the oily water for a couple of hours before finding an upturned lifeboat which he helped to right.

    As the convoy disappeared into the darkness, the destroyer Brilliant hunted the U-boat. Hopkins was reassured to hear depth charges in the distance, while the smell of fuel oil from the ruptured tanks of Myrmidon filled the warm tropical night.

    After some two hours, Brilliant returned: it was strange to hear an English voice booming out over the water “Please hurry along”, but soon the destroyer had 245 extra people to look after, including women and children.

    Brilliant’s crew, Hopkins recalled, received their unexpected guests generously and uncomplainingly, landing them at Banana, a small seaport at the mouth of the Congo.

    Hopkins eventually reached Britain in the Orient Line’s Orion. Getting off the train at Caterham, he was walking home with his few belongings in a kitbag, when a horse-drawn milk float came trotting down the road. The milkman greeted him, turned his cart round, and Hopkins arrived home from sea on a milk cart.

    Hopkins left behind in the lifeboat a leather writing case, the only personal belonging which he had salvaged from Myrmidon.

    He never thought of it again until months later, and much to his amazement, it was delivered by the postman to his home in a large OHMS envelope, with his silver pencil, some bank notes, address book, and everything else intact, but no indication of who had found it.

    Hopkins treasured these items throughout his life, along with the sweater which he had on that night, wearing it for gardening until his wife eventually threw it out.

    In his five years at sea during the war Hopkins served in seven ships – including Glenartney in 1943, when she was one of the first merchant ships to transit the Mediterranean from east to west since 1941. He also served in the Liberty ship Samnesse, in which he made several voyages to the Normandy beaches after D-Day and which was one of the first ships to enter Antwerp after the Battle of the Scheldt in December 1944.

    Hopkins “swallowed the anchor” in 1947, but in 2013 he proudly attended a service at St Paul’s commemorating the 70th anniversary of the Battle of the Atlantic.

    Anthony George Hopkins was born in London on September 25 1924: his father, George Herbert Hopkins, was a shipbroker had who served on the Western Front with 11th (Pioneer) Battalion of the King’s Liverpool Regiment. He was wounded on December 23 1917 near Ypres and awarded the MC.

    The tenor of Hopkins’s career at sea was set on his first voyage, when the Myrmidon was ordered by the convoy’s commodore to take a slower ship in tow. Captain Caird demurred, saying that he had women and children on board who were already concerned by the risks of wartime travel by sea, claiming that the proposal would intensify their anxiety.

    Back came the signal: “What is the predominant nationality of your passengers?” To the reply “British”, Caird was told he had misjudged the morale of his passengers, and that he must drop back to assist the other ship.

    In March 1947 Hopkins joined Thompson Steam Shipping as a trainee broker, and three years later he moved to his father’s firm, Howe Robinson.

    Then in 1951, after Jardine Matheson started a shipbroking business, he was seconded to Hong Kong, beginning Howe Robinson’s links which now embrace offices in Beijing, Shanghai and Singapore.

    There were many nations not prepared to trade with communist China, but Hopkins had no misgivings, and his first fixture (the business arranged between the shipowner and the owner of cargo) with the China Chartering Corporation came in 1954.

    Hopkins, a colleague remarked, “always had a twinkle in his eye. He was one of those truly nice people who was always interested in others.”

    So, back in London, he was assisted by his wife Pauline as Chinese visitors were entertained with Sunday coach outings to Windsor Castle or Karl Marx’s tomb at Highgate.

    On reciprocal visits to China, even during the Cultural Revolution, when few foreigners were able to visit the country, Pauline accompanied him. After he had been chairman of Howe Robinson for 10 years, the Chinese invited the Hopkinses on a special three-week tour of their country.

    Hopkins enjoyed his 35 years of working with the Chinese, finding them honourable and pleasant people.

    As the Greeks had large fleets of tramp ships operating in the seas off China, the Hopkinses also attended numerous Greek weddings, funerals, and ship launches in the 1960s and 1970s.

    As a liveryman and member of the court of the Worshipful Company of Shipwrights, Hopkins chaired its charities committee, supporting maritime charities such as Sea Cadets and the Sail Training Association. In 1999 he was awarded the Shipwrights’ Medal of Honour, the fourth person to receive the company’s highest award.

    Using the diary which he had kept during the war, in 2013 he wrote an unpublished, evocative memoir of his service in the Merchant Navy.

    In 1953 he married Pauline Kaye Brown, whom he had met in Hong Kong, later writing: “We have four splendid sons … and I am so fortunate too to have had wonderful support from Pauline for over 60 years.” She survives him, along with their sons.

    Anthony Hopkins, born September 25 1924, died September 21 2019

    2. Thank you Lewis. I will forward that on to Lt Commander Kristiansen and Commander Hils Jones. Previous and present commanders Sea Cadets.

  44. Extinction Rebellion block Oxford Circus in central London with giant bamboo structure. 18 OCTOBER 2019 .

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/727f00e41f3d3262c8c61a422d5510ef791461429fd08443a65a02aa1f8f1d45.jpg

    Extinction Rebellion (XR) protesters have blocked Oxford Circus by erecting a giant bamboo structure in the middle of the road.

    Some activists locked themselves to metal pipes in streets surrounding the busy central London landmark, causing widespread traffic disruption.

    Tommy Robinson cannot go to the Public Toilets without Antifa lying in wait for him there and I am to believe that this is taking place without the tacit approval of the State?

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/10/18/extinction-rebellion-block-oxford-circus-central-london-giant/

    1. I guess they manhandled that structure all the way from China, or wherever bamboo grows?

      1. Exactly – I thought that there was confirmation yesterday that ALL ER protests were illegal and any protesters would be arrested at once? Seems the Met didn’t get the memo!?

        2. I expect the “illegal protests” came from their PR department, just a sop to those who have the audacity to complain as they go about their lawful business.

      2. I counted about 20 police officers there. At a rough estimate that’s costing us about £1000 an hour and that without the disruption they are causing . Difficult to quantity that but it will be a lot

    4. TR is being dragged to court again today for an incident at a football match in Portugal. No charges in Portugal but our finest believe that he should be banned from all football matches.

    5. The police should just move the structure to one side and allow the traffic through. Don’t bother unlocking the protesters. Leave them to it, out of the way.

    1. HM Police providing security for an illegal structure under erection in an illegal location.

      What happened to their requirement to prevent crime?

      1. They must have stood there and watched them erect that structure

        I see the other waste of space Khan is not holding the Met to account over this farce

      4. Thinking about it, the police should under arrest for facilitating, aiding and abetting a crime in progress.

        1. Looking at their uniforms that will never do they are not wearing the Extinction Rebellion Logo

    2. OXFORD STREET- The road is blocked due to a protest.

      Routes 7,94 and 98 are starting and terminating at Marble Arch.

      Routes 12 and 159 are starting and terminating at Piccadilly Circus.

      Route 22 is starting and finishing at Green Park

      Route 55 is starting and finishing at Holbor

  46. ‘Morning, Peeps.

    Sainsbury’s to stop selling fireworks:

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/10/17/sainsburys-becomes-first-major-supermarket-stop-selling-fireworks/amp/

    Hurrah! If it was just one evening of noise then I suspect that most pet owners, including this one, wouldn’t be too concerned. Unfortunately the nightly noise can go on for weeks, reducing our Lab to a quivering wreck, desperate to hide in any available corner until it stops. I find it increasingly strange that items that explode, and often cause injury as a result of carelessness or worse, can still be bought over the counter. Much more impressive are the organised (category 4) displays.

    Full marks to Sainsbury’s, and I trust that other retailers will soon do the responsible thing and and stop selling these items.

    PS The lame ‘advice’ from Aldi and Asda is just a cop-out. Of course we keep our dog indoors! Their hearing is far more efficient than ours, so unless your house has been completely sound-proofed…

    1. The purpose of Guy Fawkes night has long been lost and the only reason for continuing it nowadays would be if he had succeeded!

        1. Yes Dez. I’m pretty sure that it was set up by the Elites in the 16th century as a Public Relations exercise. It’s significant that when Parliament burned down in 1834 large crowds gathered to cheer!

      2. After tomorrow’s vote(s) by the House of Clowns (which I expect Boris to lose by just a few votes) Mr Fawkes can name his price for a little ‘direct action’…

        ‘Morning, Minty (manners).

      3. Maybe someone should start an on-line Petition to Parliament to grant him a Posthumous Pardon…..

    2. Every year I wrestle with the temptation to buy a quantity of the loudest-banging rockets available & set them off aimed at all points of the compass at 3 am one night about a month after Guy Fawkes night. Problem is, it would upset pets further.

    3. The problem is, as you say, mission creep when it spreads over a week or more, but most particularly, in my view, it’s the power of the things. When I was a child, we had Roman Candles, Catherine Wheels, sparklers, Bengal Matches, rockets, Calling All Cars, Crackerjacks and bangers. None of them was, as far as I can recall, ear-splitting or shook the foundations of the house. These days, it’s like re-living El Alamein.

        1. Perhaps that was what I should have written instead of Crackerjacks. I remember they were khaki coloured and like a serpent.

          1. Blasted things used to chase you; they’d get caught in the grass, fizz for a while – and the jump in a totally unexpected direction.

          2. Best dropped into trouser turn-ups (which were fashionable then).

            That is why that disgusting little cur developed the habit of widdling into turn-ups – to put the darn things out.

          4. Rick rack? Noooo.

            I remember a name used to describe Champers, Prosecco, Cava, Cremant & co.

    1. Whatever way you play it NI has to be treated slightly differently

      Boris’s deal removes any checks at the border. For some good going to and from NI the ports will be a tax point but not a border

  49. Amazing…. Mr Redwood published both my posts…………..

    1) Polly
    Posted October 17, 2019 at 8:01 pm

    Who rules the British roost during the ”transition period” ?

    The EU fox, also known as The G S Organization.

    Are Conservative MPs seriously going to vote for such a stitch up ?

    They’ll also be abandoning the DUP which is shocking seeing that the DUP kept them all afloat for so long.

    Polly

    2) Polly
    Posted October 17, 2019 at 8:28 pm

    In fact, when one thinks about the giveaways during the free trade negotiations, such as fishing and ”level playing field considerations” etc etc, it’s perfectly obvious that Brits are never properly going to escape from the EU at all. They will always be controlled in many respects in order to get that mirage of trade.

    Brexit therefore is turning out to be like a clockface where 12 – 6 are spent talking about leaving.. and then 7 – 12 are the free trade negotiations and giveaways which bring the whole thing back to the starting point as if nothing much has happened.

    How perfect for the EU !

    Polly

    1. There is nothing unreasonable in Boris’s deal. International cooperation with fishing grounds is normal as fish migrate allowing other countries boats to have limited access under a quota system is also normal

      2. Dear, oh, dear.
        What the Hell is “normal” about giving away 80% of our fish, as we do? What is “normal” about giving away hundreds of jobs on fishing boats, and deliberately destroying perfectly good fishing boats, as we did.
        What is “normal” about closing down dozens of seafood processing factories, putting thousands out of work and losing billions of pounds from the UK economy as has happened? What is “normal” about giving it all away to foreign competitors?

        1. A curious thing has happened in the last year or two. All those environmentalists who were so concerned about the plundering of North Sea fish stocks over several decades and who were highly critical of the CFP have now effectively come out on the side of the EU by offering this argument: “Look, fish move around. Don’t you understand that? They don’t belong to anyone so everyone can catch them, anywhere, anytime.”

          They cannot abide the idea that by the type of international law that they normally love, the UK has rights over a very large part of the sea to the NW of Europe and it sticks in their craws like herring bones.

    1. I’m surprised the naming rights for the Houses of Parliament haven’t been sold to Bisto or Oxo…..

    2. Labour MP Chris Bryant has stated MPs should be given financial help to pay for childcare because they have to attend the House of Commons on a Saturday.

      I didn’t realise an MP’s job was 9 to 5.

      1. At least I suppose you can’t accuse him of self-interest if he is a homosexual without his own children?

          1. Of course, his orientation being the most important qualification – high above impartiality, integrity and the rest.

  53. Seen on Twitter

    Pam Ayres
    @PamAyres
    ·
    52m
    How sad on this October day
    To see our hedges shorn away
    Small creatures would have liked to eat,
    The hawthorn berries, rose hips sweet,
    Blackberries and nuts and sloes,
    But through the blades the banquet goes,
    Won’t somebody heed our words,
    And leave the berries for the birds.

    1. The hedge across the lane from our house has been magnificent this year – our neighbour normally gets it cut at the end of February, but this year, he didn’t. So we had wonderful blossoms, and now a feast of berries.

    3. Last year, they barely waited for the late birds to finish fledging…
      The hedgerows around here are kept to a minimum. I have no idea why, but as a result they provide negligible shelter and food for any birds or insects.

  54. What a pity Kulula doesn’t fly
    internationally – we should support them if only for their humour – so
    typically South African.

    Kulula is an Airline with head office situated in Johannesburg .

    Kulula airline attendants make an effort to make the in-flight “safety lecture” and announcements a bit more entertaining.

    Here are some real examples that have been heard or reported:

    On a Kulula flight, (there is no assigned seating, you just sit where you want) passengers were apparently having a hard time choosing, when a flight attendant announced, “People, people we’re not picking out furniture here, find a seat and get in it!”

    On another flight with a very “senior” flight attendant crew, the pilot said, “Ladies and gentlemen, we’ve reached cruising altitude and will be turning down the cabin lights. This is for your comfort and to enhance the appearance of your flight attendants.”

    On landing, the stewardess said, “Please be sure to take all of your belongings. If you’re going to leave anything, please make sure it’s something we’d like to have.”

    “There may be 50 ways to leave your lover, but there are only 4 ways out of this airplane.”

    “Thank you for flying Kulula. We hope you enjoyed giving us the business as much as we enjoyed taking you for a ride.”

    As the plane landed and was coming to a stop at Durban Airport, a lone voice came over the loudspeaker: “Whoa, big fella. WHOA!”

    After a particularly rough landing during thunderstorms in the Karoo , a flight attendant on a flight announced, “Please take care when opening the overhead compartments because, after a landing like that, sure as hell everything has shifted.”

    From a Kulula employee:
    “Welcome aboard Kulula 271 to Port Elizabeth . To operate your seat belt, insert the metal tab into the buckle, and pull tight. It works just like every
    other seat belt; and, if you don’t know how to operate one, you probably shouldn’t be out in public unsupervised.”

    “In the event of a sudden loss of cabin pressure, masks will descend from the ceiling. Stop screaming, grab the mask, and pull it over your face. If you
    have a small child travelling with you, secure your mask before assisting with theirs. If you are travelling with more than one small child, pick your favourite.”

    “Weather at our destination is 50 degrees with some broken clouds, but we’ll try to have them fixed before we arrive. Thank you, and remember, nobody
    loves you, or your money, more than Kulula Airlines.”

    “Your seats cushions can be used for flotation; and in the event of an emergency water landing, please paddle to shore and take them with our
    compliments.”

    “As you exit the plane, make sure to gather all of your belongings. Anything left behind will be distributed evenly among the flight attendants. Please do not leave children or spouses.”

    And from the pilot during his welcome message: “Kulula Airlines is pleased to announce that we have some of the best flight attendants in the industry. Unfortunately, none of them are on this flight!”

    Heard on Kulula 255 just after a very hard landing in Cape Town: The flight attendant came on the intercom and said, “That was quite a bump and I know what y’all are thinking. I’m here to tell you it wasn’t the airline’s fault, it wasn’t the pilot’s fault, it wasn’t the flight attendant’s fault, it was the asphalt.”

    Overheard on a Kulula flight into Cape Town , on a particularly windy and bumpy day: During the final approach, the Captain really had to fight it. After an extremely hard landing, the Flight Attendant said, “Ladies and Gentlemen, welcome to The Mother City. Please remain in your seats with your seat belts fastened while the Captain taxis what’s left of our airplane to the gate!”

    Another flight attendant’s comment on a less than perfect landing: “We ask you to please remain seated as Captain Kangaroo bounces us to the terminal.”

    An airline pilot wrote that on this particular flight he had hammered his aircraft into the runway really hard. The airline had a policy which required the first officer to stand at the door while the passengers exited, smile, and give them a “Thanks for flying our airline”. He said that, in light of his bad landing, he had a hard time looking the passengers in the eye, thinking that someone would have a smart comment. Finally, everyone had gotten off except for a little old lady walking with a cane. She said, “Sir, do you mind if I ask you a question?”
    “Why, no Ma’am,” said the pilot. “What is it?”
    The little old lady said, “Did we land, or were we shot down?”

    After a real crusher of a landing in Johannesburg , the attendant came on with, “Ladies and Gentlemen, please remain in your seats until Captain Crash and the Crew have brought the aircraft to a screeching halt against the gate. And, once the tire smoke has cleared and the warning bells are silenced, we will open the door and you can pick your way through the wreckage to the terminal..”

    Part of a flight attendant’s arrival announcement:
    “We’d like to thank you folks for flying with us today.. And, the next time you get the insane urge to go blasting through the skies in a pressurized metal tube, we hope you’ll think of Kulula Airways.”

    Heard on a Kulula flight: “Ladies and gentlemen, if you wish to smoke, the smoking section on this airplane is on the wing.. If you can light ’em, you can smoke ’em.”

    1. Funny that. I’m sure I’ve seen some of those announcements given by Southwest Airlines a couple of decades ago…

    3. The Modern Minimum can’t come soon enough……of late 16 continuous days without a Sunspot…..

  59. Brexit: What is the Letwin amendment and will it Pass

    The latest gambit by the alliance of MPs around Sir Oliver Letwin looks like a real problem for the government whips, as they prepare for Saturday’s critical vote on the new-look Brexit deal.
    The amendment would withhold approval of the deal, until the legislation to enact it was safely passed – a move that would automatically trigger the “Benn Act” and force the prime minister to request a further postponement of Brexit until 31 January.

  60. Scottish department store Watt Brothers goes into administration

    More than 200 people have lost their jobs after Scottish department store chain Watt Brothers went into administration.
    Shutters were pulled down on the firm’s 11 stores and 229 of its 306 employees made redundant with immediate effect.
    The fourth-generation family-owned business was incorporated in 1915 with a flagship store in Glasgow’s Sauchiehall Street.
    It opened a further 10 leasehold stores across central Scotland.
    They were in Irvine, Lanark, Falkirk, Port Glasgow, Hamilton, Livingston, Clydebank, Clarkston, Robroyston and Ayr.
    They sold a wide range of items including fashion, electrical, homeware, jewellery, gifts and beauty.

  61. Dear Supporter,

    At this important time, I want to update you on The Brexit Party’s thoughts on Boris’ proposed deal. The truth is that it would be BRINO, Brexit in name only. We have always stood for a Clean-Break Brexit so we can maximise the Brexit opportunities.

    This deal is still a really bad deal. Apart from unnecessarily paying £39 billion, the Political Declaration — which sets the basis for the future Free Trade Agreement with the EU — is full of traps and pitfalls. Despite the warm words, it will heavily restrict our foreign policy and military independence as well as policies on trade, tax, fishing, the environment, social and employment law, competition and state aid. We will have to operate on a “level playing field”. We would not be able to become a high growth, low tax, smartly regulated economy, which the EU is terrified that we could become.

    If Boris’ treaty is passed, a transition period of over three years is likely — when we have no voice, no vote and no veto — as the EU sets new rules and laws that discriminate against us.

    Any short-term temptation to back this deal will result in huge medium-term regret. It would be a historic mistake. A Clean-Break Brexit is still the right way forward.

    With thanks, Richard Tice.

    Chairman of The Brexit Party.

    Just recieved this from Brexit Party HQ!

    1. I’m attending a Brexit Party rally in London tonight! I’m looking forward to getting the view from the horse’s mouth(s) of what real Brexiteers think about this pig in lipstick.

      1. Afternoon Kuffar. I haven’t yet made up my mind. I’m waiting for the worms to crawl out. The greatest objection I’ve seen to it so far is that the EU Apparatchiks like it!

        1. Afternoon Minty. Any deal that the EU likes can’t possibly be good for Britain!

          On one hand it is impressive that Johnson got them to re-open the WA and remove the backstop, both things the EU repeatedly said they wouldn’t do. And I wonder how Theresa May feels now, having repeatedly told us her deal was the ‘best, final and only deal’ possible. Errr, except it wasn’t!

          But any deal which doesn’t take back our fish, our money, keeps us under the ECJ and puts us in an endlessly-extendable transition period (transitioning to what?) is not Brexit.

      2. Details seem to be being kept deliberately hidden from public scrutiny. We know the DUP can’t stand it which means it’s not a full UK Brexit but a 3/4 Brexit in some way which should be enough for every single right-minded UK politician to say no to it.

  62. Melanie Phillips

    No wonder the EU agreed to this.

    It’s basically a tweaked version of the May deal, which MPs on both

    sides of the Brexit divide said was so bad it would leave Britain worse

    off than being in the EU.

    We were told repeatedly that the May deal was indeed so terrible it

    could not be renegotiated. It was more dead even than Monty Python’s

    deceased parrot. Yet Boris Johnson has renegotiated that deal. He has

    indeed achieved the impossible. He has produced the May deal mark four. He has put lipstick on the dead parrot.

    As of this morning, the Brexiteers are in a sorry and divided state.

    Nigel Farage has denounced this deal as “just not Brexit”. Some members

    of his Brexit party, however, reportedly disagree and are cheering

    Johnson’s achievement.

    The Bruges Group and the Bow Group have come out against it. However,

    some members of the ERG “clean-break’ Brexiteers and even some of their

    even more principled “Spartans” were saying yesterday they were

    inclined to support the deal — although at that stage they can hardly

    have studied it in any detail.

    As so often, however, detail may matter less than psychology and

    character. People are exhausted by three punishing years of the

    agonising Brexit national nervous breakdown. They just want to be shot

    of it. Even among the best of the Brexiteers this risks being the point

    at which, through sheer emotional and physical fatigue, some may

    persuade themselves that this deal is good enough.

    After all, they’ve been telling themselves, there’s Boris throwing

    everything he has into delivering Brexit do-or-die, shackled by the

    Commons like the Incredible Hulk, sucking up potential Brexit Party

    voters and even Labour Brexiteers by his doughty defence of the

    sovereignty of the people against the perfidious Remainer coup against

    democracy – and now, just look, he’s actually wrung concessions out of

    the unwringable EU. What a guy, eh!!

    So, they conclude, this is as good as it gets because you can’t get a

    more Brexity prime minister than Boris (really?) and the alternative to

    his deal is no deal, which means, given the implacable opposition of

    the Commons to that scenario, no Brexit.

    But if the UK remains shackled to the EU, then what was all the agony

    of the last three years for? Because that wouldn’t be Brexit, other

    than in name only. And because as I have also said here previously, no

    Brexit is better than a bad deal.

    https://www.melaniephillips.com/boris-achieves-impossible-lipstick-dead-parrot/

    1. “And because as I have also said here previously, no Brexit is better than a bad deal.”

      Nigel Farage said practically the same thing yesterday, adding, that an extension and a GE would be better than this shoddy deal.

    2. This is an internationally-binding treaty which would shackle our country for years to come. It cannot be treated like a ‘Friday-afternoon job’ where you just want to get something, anything across the line so you can go home. It must be resisted as much as May’s deal was, or we and our children will live to regret it.

      1. I couldn’t agree more. I fear “Brexit fatigue” will mean people will vote for it “to get a deal over the line” irrespective that it ties us in for the foreseeable future.

        1. I’ve just come from the Brexit Party rally and very inspiring it was too. Tim Martin, Ian Paisley and Ann Widdecombe on fine, rabble-rousing form. Then Farage forensically dissected the WA. It is not Brexit, no matter how much lipstick Johnson applies.

          Sad so see so-called ‘Spartans’ like Suella Braverman and Andrea Jenkyns giving in and supporting Johnson. Not wishing to sound like a party political broadcast, but it really is only TBP which is supporting a clean-break Brexit.

          1. Actually, no. The original and genuine UKIP is supporting a clean-break Brexit (with policies to take advantage of it as well). I suppose pushing TBP to the exclusion of the original independence party is the equivalent of telling a lie often enough until it becomes truth.

  63. MP;s Standing Down

    Conservative

    John Bercow – MP for Buckingham and Commons speaker
    Glyn Davies – MP for Montgomeryshire
    Michael Fallon – MP for Sevenoaks and former defence secretary
    Nick Hurd – MP for Ruislip, Northwood and Pinner and Northern Ireland minister
    Jo Johnson – MP for Orpington and universities minister. Brother of Boris Johnson
    Jeremy Lefroy – MP for Stafford
    Claire Perry – MP for Devizes
    Mark Prisk – MP for Hertford & Stortford
    Keith Simpson – MP for Broadland
    Caroline Spelman – MP for Meriden and former environment secretary
    David Tredinnick – MP for Boswort
    Mark Field – MP for Cities of London and Westminster

    Labour

    Kate Hoey will stand down as MP for Vauxhall at the next election (PA)
    Kevin Barron – MP for Rother Valley
    Ronnie Campbell – MP for Blyth Valley
    Gloria De Piero – MP for Ashfield and shadow justice minister
    Jim Fitzpatrick – MP for Poplar and Limehouse
    Kate Hoey – MP for Vauxhall
    John Mann – MP for Bassetlaw
    Albert Owen – MP for Ynys Mon
    Teresa Pearce – MP for Erith and Thamesmead and ex-shadow housing minister
    Stephen Pound – MP for Ealing North
    Geoffrey Robinson – MP for Coventry North West
    Stephen Twigg – MP for Liverpool West Derby

    Lib Dem

    Sir Vince Cable won’t stand for re-election (EPA)
    Vince Cable – MP for Twickenham and former leader of the Lib Dems
    Norman Lamb – North Norfolk
    Independents

    1. Is this so at the next General Election those standing will be untainted by the treason of their predecessors?

    2. Liberal Democrats, along with most of the Remainers, are forced to lie by default. If the light of truth shone down on their ideology and long term goals, then no-one with a hint of morality would go near them.

      1. The striking thing from the interview is that she seems ignorant of the details of what’s being proposed.

        How many in parliament tomorrow will be equally ignorant, particularly having had so little time to have gone through the fine details?

        1. But this goes for most of the Illiberal Undemocrats, or Limp Dumbs if you prefer. Closed minds, to hell with the facts. Chukkus Yermoney on Toady this morning was a masterclass in this. Typical stance of a wrecker who has swallowed Project Fear in its entirety. I trust that the electorate will decimate this lot at the next GE. It is so richly deserved.

    4. It really doesn’t matter if she and others of her ilk have read the document and even understand as little as 1/10th of its content. She is an unthinking automaton when it comes to voting along party lines. Personally I would favour principled, thinking MPs who genuinely put the interests of the UK ahead of self or party interest, but somehow we the electorate have managed to vote in the most disreputable bunch of MPs that I can recall in my 50 years of following British Politics.

      1. I think the vicious circle of partisan voting has got us where we are – I see it at a local level – and the circle needs to be broken.

        Whether, after recent events, enough people recognise the extent to which their MPs toe the party line remains to be seen. Let’s hope they do.

  65. Letwin is saying he will vote for the deal whilst at the same time tabling an amendment to try and wreck it

  68. Just when you think things can’t get much worse, yer Spanish government pours petrol on the Catalan flames by suggesting that it is time for “direct rule” from Madrid.

    1. Strange they can interfere in the minutiae of Tommy’s life and yet are unable to prevent Extinction Rebellion carrying out disruption on a massive scale!

      2. One is seen to be on the left and the other on the right. as we have a left wing state its easy to see why.

    2. You don’t need 6 months remaining on your passport to travel to Europe.

      Yet.

      That bloke is talking bollocks.

      1. That’s true. I have had to observe the six-month validity requirement when applying for work visas in some countries (Asia, Middle East and Africa), but that is an arbitrary limit set by those countries. The bloke behind the desk is lying.

  70. Feeling the full force of the weather here , the rain is horizontal .. fierce squalls , sporadic sunshine .. beautiful colours .. the strength of the wind and the heavy rain is something else .. smells as if the sea has been dumped on us. (We are 4 miles inland )

    1. It was as dark as early evening here a short time ago, then the skies opened and you couldn’t hear a thing. Now there is blazing sunshine and the seagulls are making a racket. We are supposed to have another wave of rain pass over in the next 2 hours.

      I’m not going out until tomorrow.

      1. 2 identical days here, yes’day & today: bright. early sunshine all morning with that crisp early-autumn chill, then clouding over during lunch (in Còte) & torrential showers.

        Yes’day I got home in the dry, but today it was chucking it down when we reached my home bus stop. I thanked the driver as usual, & asked if he could wait until the rain stopped. He gave a light laugh & revved up. But the short walk to the car didn’t get me soaked.

    2. Oh dear, that means it will be hitting us in about an hour. Should I go out for a walk now or will I get drenched if it gets here sooner than anticipated? Decisions.decisions.

    3. Some rain here (E Sussex) and a brief hail storm, but otherwise bright and sunny. The rainfall radar shows most of it tracking along the south coast, with nothing much 20 miles inland.

  71. ‘Feed the ducks bread’ sign sparks heated online debate. Fri 18 Oct 2019.

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/0f47232f9bf885434eb8b774ba76119955c46ff0841d1bd5804cf463c0646c94.jpg

    Another sign shared to a local Facebook group for mothers, with more than 17,000 members, claimed feeding bread could cause a condition called “angel wing”, which makes ducks unable to fly, as well as “fatal gut and heart disease” in swans.

    Even experts seem unable to agree on the matter. A spokesperson for the Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals (RSPCA) said: “It’s always nice to hear that people want to help swans, ducks and geese, however it is important to make sure they are given the right food.

    Perhaps they should have consulted MI6! Sergei Skripal fed the local ducks (and one small boy) bread from his own hands when they were supposedly contaminated with Novichok so they are obviously much tougher than one might expect!

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/oct/18/feed-the-ducks-bread-sign-sparks-heated-online-debate

  72. I am aware that the EU is reluctant to allow Free Ports but would a Freeport in Northern Ireland be feasible and help with their import situation if Brexit gets through the HoC tomorrow unscathed. Places such as Middlesborough are preparing a Free Port post Brexit which should help their econoomy..

    2. Is Boris thinking: “The Conservative voters are on to what I’m doing far more quickly than I thought. I had hoped to slip an election past them and keep us in the EU for at least another 5 years in the transition period “

  74. Not Brexit or XR related.

    Took Dolly to the Vet. She needed her Nexgard pills and a checkup. Also had a lardarse reduction regimen explained which was helpful,boring and expensive. She also had her toenails clipped. Bill £148. Paid up looking glum but no complaints.

    Decided to have another look at the receipt and it had someone elses name on it. Doh ! Who would have thought there would be two dumb blondes called Dolly at the Vet at the same time? Three if you include the receptionist. Pfft…

      1. Hello, Mr Bill.
        No you don’t.
        Dolly has gained weight rapidly and i have been trying to control it. They always mention it at the Vet and this time the nurse i saw is a specialist in weight reduction. She jabbered on for 20 mins about the bleeding obvious and then charged me £70 for the consultation. There was no mention of a charge when she suggested we have a little chat.

        Cow !

        Dolly is now on a dry food which has all the nutrients but is very low in calories. I have to eat my dinner with the door shut so i don’t have to look at her sad face. :o(

        1. Poor you. (In both senses).

          I was extremely lucky with my late hound. He lived to be 15 years and 7 months. Apart from annual jabs, he went to the vet twice – once when he cut his pad on a bit of glass; the other time when he caught ringworm.

          He ate the same amount of food every day – never gained, never lost. I miss him still – though it is 28 years since he died.

          1. I understand, Bill. We become so attached. When i drop her off with the sitter before a holiday and then come home and she isn’t here i get a bit upset. Lips atremble. :o(

        2. You’re too soft, old chap.

          You need to give her some tough love, because you’ll miss her terribly and if she goes early you might unnecessarily blame yourself for her greed. {:-((

          1. Only 55 grams a day poor love. I’m still going to let her have some chicken occasionally.

          2. I wonder if you could set up a run-reward scheme for her?
            Create a small track with jumps and tunnels that makes it a game and at the end a small morsel of chicken or a favoured treat.
            It could be done indoors with cushions, boxes and furniture.

            Exercise more eat less, it almost always works.

            Good luck.

        3. Spartie is getting his manicure this coming Monday.
          Two of us battled manfully just to nip the ends off his front claws, which, unlike his back claws, he doesn’t wear down.
          For once, we had to admit defeat.

          1. No. She’s been done. What is strange though is when she has a pee she now lifts her back left leg instead of squatting. More worryingly she has this squeaky duck toy which she humps.

            Squeak, squeak, squeak, squeak at 3 am is not funny. :o(

            I think she is transitioning.

          2. My terrierist was “done” years ago. It doesn’t stop him humping his blanket. Sometimes I am woken up in the early hours as he tries to hump for England. If it were an Olympic event, he’d get a gold medal every time!

    2. They found an old manifesto where the promises made in it were kept. No-one had ever seen one before.

  76. When it comes to politics, the UK suffers from a chronic disease. It’s called satire. Fri 18 Oct 2019.

    Have I Got News for You and Mock the Week invite audiences to laugh at what they don’t have the gumption to change.

    We had the gumption to vote Leave and it changed nothing! Satire of course allows you to endure and express contempt for the lies of the Political Classes. It also insulates you from False Narratives and Fake News. Totalitarian states hate it and frequently go to great lengths to suppress it along with its twin Irony, because both are denials of Authority and the tyranny of murderous philosophies like National Socialism or Marxism.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/oct/18/british-politics-uk-chronic-disease-satire-hignfy

  77. MAJOR SECURITY BREACH AT WESTMINSTER

    Extinction Rebellion Protests has breached security at Westminster and is climbing up to Big Ben

        1. Met Police Farce say they are carrying out a full Health and Safety Assessment before deciding what to do. They will report back on this on Monday as this team does not work weekends

          They have 5 Ambulance and 2 Air Ambulance at the scene and specialist Police Councillors and 3 NHS Mental Health practitioners

          1. In Texas, they would have the SWAT team and snipers at the scene. And since the climber would be assumed to be armed, he would not be long for this world.

          2. Outside of London they are not as soft as the Met are. In one incident there was a squatter in an old pub the Bailiffs went in with the police he dig not cooperate so they zapped him with a Tsar took him out of the building and chucked him in to the back of the police van job done

          3. they zapped him with a Tsar

            Nasty things, those Romanovs. Just as well it wasn’t a Terrible one.

          4. Have you noticed the other Bill Jackson on here. He’s easy to spot. He’s the one that can spell.

    2. An Extinction Rebellion protester who appeared to be dressed as Boris Johnson has climbed the Big Ben scaffolding near the Palace of Westminster in London.
      The man later unfurled an Extinction Rebellion flag “to highlight government inaction on the climate and ecological emergency,” the group said.
      It said he was attempting a “free solo climb” of the tower.
      Police shouted for him to come down as he made his climb.

        2. So they are saying (© Cathy Newman) that Extension Rebellion members are both Nazis (see banner) and/or Nazis (see salute).

          EDIT: I’ve just realised my mistake. For the first “Nazis” please read “Rainbow Warriors”. I don’t think either Conway or grumpygrey spotted the mistake because they both upvoted my original post!

      2. Other people were heard to shout encouragement to the protester. Oh, hang on – they were shouts of ‘JUMP!’

    3. With any luck he will lose his grip and fall onto the spiked railings. They could leave him there to rot as an example to others.

    4. Let us hope he is carrying nothing more dangerous that a stick of celery.

      Did they learn nothing from Airey Neave?

  78. How secure is the commons voting? It is a very crude system whats to stop them going through the lobby twice

      1. This seems to be a current problem with all people these days, Phizzee. People have made up their minds and see conspiracies everywhere. Whilst some suspicions are quite understandable (e.g. previous proven voter fraud with no voter ID system in place, Remainers’ Project Fear scaremongering, the bias of the “impartial” BBC where all good news is “despite Brexit” and all bad news is “because of Brexit”) in the vast majority of cases people find it difficult to keep an open mind. Hence the debate is now not Leave versus Remain, but rather Boris Can’t Be Trusted, so his new deal is capitulation versus Boris Can Be Trusted therefore his new deal is a triumphant vindication of his Brexiteer credentials. No wonder Churchill described the General Public as “The Sheeple”!

        2. See Rik’s post re the EU admitting the new deal is to all intents and purposes the old deal with a NI tweak and you might understand a lot of the scepiticism re Boris not being trustworthy.

          1. Exactly. If you look at the fine print, you’ll see that it keeps us in and leaves plenty of scope for the EU to apply a punishment beating while we can’t do a thing about it.

          2. I’d love to see the post of Rick to which you refer. But when I clicked on his avatar in your upvotes I discovered that Rik has hidden all of his posts. Much as I enjoy his late evening cat and dog posts, I can’t be bothered to trawl through all his posts to find the one you are referring to. Can you re-post it for me?

          3. It was the one where he showed a tweet from the EU’s own account that stated that apart from the NI tweaks the new deal is the same in substance as the old deal.
            I don’t do twitter so can’t repost the picture.

          5. Not entirely, but I look at their europa website fairly frequently and the truth is in there and a forbidding future it tells.

      1. I like one of those requirements to be issued with a handgun licence:

        “You are not a habitual drunkard or addicted to or user of marijuana or a stimulant, depressant or narcotic drug.”

  80. People’s Vote march: Stars help hire coaches to take thousands on Final Say rally

    Celebrities including Sir Patrick Stewart and satirist Armando Iannucci have helped hire a fleet of 172 coaches to bring thousands of people to Westminster to protest for a final say on Brexit.
    Huge numbers are expected tomorrow to march from Park Lane to Parliament where MPs will be sitting for the first Saturday since the Falklands War to decide the fate of Brexit.

    The Final Say rally calls for a vote on any EU withdrawal deal.
    Famous names who also include cook Delia Smith and actress Natascha McElhone have hired coaches to bring people from all over the UK to the march for the People’s Vote campaign.

      1. If the MPs decide tomorrow that the way forward is another referendum then you can bet the whole thing has been cooked up.

    3. Who do they think voted last time, if not “the people”? Mind you, “People’s” vote is a complete misnomer; they mean elite’s vote. The people keep coming up with the “wrong” answer.

    5. The Master (Mr Lime) is heartbroken because he fell for Delia Smith many years ago when her recipe for Beef Stroganoff was printed in the Radio Times. Now he has vowed never to read her recipe books ever again and make do from now on with just my fruit crumbles, marmalade and baked potatoes. I haven’t the heart to tell him that my recipes for those three are all from the Blessed Delia’s cookery books.

      :-))

    8. Can’t they wait for a general election? I hope the ER Activists protest the ridiculous use of 172 coaches in a city that already suffers high levels of air pollution. I should but I won’t hold my breath…..

  81. Brexit deal no threat to Northern Ireland’s constitutional status, says Coveney

    Irish foreign minister Simon Coveney has said the proposed Brexit deal does not pose a threat to the constitutional status of Northern Ireland.

    He said the deal removes the controversial backstop and ensures that Northern Ireland remains a part of the UK customs union, but includes a democratic checking system to prevent any customs infrastructure in Ireland.
    The DUP has said it will not back the withdrawal agreement, saying that it will introduce greater than necessary checks between Northern Ireland and Britain.

  82. What is you solution to the NI Border Issue?

    Lot of people come up with all sorts of proposals as how we should leave but none can resolve the NI border issue

    1. Say we’re not going to establish a hard border; if the EU wants one, it can do it. All checks electronically away from the border as per tried and tested technology already available. It’s a non-problem used to try to keep us in.

      1. Well that’s pretty much what Boris’s plan. The tariffs will be collected a UK & French ports will in general use number plate recognition and bar code reader

  83. Over half a MILLION people are – right now – in the centre of Barcelona protesting peacefully.

    Anyone who is interested – look at https://www.lavanguardia.com/

    Impressive or what? Five separate marches have converged on Barça late this afternoon.

    Come on LEAVERS emulate your Catalan freedom seekers.

    1. Presumably Barcelonians as a whole are fairly pro Catalan independence.

      Doing the same in London to force leaving the EU would most likely turn very ugly, very quickly.

      1. These are Catalans. The five marches came from all over Catalunya.

        About one-third of the Catalan population wants to be independent. Two-thirds – half Catalan, half Spanish who live in Catalunya – do not.

        It is an impossible equation.

        What has made it infinitely and unbelievably worse is the ham-fisted, catastrophic way in which the Spanish government – previous and present – have acted and reacted.

        And now to suggest “Direct Rule” from Madrid is total madness.

        1. I was thinking more that the protesters would be moving into a fairly benign area, Barcelona, as opposed to a rabidly anti area London.

          The treatment by the Spanish police the other day looked dreadful

          3. Deffo. The Guardia Civil are like the CRS – they just go in – tear gas, rubber bullets blazing and batons flying.

      2. I saw a map of Catalunya last night that showed the various districts. Barcelona, Girona, Lleida, Tarragona and I think another that has slipped my memory.

        Barcelona was actually the least in favour of separation at about 44%. Tarragona was next, slightly below 50% and the hardest liners were to be found in rural Lleida.

          1. You can already do that – I had new, plain numberplates when I bought my campervan to replace the ones with the sphincter of stars. Mind you, it took two goes; the first set of replacements still had the foreign ensign and had to be sent back until they got the message.

          3. I did that in the interim. I bought a couple with the St George’s flag on to cover it up while I was waiting for the new ones to arrive. As I made plain when I decided to buy the campervan, there was no way I was driving around with the sphincter of stars on my numberplates 🙂

  85. Evenin’, All.
    Walked into son’s office this morning to find him staring in blank amazement at his screen.
    Peeping over his shoulder I saw something about World Menopause Day.
    “Christ!!! ” bellowed Son and Heir, “All I want to do is sell bloody desserts!”

  86. That’s me for this first post sellout day.

    A demain – briefly – I have to take the MR to the airport. She is flying to Lunnon to greet her kid brother on his 60th birthday. Said chap’s missus has arranged a spiffing meal in a Michelin starred resto tomorrow evening at 7pm.

    Yesterday evening, in Geneva where she has been working, – planning to be on a plane tomorrow to LHR in time for said meal – said chap’s missus was knocked over by a motor cyclist and has a fractured skull, broken leg, broken arm and lung damage. Apart from that she is fine. The dinner will proceed in her absence.

    Isn’t life a bitch sometimes?

  87. Gosh what a surprise

    A left wing economic research group has compared all the options and decided Boris’s deal is the worst, That a good trick when the ink is barely dry and the trade element of it has not been started so you cannot possible access the economic impact of it

      1. If the EU had us where they wanted us then they would not have spent all that time putting this Withdrawal Agreement together. They can do so much more damage to the United Kingdom if they are given the chance.

        You can see the joy on the faces of Tusk, Merkel, Macron, Junker etc at the chance to get this deal through.

          1. Martin Howe QC:

            Secondly, the WA would still contain the so-called transition period. It is understood (although this is not reflected in the legal text) that Boris Johnson’s government would not agree to extend this period beyond December 2020. During this period, the UK would be subject to all EU laws, both those that exist now and those that are brought in during that period, but would no longer have a vote or veto.

            This situation is highly dangerous for some industries in particular: financial services, who may be subjected to rule changes designed to force business such as Euro derivatives clearing from the City into Continental centres, and our fishing industry who will be vulnerable to further severe damage during the period before they can escape from the Common Fisheries Policy. Against that, it is hard to see what is now the justification for this over elaborate transition period when we are going to change to a free trade relationship with the EU instead of remaining in the customs union.

            Briefings for Brexit

            What I’ve underlined could, if Johnson gets his “deal” through, be the moves that expose Johnson et.al. to be the fools that they are. Is there anybody who believes that a UK Prime Minister from any of the parties would have the strength of purpose to tell the EU to get lost, we’re going our own way at the end of transition?
            Von der Leyen’s statement last night that she and the Commission have plenty of work to do with the UK has a sinister ring to it.

        2. But that’s the whole point, the withdrawal agreement is all about keeping us where they want us.

          1. sosraboc – The purpose of this W/A is to stop us leaving and being a successful nation state again. It gives the EU even more control than they have now. They will tell us how much to pay them each year and we will not be able to say no. They will bring in new laws and we will obey.

            It is not about just keeping us where we are, it is about giving the EU more and taking away from us. With all of the “new arrivals” that will be flowing in from Europe in the next few years, they will have enough to streamroller their way through a 3rd or 4th referendum and permanently lock us in the EU.

            That is the level of treachery that we are facing. Not just a slight delay “as we are” but the removal of our future itself.

          2. What happens if we decide to not pay what they demand and refuse to accept their new rules etc.

          5. I’d like to think so, clyde, but having spoken to a lot of voters over the years, I fear they are resistant to change.

          6. Yep!

            I am surprised that anyone can possibly think that the damned thing is good for Britain.

  89. Letwin amendment could scupper and or confuse things tomorrow. The order of the votes could also affect things. IT is a clear attempt to scupper Brexit

    1. Colour me surprised, Bill. I mean, it isn’t as if they haven’t been trying to kill off the result of the referendum for the last three and a bit years.

      1. It appears this means even if Boris’s bill is appoved is that the Benn act still applies. It is confusing I am not sure I fully understood how it works

  91. For many years Tony Benn was considered by many to be the bogey man. It is strange that his dull son, a man with far less charisma, may well turn out to be the person who inflicted the most serious damage to Britain.

    Does anyone truly believe that Juncker really means that if the Boris/May Surrender deal is voted down that there will be no extension and that Britain will leave the EU on WTO terms?

    1. Merkel has said ‘nein’. There will be an extension if Boris’s ‘deal’ fails in the Commons.

      1. Because they see that as the best chance of keeping us in the EU when the traitors here finally kill it off.

  94. Not content with the surrender treaty Letwin wants to make sure there cannot be any unexpected slip ups

          2. I don’t think that looks a bit like Auric Goldfinger, Oddjob, Rosa Klebb – or even Spartie, Polly.

      2. He has the sort of leerish sneer on his face which makes you want to grind it into the dirt with your heel. And I am a peaceable person.

        1. ‘Twas only a light-hearted comment, and I can’t be arsed to argue, but Jo Maugham QC, as mentioned in the Anti-British Broadcasting Corporation report which you cite, is correctly known as Jolyon Toby Dennis Maugham QC. Jocelyn Maugham is an Australian artist…

  97. Utter shock and horrification !

    I always used to make my own puff, flaky, short and rough puff pastry but so many tv Chefs said they don’t bother any more and buy it in ready made. It is very time consuming to make and the quality is just as good. The liars !
    I found out today that you can’t buy butter pastry any more. They now all use palm oil. The pastry is now Vegan friendly and tasteless. The batsards.

    2. Palm oil?

      That is terrible.. why not butter.. To hell with Vegans and Halal orientated wassocks .. that is inverted racism.. Palm oil is just not sustainable .. all the deforestation for the sake of palm oil plantations , hell’s teeth what on earth is going on .. I see that even some spreads have palm oil now .. We have gone back to butter.

      1. Waitrose sell the Jus-Rol range. They say the palm oil comes from sustainable sources and has green credentials.

        I went back to butter when we had non stop scaremongering over all different types of food and just thought….i’ll have a little of what i fancy and they can all bugger orf.

        I’m on a no buy French embargo at the moment but my favourite butter is President salted. I shall probably try Cornish instead. Unsalted for cooking of course.

          1. I think i might start ordering it online. I believe it’s freezable. I really don’t care how much it costs. I just use decent butter in the occasional sandwich for lunch and when i have some toast.

        2. There is no such thing as sustainable palm oil. It is a con (in my opinion).
          Boot the natives off their land, and cut down the rain forest. Then apply to the sustainable certification board. They issue a “sustainable palm oil ” certificate. Job done. All your packing then boasts of “sustainable”. It is a flat out lie.
          Have a look down the biscuit aisle in any supermarket. Around 90% of products now contain palm oil, and millions hectares of rain forest have been destroyed so Rowntrees can now make an extra 1p profit on each KitKat.

          2. Yes, I looked it up, but omitted to make the change. This is a post-prandial post.

          5. Exactly. The rolls called Aberdeen butteries are traditionally made with half butter/half lard. The supermarket version uses palm oil, but they still call them butteries.

          6. I was supposed to be sent to Borneo in connection with work at this same time of year in 1997. The trip was called off because of out of control wildfires that were destroying thousands of square miles of jungle. The fires had been started to clear ground for palm oil plantations. The smoke was so bad it was blanketing the Malaysian mainland as well as Borneo.

        3. Our favourite butter is also President salted .. I don’t know why it tastes so different to the others but it does.

          Palm oil is high in saturated fat. One tablespoon of palm oil contains 55 percent of the daily recommendation of saturated fat. 2. Up to 300 football fields of forest are cleared every HOUR to make room for palm plantations.

          1. The real reason they have stopped using butter is because the price went up quite substantially.

            I think the quality and the creaminess of the milk to make the butter makes a huge difference to the taste. Wonderful on toast or a scone.

          2. Just finished a pack of President ‘spreadable’, Very good, but becomes ‘unspreadable’ if it’s left out of the fridge fore more than a few minutes. I’m quite impessed with Trewithen Dairy Spreadable, which is a blend of Cornish butter and sunflower oil, but the taste is quite pleasant. I get mine from Ocado…

          3. I suspect it’s demi-sel. It’s certainly good.
            Our local French supermarché sells possibly 50 variations of butter.

      2. There has been an alert about solid chunks of palm oil being washed up on beaches in the south, T_B. It is highly toxic for dogs. Just thought I’d mention it in case. Ships are allowed to discharge it beyond 12 miles from shore, but inevitably, it washed up on the beaches.

          1. No, this was a notification by vets and it was definitely palm oil. There had been deaths among dogs who had ingested it.

          2. We had a Labrador that swallowed a jellyfish.
            Poor dog had violent diarrhoea for a week.

            Served it right, greedy creature.

          4. I’ve seen a sea turtle “evacuate”.

            One of my great pleasures is swimming off reefs or in seaweed/kelp beds. Turtles move beautifully. If there is reincarnation, a turtle is fairly high up my choice list. Behind a top raptor or dolphin but well in front of a mosquito.

          7. My woodwork teacher at school was one of the builders, he was forever telling stories about how it was the best plane of the second world war.

          8. 4 ton bomb load, same as some of the B17s and not a lot less than their maximum and much faster.

            That’s the benefit of not too much weight of extra crew, armour and armorment of guns that weren’t going to hit much anyway.

      3. I am fairly sure than nothing sold in the UK in the 1950s contained palm oil. Palm oil is the cheapest edible fat. I suspect that some of the “sunflower oil” sold in supermarkets is actually palm oil.
        I asked our local environmental health people to check but they told me to clear off as the laboratory test was too expensive.

      4. We have been using butter again for years now, Belle, ever since I read about trans-fats and how unhealthy they are. You can only die once, and you might as well enjoy the journey.

        1. It’s the same thing with a lot of tasty food that has been replaced with”synthetic better for you stuff”, the original is much better for you in moderation, of course! So much is made from chemicals these days that I have ended up going to the original for taste and healthy benefits.

        2. ‘Evening, Poppiesmum, Olive oil into a hot pan and, when the oil is hot, half as much again with butter. Makes for good taste and the hot olive oil prevents the butter burning.

        3. Never stopped, pm. Cream, butter, milk, lard, fat on meat etc – all good quality and in moderation.

      1. Seems i have been a victim of fake news. I shall check ingredients next time i buy.

        I have looked at several supermarkets but from your link i can’t find ingredients lists…except for this one from Waitrose. Show me in this list where the butter in the butter puffs is…

        Jacobs · 200 g

        Mcvities butter puffs 200g butter puffs, suitable for vegetarians the
        light and flaky biscuit. contains gluten, may contain eggs, milk, sesame
        seeds, soyasoybeans. Ingredients Flour (Wheat Flour, Calcium, Iron,
        Niacin, Thiamin), Vegetable Oil (Palm), Wheat Starch, Salt.Mcvities
        Butter Puffs 12X 200G

          1. I am off to the supermarket tomoz and will have a look at what is available.

            I have seen that site from jusrol but that doesn’t actually mean they have any.

            I don’t need to tell you that when you do a google search for something all sorts of sites say they have it but they don’t.

            I shall put my spade away now and get back to you.

        2. May contain floor sweepings, snot, sweat and eaudefart.

          If you are unlucky may also contain spider poop, rat droppings and dandruff.
          If you are very unlucky may also contain health and safety inspectors.

    5. Isn’t “rough puff pastry” a contradiction in terms? (There is a technical term for that, but it escapes me at the moment.)

      1. I’m surprised that you don’t know the difference. Too concentrated on crumbles you are.. :o)

        Puff pastry is a long process where as rough puff takes short cuts but still has the lamination.

        1. I will have you know, Phizzee, that I learnt all I know about making puff pastry from scratch (and other culinary matters) from Mrs Peggy Puddephat (yes, that was her real name) in Chesham, Bucks in the late 1960s.

          2. Very much so. I made good friends with the local bookseller at Chapter One on the High Street.

        1. Thank you, Sos, I can always rely on your for elucidation. (You are Monsieur Aide-Memoire in my book.)

  98. Hello again. Put up with it. I’m back.
    I’ve been away for a few days break. No internet. Hardly glanced at TV,
    So what do I find now ? Boris has produced a deal. Makes no difference. It will be voted down.
    They don’t know what they want, and when they get it, they don’t want it.
    The Irish will start fighting one another again, and the English will be good Europeans. That Scottish
    woman will carry on shouting. Don’t ask me about Wales.

    2. In the Betfair market, there has been movement and now it’s rated a 59% chance of passing.

    1. Never thought I would be cheering Corbyn on and hoping he can defeat this sellout.

          1. A one night stand would be sufficient, I think (although please note I do not speak from experience!).

    2. That should be retweeted to every MP, every hour on the hour, the quarters and the half hours. Right through the night.

  100. Goodnight, all. Off to No 1 Radio School tomorrow for a meeting, so an early start. QRT for now.

      1. I should have put a full stop after No as it’s an abbreviation for number, but I can’t disagree with you about Radio 1 🙂

  101. Anyone else got to the stage where a deal can only be a bad thing? I’ve given up on a deal. No deal is the only ‘full’ escape plan, think Colditz!

    1. Given the EU’s unwillingness to do a meaningful deal, there are only two valid options – stay in, or “crash” out. The various withdrawal agreements leave the country with the worst of both worlds, namely still paying in, still having “rule” from Brussels, but having no say in the making of those rules.

      As Theresa May said at the start of the whole process, “A bad deal is worse than no deal”. At least she got that right.

      3. It was the only thing she got right. And then, in the end, she failed. As she did at everything.

    2. A ‘deal’ in the Colditz analogy would be being allowed to stand at a guardpost with a wooden rifle with plaster bullets, but not being allowed to step outside the gate, while being excused roll-call.

  102. Channel 4 launches menopause policy ensuring cool and quiet workspaces

    I guess we will have learn to lip read when there programs are on

      2. Do we have to go easy on female presenters/reporters when it’s that “time of the month”?

        2. It might be a bit like LGBT meetings in the States. Each speaker announces their claimed gender and their preferred pro nouns

  103. I do wish someone would get a condition check on the ER protestor who climbed on the roof of the Tube train and then fell into a heated argument with some commuters. I think the general public needs to know the degree of suffering he has endured in pursuance of his cause….

    2. He seems to have been quite aggressive for a Buddhist… That’s how he gets his kicks, I suppose…..

  104. Sir Alan Sugar criticises Airbnb ‘scammers’ after family of six turn up at his London property for holiday
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/10/18/sir-alan-sugar-criticises-airbnb-scammers-family-six-turns-london/

    An Airbnb scam saw an American family turn up to Sir Alan Sugar’s house believing they had booked it, the peer has claimed.

    The business magnate, 72, said six people arrived at one of his London properties on Thursday expecting to rent it for three days.

    Lord Sugar then sold them London Bridge at a knock-down price.

    1. Curious to think that Lord Sugar is on first name terms with Bill Gates, having been in computers for a long time.

        1. Is that the PCW? I had one c. 1988. I then bought a refurbished Amstrad PC from Morgan Computers in New Oxford Street. Took it home, plugged it in, and it blew up. Took it back the following weekend; was directed to the queue for exploding computers (which was the longest in the shop).

          Happy days…

          1. Possibly. I am not really into computers; I use them and that’s it. Owing to MOH having been interested since the early years we have quite a few museum pieces, including an Einstein, a ZX80 and Bbc Bs/Acorns.

        2. But it’s beautiful! Such a simple UI, an uncomplicated file system.

          Compared to the farce of Catalina, the abomination that is Windows 10 – I mean, really. It’s Windows 2000 under all the slap, that’s just fluff and nonsense to make it harder to get things done.

    1. Boris has been sold a pig with no tits.

      What a boar (yes pedants, that was deliberate) this is becoming!

  106. Just watched a recording of a programme about the discovery of the North Pole and for which Robert Peary the American explorer has always had the credit. I was aware that there was a controversy about this in that another American Frederick Cook claimed to have been there a year earlier. It now seems that both of them lied and a Brit, Wally Herbert was the first person to stand at 90 degrees latitude North in 1969.

      1. True. I was rather taken aback by its discovery just a few years short of the Moon landings!

    2. Sounds like Columbus ‘discovering’ America. The fact that it already existed is just an inconvenient fact.

  107. Afternoon, all. It’s been raining again here, so no work in the garden. Spent most of the morning trying to deal with Scottish Power who were threatening to send the bailiffs in because we hadn’t paid an estimated account. Then the rest of the morning was taken up hanging on the end of a phone while being told that my call was important to them to make a formal complaint that the meter hadn’t been read as it should have been at least once during the quarter and that the “escalation” was unnecessary. I most certainly did not appreciate being told that there would be extra charges because they were sending a debt collector. Whatever happened to “the customer is always right” and no one can force you to pay an estimate because there is no proof that you actually owe the sum?

    1. Is the estimate considerably higher than the actual meter reading?

      If it is, consider writing a letter to some of the most senior individuals in SP with your reading and the estimate and inform them that you will be suing them personally, as well as SP, for defamation if bailiffs are sent in. Send the letters recorded delivery.

      It might not be legal, it will cost you a few quid and your time, but it will certainly attract their attention.

      My late F-i-L got a tax demand that was incorrct and the tax people threatened him. He did just that and the matter was resolved by return of post with a grovelling apology..

      1. I don’t disagree – though Scotland is a foreign jurisdiction and what succeeds in England may be trickier.

        And, in England, you cannot use the Small Claims Court for defamation.

        My standard approach – once 100% pissoffness has been reached – is to write a letter setting out ON ONE SIDE (they never read the second page) just how wrong the company/HMRC/utility etc is – heading the letter “THIS IS A COMPLAINT” – but, more importantly, putting “THIS IS A COMPLAINT” on the envelope.

        Over the last 10 years it has worked quite satisfactorily – and I haven’t had to waste money on court fees.

        1. I once got hold of the Chairman’s home address and sent him a letter telling him I would be camping in his garden until he sorted out my justified complaint.

          I got a call from a flunkey first thing in the morning and the whole problem was resolved then and there.
          When it gets personal to the individual they generally react.

          1. Nowadays with Data Protection bollux it is much, much more difficult to find out where the barstewards live.

            Companies House no longer shows directors’ home addresses. I fought against that when I was their Complaints Adjudicator but to no avail. Govt policy, innit.

          2. Companies house though will give an address. It may be the business premises or their solicitors or accountants address

          3. Like so much hassle, it was years ago.

            Life seems so much easier now, though I am confident that getting a carte de sejour will be an absolute nightmare.

          5. Perigueux stopped several months ago.

            Now we must wait and see what happens and then use the new national website to upload whatever details they decide they want.
            At least with it now being national rather than local there will be consistency of requirements, every prefecture seemed to want something different.

          6. That’s my approach, Sos. If possible, I address the letter to the chairman at his home address.

        2. He is though in the wrong. An Energy company does not have to read a meter every quarter, If he has not payed the bills submitted then they can send in the debt collectors in fact if they have they may have obtained a CCJ which is not something you want to have

          If the facts are as give he would not win in the Small Claims court

          1. The company itself told me it should have read the meter once in every quarter – that’s their standard.

          2. Unless you can prove that you have a problem AS far as I know they do not read the meters quarterly. All the power companies sub contract the meter reading and there are only two or three companies used

            I have checked the relevant legislation and it now only required meters to be read every 2 years

            Your supplier must make “reasonable endevours” to read your meter at least once every two years. If your meter is on the inside of your property or somewhere that the meter reader would not have access to if you were not present when they visited, then they most likely have not done anything wrong.

          3. We have particular problems with reading our meter ourselves, Bill (see a previous post) and the company acknowledges that. They admitted they should have read our meter.

      2. My problem is I have to have the agility of a mountain goat in order to read the meter, which is high up near the ceiling above the fridge freezer. It requires buttons to be pressed to get the reading. The company knows this and we are, in fact, classed as a “vulnerable customer” owing to our age and health issues. Customer services admitted it was completely out of order to have contacted us in the way that they did because “escalation” should not have been triggered anyway as there was a fortnight’s grace between getting the reminder and sending in the heavies – the reminder hadn’t even arrived when they phoned me up. It just annoys me that my time is taken up and wasted dealing with their mistakes.

        2. I have never heard of a meter that required buttons to be pressed

          You could ask them to move the meter but that would cost you. Simplest solution would be a SMART meter

          1. We looked into having the meter moved and yes, it would indeed cost us and no small sum. We have economy 7, which is why buttons have to be pressed to get the two readings. It’s amazing the things one learns on Nottl, Bill 🙂

          2. They have only a legal requirement to read the meter every 2 years so your best option seems to be to request a SMART meter, That should not cost you anything. Without that you either have to read the meter and send them the readings or you end up with estimates that can be very inaccurate

          3. They’re costing us all a fortune.

            And the blasted monitors don’t work half the time, reset the other half, change their settings.

            Oh the delight of seeing your bill is £999.99999999999999 for using -/- of energy.

            It’s all about scaremongering.

          1. We will qualify in May next year, but due to MOH’s health issues, we are already on their “protected species” register 🙂

          2. I didn’t know that, thanks for the info. I am not yet 75, but I will be there in a few years’ time, DV.

  108. Majority of Voters Support Voter ID

    61% Support Voter ID
    26% Do Not
    13% No View

    Labour Voters

    48% Support Voter ID
    39% Do Not
    13% No View

    Conservative Voters

    79% Support Voter ID
    14% Do Not
    7% No View

    1. Those who don’t support it are the foreign crowd who like the corruption to get their man in place.

      1. It ddi not surprise me that Labor voters are far less keen. They did not do figures for the Lib-Dem’s to be similar to Labours

  109. Apparently facial recognition can’t idenitfy the confused crowd. I’m not surprised by this. After all, you’ve got a bloke who thinks he’s a woman. If he doesn’t know who he is and is trying to be someone else why would the phone be expected to know?

    On that note – the war queen said I was terrifically boring as all I talked about to the other women was recipes, dog care, cheese and gym classes.

    Why can’t you have an affair like a normal husband!

    1. Uh oh. Sounds like she wants one or is having one. Keep your marriage alive……go Dogging. :o)

          1. Looks very nice. I’ve only been to Rhyll. That’s Rhyll on Phillip Island Australia. :o)

      1. Nööö…

        Bin auf der Suche nach dem Nachfolgerroman für nächstes Jahr. Ich habe schon 2 auf einem Shortlist u. die Entscheidung muß bis März getroffen werden . Ein Mitglied meiner Gruppe hat mich heute mit’m Buch überrascht.

        1. This is an English speaking site. Try to be less rude than your normal bitchy self sweetie. BTW. Hows the boyfriend?

          5. They’re to blame for all this gender nonsense. We’ve just got nouns., totally asexual.

            The French have genders for their nouns, masculine and feminine, but they are so mixed up they think a vagina is masculine.

            The bloody Germans had to go one further and introduce neuters.

            The rest is history.

      2. Guck mal – da Du Dich mit mir unterhältst, hast Du einen Minushaken geerntet! 😉

        Obwohl der Täter höchstwahrscheinlich kein Wort Deutsch versteht. Wie dämlich ist das? Ein Volltrottel.

        2. Blimey, Peddy, that’s one heck of a long title you have given your latest German novel!

          :-))

  115. Chanced my arm tonight and watched HIGNFY.. Wasn’t bad actually.

    Now waiting with baited breath G.Norton. He has Linda Hamilton and Arnold Schwartzenegger on the red sofa. Report later..I will be back.

  116. Yes, this contribution summarises where I am tonight(BTW, this is not my comment):

    ROBERT POLATAJKO 18 Oct 2019 10:13PM
    I am an ardent Brexiteer who would prefer a no deal brexit but this deal needs to succeed.

    The alternative is that the Remainer establishment, judiciary and broadcasters succeed in cancelling Brexit.

    I’m willing to accept this highly imperfect deal because we can then continue the fight over the years to come to gain true independence.

    We now know the extent of the Remainer enemy.

    Brexit has succeeded in exposing the Remainer , globalist, left wing extremists who run our country.

    There will be a reckoning.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/10/18/boris-johnson-within-touching-distance-brexit-deal-victory-following/

    1. Didn’t I do well, folks? People are saying we’ve got a deal that gets us out, whereas I’ve actually signed us up to vasselage for the foreseeable future!

  119. Much discussion on the Political Betting site about srong possibility of Deal getting apprved tomorrow AND an amendment to have a 2nd Referendum (vs. Remain).

    If this happens, the 2nd Referendum will be a complete waste of time and money because a Boris backed Deal approved by Parliament will smash Remain in a 2nd Referendum. Prediction : 63% to 37%. At least this will stuff Remain(ers) forever and a day.

      1. SAdly, yes. The obvious intent was to make it such a bad deal as to force us back into the damned thing.

      2. That is obviously the purpose of the Withdrawal Agreement. To give Brussels the necessary powers to play cat and mouse with Britain and eventually after years of fraught and exhausting negotiations over the mirage of ”free trade”, and after endless British concessions, to return Brits to the exact same point, or worse, where they started.

    2. Uncle George is a clever guy and having spent over £100,000,000 on his Remain project, he has this nicely sewn up whichever way the dice fall…

    3. Why would remain even be on the paper?

      We voted to leave. As it is, that bastard Letwin is trying to fight to keep us chained to the wretched thing.

      Truly, these utter traitorous scum need hanging. I’m tired of being nice. Drag them out of their homes, string them up and let them swing.

  120. Off topic.

    I was watching a streaming video, one of the old Sharpe series: Sharpe’s Justice, and just over halfway through up pops a message ” You’ve used up your free allowance, subscribe to continue watching.”
    B@stards.
    Needless to say I didn’t subscribe.

      1. Thanks, but the one in question refuses to start for me, I’ve no idea why.

        I’ve watched most of them several times but this particular one is a pig to find.

        1. Have you downloaded them via utorrent or bittorrent?? you can’t play them straight from the link

          1. I hunt around and usually they work it’s this particular episode that’s proving difficult

          1. I asked a friend, but David Cameron only wanted to use the pig’s head in an unacceptable manner, so I was frozen out.

  121. Latest mail to Mr R, as he’s voting on the Boris disaster tomorrow…………….

    Uncle George is an extremely shrewd and clever guy and having spent over £100,000,000 on his ”Britain must Remain” project, I think he has this nicely sewn up whichever way the dice fall…….

    After all, nobody seems to know for sure who was the brains behind the extremely sophisticated, restrictive and wrongly named ”Withdrawal Agreement” which Boris so desperately wants to sign, but the circumstantial evidence overwhelmingly points at George!

    Polly

  123. Manchester Arndale incident: Police make arrest and no reported injuries after reports of man with knife after the incident that took place yesterday

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