Friday 7 October: How new grammar schools could avoid the unfairness of the past

Posted on by Geoff Graham

An unofficial place to discuss the Telegraph letters, established when the DT website turned off its comments facility (now reinstated, but we prefer ours),
Intelligent, polite, good-humoured debate is welcome, whether on or off topic. Differing opinions are encouraged, but rudeness or personal attacks on other posters will not be tolerated. Posts which – in the opinion of the moderators – make this a less than cordial environment, are likely to be removed, without prior warning.  Persistent offenders will be banned.

Today’s letters (visible only to DT subscribers) are here.

874 thoughts on “Friday 7 October: How new grammar schools could avoid the unfairness of the past”

  1. Good morning all and the mornings are getting increasingly reluctant to get light!
    A dry start here with little wind and 8°C outside.

  5. Well said Grizz!

    Hands-off policing doesn’t win public confidence
    SIR – I can tell Roy Ramm (Letters, October 6) why chief police officers don’t already know that visiting crime scenes helps to solve cases, reassure victims and prevent further crimes: the majority of them never did any policing at the sharp end.

    They were mollycoddled products of the graduate entry scheme, with degrees in sociology, politics or music. Their accelerated rise in rank did not include any time spent feeling the collars of criminals, giving directions to the public or reassuring crime victims over a nice cup of tea.

    It was those responsible for implementing such a hare-brained scheme who were in the vanguard of destroying the public’s confidence in a force that was once the envy of the world.

    Alan G Barstow
    Onslunda, Skåne, Sweden

    1. Should be the top letter. That Alan G Barstow fellow knows what he’s talking about!

      1. A good BTL response:

        Two Together
        11 MIN AGO
        The police are too busy arresting vicar’s wives who have been reported by malicious trans activists, to attend a burglary.

        * * *

        The scandalous arrest of a priest’s wife for a hurty word is still bugging me – and, it seems, Mark Steyn if his repetition of this outrage yesterday evening is any guide.

    3. Has the tide turned on woke coppers?
      By Richard Norrie

      Should pursuing non-violent ‘hate crime’ really be a top police priority?
      There has been some welcome pushback against identitarian influence on police
      There is a well embedded infrastructure of political activists within our police forces

      https://capx.co/has-the-tide-turned-on-woke-coppers/

      1. 365903+ up ticks,

        C,
        The whole woke issue is crap a few years back much would have been settled with a thick lip.

        1. I can only identify three types of ‘sexuality’:

          1. Normal.
          2. Queer.
          3. Mentally ill.

          Those three cater for every eventuality it is possible to encounter or envisage.

    4. Has the tide turned on woke coppers?
      By Richard Norrie

      Should pursuing non-violent ‘hate crime’ really be a top police priority?
      There has been some welcome pushback against identitarian influence on police
      There is a well embedded infrastructure of political activists within our police forces

      https://capx.co/has-the-tide-turned-on-woke-coppers/

    1. Is it true the Party has nominate Saint Agur as its Patron Saint on the grounds that it also is : ‘Blue, Soft and Creamy’?

      Morning Michael and all

          1. ‘Morning Bob! Wishing you a very Happy Birthday, and hope you have a wonderful day! Gosh! Aren’t you young! 🎂🍾🍷🎉

      2. Morning Bob. Many Happy Returns. I’m sure Vlad would be pleased to know that he shares a birthday with such an illustrious Nottler as yourself!

      7. We can take a hint.
        Happy Birthday, Bob3.
        As it’s a Friday, you have 3 days to really whoop it up.

    3. Hurrah! One of the few leaders in Europe that defends civilisation. And no, Liz Truss, you are not one of them.

    4. Do you think Mr Biden is wondering if he could use a MOAB to blow out all his candles?

  13. How new grammar schools could avoid the unfairness of the past

    Something that never much gets a mention but areas that have kept their grammar schools in London at least appear to be much better places to live, mainly because over the years they have attracted the kind of people that will go that extra mile to try to get their children into these schools, while leaving neighbouring boroughs without people that have any drive and ambition.

    1. It has been proved (a French study that was disappointed it didn’t get the result it was looking for) that selective education is a much better facilitator of social mobility than comprehensive education.

  14. Oh yeah?? Don’t believe or trust him for one second…

    ‘Solve Ulster problem and we’ll agree migrant deal’: Emmanuel Macron says EU-wide migration agreement is possible… if Liz Truss backs down on Northern Ireland

    France will allow Britain to strike an EU-wide migration deal conditionally
    However senior French officials say truss must back down on Ulster Brexit row
    The Government is trying to rewrite a key part of the Northern Ireland Protocol
    A move by Truss to trigger Article 16 would ramp up the tensions with Brussels

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11289735/Emmanuel-Macron-says-EU-wide-migration-agreement-possible-Truss-backs-NI.html

    1. We know Macron. Ms Truss apparently does not. Ms Truss should be full on in defence of the UK not smooching and sucking up to these nasty and untrustworthy French turncoats.

      1. Nobody trusts the French, but I prefer a face to face chat to posturing across the Channel.

        1. I prefer telling Micron to keep his nose out of NI and to start policing the Channel (both of us).

  17. “Ms Truss said Macron is a friend, Putin is the foe.” This is the caption to a BBC interview with the current PM, Ms Truss. How can our Prime Minister see things so arse about face? Putin has never harmed us, but we have supplied weapons to his enemy. Macron has done his best to destroy us and has succeeded in breaking up the UK.
    Our country would be better off being run by the No10 cat.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-63167530

      1. The darkest day was when Putin invaded – until then many of us were completely on his side.

        Our natural instincts in supporting him and it was beyond doubt that he was wrought by the West’s incessant moves eastwards he became perplexed in the extreme and lost his judgement as Othello did.

    2. This is the awful thing; if you look at what Putin, China – even Saudi Arabia FFS! – is saying – they are all complaining about Western lies, cheating, swindling and bullying.
      No government in the world has the moral high ground, but there is enough truth in what they are saying to give them the advantage of fighting on the right side.
      Britain’s mistake since the war has been to join ourselves at the hip with the US – for which our establishment and their Pilgrim Society, Chatham House links to US banksters are largely to blame.

  18. Steerpike
    Sadiq Khan’s strange stabbing statement
    6 October 2022, 4:38pm

    What an odd thing Sadiq Khan said following this morning’s stabbings in central London. Shortly before 10 a.m., three people were attacked by a man on a bike in Bishopsgate. The criminal is still at large, according to the Telegraph. This horrifying was no surprise to Londoners, so you would think that the Mayor would – from experience – strike the right chord. Instead, Khan had this to say:

    “The good news is, it’s not a terror attack. And another piece of good news is the three victims of the stabbing are not in life-threatening situations, thank God. But it’s just a reminder of the dangers of carrying a knife…

    Had anyone died this morning, would Khan really have suggested that it was ‘good news’ it wasn’t a terror attack? Just a regular stabbing? It’s not a thought Mr S thinks will be held by the families of those injured.

    The Mayor also seemed to apportion blame to a sentient knife – and not, you know, the assailant. He continued: ‘We’ve seen this year, thankfully, we’ve actually seen a reduction in knife crime injuries, a reduction in knife crime injuries in those below 25.’ From a pretty high peak though, eh?

    ‘I’m determined to continue lobbying the government to reverse their cuts in policing and to reverse their cuts in young people,’ said Khan. Police budgets have, of course, increased by £3.8 billion since Khan took office. However, Londoners are used to the Mayor’s buck passing.

    So where was Khan while the carnage was unfolding in the City? On LBC with James O’Brien, it appears, urging the UK to rejoin the EU’s single market. Plus ça change…

    **********************************************

    Mark Smith • 15 hours ago • edited
    Google translate, Khanish to English:
    Khanish: “The good news is, it’s not a terror attack.”
    English, “The good news is, it’s not an Islamic attack

    Groundswell • 11 hours ago
    George Floyd: “Brutal killing”.
    David Amess: “Passed away”.
    Never forget.

    1. ‘Cuts in young people’?? What an extraordinarily, if inadvertently, apt phrase.

    2. Let us not forget that Khan thinks stabbing etc is all part and parcel of life in a big city. It never used to be – I wonder what changed?

        1. Always was and always will be.
          I wonder how much he takes home in ‘expenses’ each year.
          What has he ever achieved ?

          2. Who looks much the better for it.
            I wonder how much her hair problems were due to stress? The stress of harbouring a viper in her bosom?

          4. Liberty bodices can have that effect.
            Oooh, look ….. Uncle Bill’s gorn a funny colour.

  22. Today’s funny:

    Drink Driving
    I would like to share with you all an experience that I recently had regarding drinking and driving. As you would know, even those of us who are just social drinkers have had near brushes with the law on our way home.

    Well, I for one have done something about it. The other night I was out for dinner and had a few drinks with some friends. Having had a few too many glasses of wine and knowing full well I was struggling, I did something I’ve never done before. I took a bus home.

    I arrived home safely and without incident, which was a real surprise as I have never driven a bus before

  24. The RT headlines this morning are all horrible. Apparently RT News does not do social media stuff unlike the BBC.
    https://mail.yahoo.com/d/folders/1/messages/ADA_5fwxumVHYz9XEgU_wNh_8cE?.intl=uk&.lang=en-GB&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly9tYWlsLnlhaG9vLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAHYzK1VUWdrVzecKGfxgFoDCQfLnlM9lvp7zfIlbkba52Ud_pj1n7dy_uL5Lb2eIB1ti3mjG3Oa5RIq44Y_NmDjaAKAHKRbe5VrXRVcyWhtZVxjZiMO3-qy3zuUqkUzjt9Gvbv5XGhjVFJsPhTto-k2iJgKa_J7GFcW74Hr6jtC_

      2. I juggle them Bob. Al Jazeerah’s not too bad and TRT is good on everything except where Erdogan’s interests lie.

  25. Hands-off policing doesn’t win public confidence

    SIR – I can tell Roy Ramm (Letters, October 6)
    why chief police officers don’t already know that visiting crime scenes
    helps to solve cases, reassure victims and prevent further crimes: the
    majority of them never did any policing at the sharp end.

    They were mollycoddled products of the graduate entry scheme, with
    degrees in sociology, politics or music. Their accelerated rise in rank
    did not include any time spent feeling the collars of criminals, giving
    directions to the public or reassuring crime victims over a nice cup of
    tea.

    It was those responsible for implementing such a hare-brained scheme
    who were in the vanguard of destroying the public’s confidence in a
    force that was once the envy of the world.

    Alan G Barstow
    Onslunda, Skåne, Sweden

  26. Morning all 🙂
    I’m in a bit of a rush this morning I’ve an appointment at the quacks in an hour.
    Slayders.

  27. Well, what surprise. The perlice – amazingly and exceptionally – have been able to say that the “stabbers” in London, yesterday, were WHITE.

    Isn’t that just a wonderful bit of luck?

    Can’t think what they would have cried had the hue been different….

          1. That film was made at time when there were fewer than 40,000 non-white people in the UK……….(sighs…)

    2. Having watched a phone video of the event, I can’t tell what colour they are, how do the police know?

        1. Must have been their accents, in the video they appeared to be masked, gloved, and hooded. The video wasn’t particularly clear.

          1. It would not surprise me in the least that, when apprehended, they turn out not to be, er, white.

  28. Good Moaning.
    Two days of spiteful, ad hominem articles have made me take the step; after 20+ years, I have cancelled my Spekkie subscription.
    Although vaguely a right of centre publication, it was never a blue lapdog magazine. But the articles were sceptical, witty and thought provoking.
    Now the magazine has several writers who are just plain vicious; the ‘girls’ in particular are indulging in the written version of pulling plaits.
    I told the Spekkie sub. department exactly why I have made this decision. Over the weekend, I will send a zinger to the head honcho.
    p.s. I do hope Douglas Murray and Rod Liddle set up websites where we can still enjoy their writing.

      1. Oh well: back to composing politely worded snottograms to lawyers and other riff riff involved in house moving transactions.

    3. Morning Anne. There’s been quite a few posts on the threads with the same view. There’s no doubt that the Spectator digital version has gone into full propaganda mode. Over the last few weeks it has produced whole strings of articles about its current target and hardly anyone else gets a look in. This week it has been Truss!

      1. I believe in giving people a chance.
        The vicious little cows in the Spekkie backed by ageing queens Leith and Lloyd (sounds like a second rate vaudeville act) are just that; vicious.

    4. Morning Anne. There’s been quite a few posts on the threads with the same view. There’s no doubt that the Spectator digital version has gone into full propaganda mode. Over the last few weeks it has produced whole strings of articles about its current target and hardly anyone else gets a look in. This week it has been Truss!

  29. https://www.altonherald.com/news/999/farnham-vandalism-police-issue-descriptions-of-teen-boys-suspected-of-catapult-rampage-566377

    The damage may be as high as £30K just to the Maltings. Notice how the police do not want to release photos. I know there was a great reluctance from the police- a force that has been busy arresting a vicar’s wife, the other day to visit the building. The vandals are believed to be members of a “community”- one that the police try to avoid dealing with, and I suppose, this is par for the course.

  30. ‘Morning, Peeps.  Raining here, so extended breakfast and, perhaps, no gardening until much later…

    In my humble opinion all military obits are remarkable, but this one is quite outstanding:

    Captain Vyvyan Howard, last British survivor of the ‘Great Escape’ camp, whose fluent German distracted the guards – obituary

    At the notorious Stalag Luft III, Howard spent hours vaulting over a wooden horse to conceal the tunnel ‘Tom’ which began in his hut

    ByTelegraph Obituaries 6 October 2022 • 5:00pm

    Captain Vyvyan Howard, who has died aged 102, was a Fleet Air Arm pilot, probably the last to fly a wartime Fairey Swordfish, and the last remaining British survivor of the infamous Stalag Luft III prisoner-of-war camp.

    In September 1940, having learnt low-level torpedo-dropping techniques in the Fairey Swordfish, Howard joined the newly equipped 828 Naval Air Squadron, flying the Fairey Albacore torpedo bomber, at Lee-on-Solent.

    In 1941 the squadron deployed to the Orkney Islands on anti-aircraft and convoy escort duties, and in June 828 NAS embarked in the aircraft carrier Victorious. On the afternoon of July 30, in bright Arctic sunshine, the squadron attacked German shipping at Kirkenes, close to the Norwegian border with Russia.

    The enemy were alerted and had strong air and flak defences. Howard recalled: “We launched our torpedo at a German ship in the harbour. As we turned to make our escape, I heard a roar of cannon fire from below us; we were hit, and the aircraft broke up around us. The next thing I knew we were in the fjord and swimming to the shore and captivity.”

    Sixteen aircraft were lost in this raid and on another on nearby Petsamo, a dozen Fleet Air Arm aircrew were killed, and a score, including Howard, were captured. Over the next 3½ years he was held in two small PoW camps, and then in June 1942 was transferred to Stalag Luft III.

    There, Howard was a keen participant in events which were dramatised in the films The Wooden Horse (1950) and The Great Escape (1963). He spent many an hour vaulting over the wooden horse or talking in his fluent German to the guards to distract them.

    The entrance to the tunnel called “Tom”, which the Germans discovered, as depicted in The Great Escape, was in Howard’s hut, and the tunnel called “Dick”, which they missed, ran directly under his hut. Howard’s fluency in German led to him attending meetings as interpreter between senior Allied prisoners and the camp commandant, Oberst Friedrich von Lindeiner. (He also learned to speak Polish and qualified as a Polish interpreter after the war.)

    Howard thought himself unlucky not to have his name drawn as one of the actual escapers, and in January 1945 he was forced to join the “Long March”, when the prisoners were marched away on foot from the advancing Russians. He recalled that he owed his life to a Polish fellow prisoner who advised him: “Don’t ever take your boots off, only loosen them, or you will never get them on again because your feet will swell.”

    After three months of harsh winter weather, and having been strafed by the RAF, Howard arrived at Wulmenau, a village south-west of Lübeck, where he wrote to his fiancée, Bernadette Taylor: “A couple of British tanks caught us today, 2 May at 11.40 hours and the infantry should be here this afternoon. Oh, ye Gods, what a day of joy and rejoicing – cheers and wild waving – all of us, English, American, Polish, Russian, Dutch, French – everybody shouting to the stormy sky.” A week later he telegrammed: “Home today. Be seeing you soon.” They married on June 2 1945.

    Charles Vyvyan Howard was born in Hartlepool on November 11 1919 and brought up in Greatham, Co Durham, where his father was headmaster of the local primary school. He won a scholarship to Henry Smith Grammar School in Hartlepool and his first job, in 1937, was in the research laboratories at ICI Billingham. As war loomed, his father advised him to join the Royal Navy and to train as a pilot.

    He learnt to fly in Tiger Moth biplanes at Elmdon, now Birmingham International Airport, and it was on weekend leave from there, “a jolly to Blackpool”, that he met his future wife. He was awarded his pilot’s wings in May 1940.

    After the war, Howard accepted a permanent commission in the Navy and was based at Culdrose for several years, flying Seafires and Sea Furies and, in the new jet age, Sea Vampires and Meteors.

    In early 1956 he took command of 830 Naval Air Squadron at RNAS Ford, Sussex, flying the Westland Wyvern, the largest propellor-driven, single-seat aeroplane to operate from a British carrier. The squadron embarked in the carrier Eagle for Operation Musketeer, the Anglo-French intervention during the Suez Crisis – the squadron’s 16 aircraft becoming the only Wyverns to see combat when Howard led the first wave, on November 1, to attack Egyptian airfields near the Suez Canal, and flew two or three sorties a day until the action was suspended.

    “It was,” he said, “a very small area to operate [in] and after a few days we were competing for the same targets with the other aircraft from the British and French carriers. It was like Piccadilly Circus. We often went against the Egyptian Air Force with their MiG jets. It was an exciting time.”

    Two aircraft were lost, and Howard was awarded the Distinguished Service Cross for gallant and distinguished services in the Near East from October to December 1956.

    In 1960 Howard took a helicopter acquaintance course before being appointed aviation adviser to the Commander in Chief, Far East Fleet. He spent two years in the Defence policy staff in Whitehall and was British Naval Attaché in Bonn (1973-75).

    He spent 10 years working at Halcrow Engineering before finally retiring fully to his home in Mollington, Oxfordshire.

    Vyvyan Howard’s wife predeceased him, and he is survived by a son and two daughters.

    Captain Vyvyan Howard, born November 11 1919, died September 14 2022 https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/16f8b3fcf5d8b8bfe9ffc41ae3ba7520baa6ad718ffa0583904845fe3dbe9887.jpg

    The photo above is of Capt. Howard, his wife Bernadette and his son, also Vyvyan

      1. A fitting BTL:

        Anna Burton 2 HRS AGO

        Everything rested on the shoulders of men like Captain Howard, and they carried the burden as if it were nothing. What an extraordinary man. Thank you Sir and RIP.

        * * *

        Apologies for the additions, problems with posting it all in the right sequence.

    2. ‘Howard spent hours vaulting over a wooden horse’
      I’ve always said exercise is bad for you.

    3. A lovely story about Peter Butterworth, the actor best known for the “Carry On” films. He auditioned for a part in the film “the Wooden Horse”. He did not get a part.
      “Butterworth was one of the vaulters covering for the escapers during the escape portrayed by the book and film The Wooden Horse. Butterworth later auditioned for the film in 1949 but “didn’t look convincingly heroic or athletic enough” according to the makers of the film”

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Butterworth

  31. What the elites think we will be saying by next year…
    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/32dc7141a500168a58e7eadc1231ac0bf6522269c70b1b9a872bb80db0ba3f39.jpg

    How they will implement their tyranny:
    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/8532ca6549741ea60dc4063ebd9b4a78093e199ee73c739e94c4f0c7a3fb26b4.jpg

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/0db3ddf63f8e78ac0eba3ddff7303f3bfb63286df6f72242c6b075ebe7cca1ed.jpg

    (needs translating from Americanish)
    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/8ec301ab05bc78c296d876272773730fedd094063ea06cf7e278e8913b035ebd.jpg

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/aa42e0400a198fb88a3f029cc960df2d9ed9b13d4028f35b88b97a81f0decada.jpg

  32. Good morning all .
    Drizzle here , breeze , mildish.. might be brighter later .

    Moh golfing … and the handrail looks wonderful on the top of the landing .. excellent result .

    Moh said that we should have put one in years ago

    1. It absolutely chucked it down here, Maggie. Just as I was collecting one of my paintings from the framers, too.

    2. I would amend the first one to read; Everything ‘free’ is paid for by someone who pays tax.

  36. Welcome to the FSU’s weekly newsletter, our round-up of the free speech news of the week. As with all our work, this newsletter depends on the support of our members and donors, so if you’re not already a paying member please sign up today or encourage a friend to join, and help us turn the tide against cancel culture.

    Elon Musk’s purchase of Twitter is definitely maybe perhaps back on

    After months of back and forth, including a legal battle with Twitter, the self-styled “free speech absolutist” Elon Musk now looks set to take charge of the social media company (FT, Reuters, WSJ). The deal, if it goes through this time, raises questions over what the platform might look like under the Tesla entrepreneur – and whether regulators and politicians will be able to stomach it.

    Musk’s vision for encrypting Twitter users’ direct messages, for instance, looks like an obvious source of conflict with the UK government. A ministerial lobbying campaign in recent years has tried to discourage tech companies from rolling out end-to-end encryption. Government officials fear they will become unable to read users’ messages at will, something they argue is important when trying to tackle terrorism or other serious offences (FT).

    And what of the billionaire’s leanings towards looser forms of content moderation? Speaking to the Telegraph, the FSU’s General Secretary Toby Young said that he “cannot see Elon Musk being willing to remove content from Twitter that’s perfectly legal but which some purse-lipped puritan has decided is too dangerous for adults to be trusted with”. Maybe not, but will his libertarian instincts lead to a run-in with the Government, particularly given that the Online Safety Bill threatens social media companies with huge fines and even jail terms for directors if they fail to do enough to stop ‘harmful content’?

    The FSU writes to YouTube about its censorship of Russell Brand

    On the subject of online censorship, the FSU has written to YouTube about its removal of a Russell Brand video, allegedly for breaching its Covid-19 medical misinformation policy after he claimed that Ivermectin had been approved by the National Institutes of Health as a safe treatment for the virus. In spite of correcting his mistake and apologising – the drug had been approved for use in clinical trials, but not for general use – Brand’s video was removed and he received a warning. As Brand pointed out in a follow-up video, you can still find videos on YouTube of people saying the Covid vaccines are 100% effective against infection, which we now know isn’t true. So why remove his video but not these ones? We’ve argued that since YouTube is clearly exercising public functions, it is subject to Article 10 of the European Convention on Human Rights and, as such, this censorship is an unlawful interference with Mr Brand’s freedom of expression. In addition, we’ve argued that it’s a breach of his Article 1 property rights. We’ve asked YouTube to restore the video and withdraw the ‘lifetime’ warning it issued to Mr Brand. You can read our letter in full here.

    Leave the adults alone – what we really need is a Children’s Online Safety Bill

    Last month, five former culture secretaries wrote an article for theTelegraph in which they argued that “watering down” the Online Safety Bill would “put children at risk”. That was a reference to the fact that the Bill as currently constituted will empower Ofcom to impose large fines on social media platforms such as Twitter, Facebook and YouTube if they fail to remove content that’s harmful to children (ConHome). A case in point is Molly Russell, the 14-year-old who took her own life in 2017. Last week, a coroner concluded that the material Molly had seen on social media that appeared to encourage suicide had “contributed to her death in a more than minimal way” (Guardian).

    The verdict was met with a chorus of voices clamouring for the bill to be passed as quickly as possible, including that of Prince William, who said that protecting young people from harm should be “a prerequisite, not an afterthought” for social media companies (Independent).

    Writing in the Spectator, Toby felt this was a classic straw man argument: “None of the bill’s opponents object to holding the Silicon Valley giants to account for the death of children like Molly.” The actual reason critics object is that the Bill doesn’t just aim to protect children from disturbing material, but grown-ups as well, including content that’s ‘legal but harmful’. No one yet knows exactly what legal material the Bill’s proponents think adults need to be protected from, although in July the Government did publish an “indicative list” of content it would like social media companies to “address”, including “some health and vaccine misinformation” (Telegraph). But as Toby pointed out on GB News, the problem with trying to incorporate nebulous, almost entirely subjective concepts like ‘misinformation’ into law is that they will inevitably be abused by political activists and defenders of official orthodoxy to silence their opponents – with the Russell Brand imbroglio a classic example of the fact that only information that challenges the status quo falls foul of this standard.

    So what guarantee do we have that it won’t just be heterodox content that’s classed as ‘misinformation’ after the Online Safety Bill is passed and YouTube becomes an even more zealous enforcer of health and vaccine orthodoxy? We need laws in place to prevent social media companies censoring legitimate discussion and debate in the name of protecting people from ‘misinformation’, not laws encouraging them to ramp it up.

    That’s why the FSU will be spending the next few weeks trying to persuade the Government to turn this piece of legislation into the Children’s Online Safety Bill. As Toby put it in the Spectator, “By all means let’s have a Bill that makes the internet safer for teenagers. But adults should be able to judge for themselves just how dangerous it is to watch videos by Russell Brand.”

    Please help us mount an effective campaign against this censorious Bill by donating to the FSU.

    Why no one trusts the police anymore

    Gender-critical media commentator (and FSU member) Caroline Farrow has criticised Surrey Police after officers “swooped on her home and arrested her in front of her children” over a series of allegedly “malicious” posts on chat board KiwiFarms, which she denies writing (Christian Today, Mail, Reclaim the Net, Sun).

    Speaking to GB News, Ms Farrow said, “I have been arrested for what was a twitter spat about gender issues.”

    One obvious question here is why the police are still behaving like this. Back in May, His Majesty’s Chief Inspector of Constabulary, Andy Cooke, used his first interview in post to make clear that the police were not the thought police, and that chief constables needed to “avoid politics with the small p”, follow the law and remember that “different thoughts” are not an offence (Times).

    In July, the Chief Executive of the College of Policing warned that the police should stop wading in to spats on Twitter and focus on solving crime (Telegraph).

    And just this week, the new Home Secretary, Suella Braverman, told the Tory Party conference: “We need to get back to common sense policing, empowering the police to tackle the issues facing the public, not policing pronouns on Twitter or non-crime… hate incidents.”

    “Unfortunately,” as Toby Young pointed out to the Mail, “it seems like Surrey Police didn’t get the memo.”

    After confiscating Ms Farrow’s electronic devices – including one used by her autistic daughter for home schooling purposes (“You never know with these birthing people, sarge”) – she was taken outside her house while officers conducted a body-search, before being driven to the local police station where she was held in a cell for several hours.

    “The investigation into these allegations is very much ongoing and relevant enquires are being carried out,” said Temporary Detective Chief Inspector David Bentley – which is more than you can usually say for Surrey Police. According to Home Office figures, between April 2021 and March 2022, they closed 29,614 of 69,199 reported offences without identifying a suspect – in percentage terms, that means 42.8% of crimes committed in the county were left un-investigated. Of the ‘high harm’ offences committed that Surrey Police did actually investigate – i.e., serious sexual offences, child abuse and violent domestic abuse – the force’s ‘clear-up rate’ was just 13.4%. The solve rate for all reported burglaries, meanwhile, was 3.5%, while the rate for theft of cars was 1.4%.

    But can the current crisis of public confidence in the police be blamed solely on flat-footed coppers in Surrey and elsewhere bungling their operational priorities? The FSU’s Research Officer, Carrie Clark, thinks not. Writing for Spiked, she points out that the problem isn’t necessarily incompetence, but an increasingly clear political bias fuelled by lobby groups like Stonewall.

    The continued willingness of the police to defy a number of recent legal rulings and go after critics of transgender ideology like Caroline Farrow is a case in point.

    In Harry Miller’s trial last year, the Court of Appeal ruled that expressing views critical of gender-identity ideology shouldn’t be treated as a police matter (Spiked). More recently, the judgement handed down in Maya Forstater’s employment appeal tribunal ruled that gender-critical beliefs, including the belief that sex is immutable and not to be conflated with gender identity, was a protected philosophical belief (Times).

    And yet despite the fact that these legal victories made clear that gender critical beliefs are perfectly lawful, officers still persistently trample over freedom of speech and even the law in the name of trans rights.

    Caroline Farrow’s case is just the tip of a very large iceberg. Last month, an official Sussex Police social-media account warned users not to question the gender identity of convicted child sex offender John Stephen Dixon (now identifying as Sally Ann Dixon), who is reportedly being sent to a women’s prison. Sussex Police told critics that any “hateful comments” directed towards the convicted child abuser would not be tolerated. They claimed that referring to Dixon as a man met the definition of a ‘hate crime’ and advised critics not to express their views. In other words, the police’s bias towards trans ideology led them to prioritise the feelings of a convicted paedophile over free speech. It took an intervention from Suella Braverman to get Sussex Police to apologise.

    Earlier this year, women’s rights campaigner Jennifer Swayne was arrested and detained for 10 hours by Gwent Police for allegedly causing “offence”. Her crime? Putting up posters saying “No Men in Women’s Prisons”.

    In July, feminist campaigner Kellie-Jay Keen was visited by police after warning online that gender self-identification would be exploited by male sex offenders to get access to vulnerable women. Police recorded this as a ‘hate incident’.

    And in August, lesbian campaigners from Get the L Out were ejected by police from Cardiff Pride for carrying signs reading “Lesbians don’t like penises”.

    So why is it that despite the Miller and Forstater rulings, the police still seem determined to engage in a politically motivated crusade against those holding the ‘wrong’ (i.e., gender critical) views?

    Maybe they’ve forgotten Robert Peel’s nine principles of policing. Issued in 1829, they form the basis of modern policing by consent. Principle five, in particular, should from now on be required reading: “Officers should seek and preserve public favour, not by pandering to public opinion but by constantly demonstrating impartial service to law, in complete independence of policy.”

    The FSU’s packed schedule of events this autumn!

    Register here for our forthcoming Online Speakeasy with comedian, writer, actor and presenter Jack Dee on Wednesday 12th October and here for our Online Speakeasy with historian, author and television presenter Neil Oliver on Wednesday 9th November.

    You can see a calendar of all our events on our Events page. As that is a public page, you cannot book members-only events on the website, so do please look out for regular emails from FSU Events for full details, including links for tickets and registration. Members who have opted to hear about FSU Events should have received an email this week. If you have not received this, do check your inbox, including your junk folder, and get in touch if you can’t find it there, using events@freespeechunion.org.

    We have two excellent sessions at the Battle of Ideas Festival taking place in London on the weekend of the 15th and 16th October. Toby will be speaking on a packed panel debating Online Safety vs Free Speech on Saturday afternoon, and the Free Speech Champions will discuss Winning Young Hearts and Minds on Sunday afternoon, with panellists including Professor Alice Sullivan and Rod Liddle. Members can access special discount tickets by entering the promo code FSU-BattleFest2022 at the top of the ticket page. Do come and say hello to us at our stall where we’ll also be selling some merch.

    Sharing the newsletter

    As with all our work, this newsletter depends on the support of our members and donors, so if you’re not already a paying member please sign up today or encourage a friend to join, and help us turn the tide against cancel culture. You can share our newsletters on social media with the buttons below to help us spread the word. If someone has shared this newsletter with you and you’d like to join the FSU, you can find our website here.

    And a warm welcome to all those people who joined in the past couple of weeks because they were so horrified by PayPal’s attempt to cancel us. You will be getting your welcome packs in the post within the next fortnight.

    Best wishes,

    1. Hey, Beatnik, you’re a member of the FTU- the Free Travel Union, Dude. Keep riding those rails, hombre and don’t let no Lee Marvin lookalike hurl you off, Man.

      1. Hey, Dean.

        I’m A#1, man, and no railroad hombre called ‘Shack’ will ever throw me (and ‘Old Cigaret’) off the No 19 and stop me highballing to Portland, Dude.

          1. Hey, Dean, I need to clamber back into the caboose to listen to that ditty from Elvin. The acoustics under this bogey, Dude, are a bit rattly!

          2. Hey, Dean, I need to clamber back into the caboose to listen to that ditty from Elvin. The acoustics under this bogey, Dude, are a bit rattly!

    2. Good morning Ursa Major

      Anyone who has studied Ethics will have come across the “naturalistic fallacy” which, to simplify it, is that it is impossible to ascribe philosophic truth to value judgements because they are subjective.

      If terms such as misinformation and disinformation are subjective and depend on a person’s opinion then they must certainly not be incorporated into law as the abuses stemming from this would be impossible to control.

      I found it interesting when Blair’s minister, David Blunkett, was found to have been involved in an adulterous relationship with the owner of The Spectator magazine. Blair leapt to his his defence saying that he had “done nothing wrong.” Of course adultery is not illegal in Britain but, according to Christian values, it is morally wrong and Blair, who vaunted his Christianity,, should have known the difference.

      An illegal action can be morally neutral (e.g. parking on a double yellow line) while a legal action (e.g. being cruel and nasty) could be both totally immoral and completely legal.

      1. Good morning, Rastaman.

        Subjectivity is the antithesis of objectivity and, as such, is the modern-day curse affecting all we behold.

      2. Yet this is what the Left want. Replace truth and fact with opinion and ideology and you can set what truth is. It’s shockingly Orwellian.

  37. Welcome to the FSU’s weekly newsletter, our round-up of the free speech news of the week. As with all our work, this newsletter depends on the support of our members and donors, so if you’re not already a paying member please sign up today or encourage a friend to join, and help us turn the tide against cancel culture.

    Elon Musk’s purchase of Twitter is definitely maybe perhaps back on

    After months of back and forth, including a legal battle with Twitter, the self-styled “free speech absolutist” Elon Musk now looks set to take charge of the social media company (FT, Reuters, WSJ). The deal, if it goes through this time, raises questions over what the platform might look like under the Tesla entrepreneur – and whether regulators and politicians will be able to stomach it.

    Musk’s vision for encrypting Twitter users’ direct messages, for instance, looks like an obvious source of conflict with the UK government. A ministerial lobbying campaign in recent years has tried to discourage tech companies from rolling out end-to-end encryption. Government officials fear they will become unable to read users’ messages at will, something they argue is important when trying to tackle terrorism or other serious offences (FT).

    And what of the billionaire’s leanings towards looser forms of content moderation? Speaking to the Telegraph, the FSU’s General Secretary Toby Young said that he “cannot see Elon Musk being willing to remove content from Twitter that’s perfectly legal but which some purse-lipped puritan has decided is too dangerous for adults to be trusted with”. Maybe not, but will his libertarian instincts lead to a run-in with the Government, particularly given that the Online Safety Bill threatens social media companies with huge fines and even jail terms for directors if they fail to do enough to stop ‘harmful content’?

    The FSU writes to YouTube about its censorship of Russell Brand

    On the subject of online censorship, the FSU has written to YouTube about its removal of a Russell Brand video, allegedly for breaching its Covid-19 medical misinformation policy after he claimed that Ivermectin had been approved by the National Institutes of Health as a safe treatment for the virus. In spite of correcting his mistake and apologising – the drug had been approved for use in clinical trials, but not for general use – Brand’s video was removed and he received a warning. As Brand pointed out in a follow-up video, you can still find videos on YouTube of people saying the Covid vaccines are 100% effective against infection, which we now know isn’t true. So why remove his video but not these ones? We’ve argued that since YouTube is clearly exercising public functions, it is subject to Article 10 of the European Convention on Human Rights and, as such, this censorship is an unlawful interference with Mr Brand’s freedom of expression. In addition, we’ve argued that it’s a breach of his Article 1 property rights. We’ve asked YouTube to restore the video and withdraw the ‘lifetime’ warning it issued to Mr Brand. You can read our letter in full here.

    Leave the adults alone – what we really need is a Children’s Online Safety Bill

    Last month, five former culture secretaries wrote an article for theTelegraph in which they argued that “watering down” the Online Safety Bill would “put children at risk”. That was a reference to the fact that the Bill as currently constituted will empower Ofcom to impose large fines on social media platforms such as Twitter, Facebook and YouTube if they fail to remove content that’s harmful to children (ConHome). A case in point is Molly Russell, the 14-year-old who took her own life in 2017. Last week, a coroner concluded that the material Molly had seen on social media that appeared to encourage suicide had “contributed to her death in a more than minimal way” (Guardian).

    The verdict was met with a chorus of voices clamouring for the bill to be passed as quickly as possible, including that of Prince William, who said that protecting young people from harm should be “a prerequisite, not an afterthought” for social media companies (Independent).

    Writing in the Spectator, Toby felt this was a classic straw man argument: “None of the bill’s opponents object to holding the Silicon Valley giants to account for the death of children like Molly.” The actual reason critics object is that the Bill doesn’t just aim to protect children from disturbing material, but grown-ups as well, including content that’s ‘legal but harmful’. No one yet knows exactly what legal material the Bill’s proponents think adults need to be protected from, although in July the Government did publish an “indicative list” of content it would like social media companies to “address”, including “some health and vaccine misinformation” (Telegraph). But as Toby pointed out on GB News, the problem with trying to incorporate nebulous, almost entirely subjective concepts like ‘misinformation’ into law is that they will inevitably be abused by political activists and defenders of official orthodoxy to silence their opponents – with the Russell Brand imbroglio a classic example of the fact that only information that challenges the status quo falls foul of this standard.

    So what guarantee do we have that it won’t just be heterodox content that’s classed as ‘misinformation’ after the Online Safety Bill is passed and YouTube becomes an even more zealous enforcer of health and vaccine orthodoxy? We need laws in place to prevent social media companies censoring legitimate discussion and debate in the name of protecting people from ‘misinformation’, not laws encouraging them to ramp it up.

    That’s why the FSU will be spending the next few weeks trying to persuade the Government to turn this piece of legislation into the Children’s Online Safety Bill. As Toby put it in the Spectator, “By all means let’s have a Bill that makes the internet safer for teenagers. But adults should be able to judge for themselves just how dangerous it is to watch videos by Russell Brand.”

    Please help us mount an effective campaign against this censorious Bill by donating to the FSU.

    Why no one trusts the police anymore

    Gender-critical media commentator (and FSU member) Caroline Farrow has criticised Surrey Police after officers “swooped on her home and arrested her in front of her children” over a series of allegedly “malicious” posts on chat board KiwiFarms, which she denies writing (Christian Today, Mail, Reclaim the Net, Sun).

    Speaking to GB News, Ms Farrow said, “I have been arrested for what was a twitter spat about gender issues.”

    One obvious question here is why the police are still behaving like this. Back in May, His Majesty’s Chief Inspector of Constabulary, Andy Cooke, used his first interview in post to make clear that the police were not the thought police, and that chief constables needed to “avoid politics with the small p”, follow the law and remember that “different thoughts” are not an offence (Times).

    In July, the Chief Executive of the College of Policing warned that the police should stop wading in to spats on Twitter and focus on solving crime (Telegraph).

    And just this week, the new Home Secretary, Suella Braverman, told the Tory Party conference: “We need to get back to common sense policing, empowering the police to tackle the issues facing the public, not policing pronouns on Twitter or non-crime… hate incidents.”

    “Unfortunately,” as Toby Young pointed out to the Mail, “it seems like Surrey Police didn’t get the memo.”

    After confiscating Ms Farrow’s electronic devices – including one used by her autistic daughter for home schooling purposes (“You never know with these birthing people, sarge”) – she was taken outside her house while officers conducted a body-search, before being driven to the local police station where she was held in a cell for several hours.

    “The investigation into these allegations is very much ongoing and relevant enquires are being carried out,” said Temporary Detective Chief Inspector David Bentley – which is more than you can usually say for Surrey Police. According to Home Office figures, between April 2021 and March 2022, they closed 29,614 of 69,199 reported offences without identifying a suspect – in percentage terms, that means 42.8% of crimes committed in the county were left un-investigated. Of the ‘high harm’ offences committed that Surrey Police did actually investigate – i.e., serious sexual offences, child abuse and violent domestic abuse – the force’s ‘clear-up rate’ was just 13.4%. The solve rate for all reported burglaries, meanwhile, was 3.5%, while the rate for theft of cars was 1.4%.

    But can the current crisis of public confidence in the police be blamed solely on flat-footed coppers in Surrey and elsewhere bungling their operational priorities? The FSU’s Research Officer, Carrie Clark, thinks not. Writing for Spiked, she points out that the problem isn’t necessarily incompetence, but an increasingly clear political bias fuelled by lobby groups like Stonewall.

    The continued willingness of the police to defy a number of recent legal rulings and go after critics of transgender ideology like Caroline Farrow is a case in point.

    In Harry Miller’s trial last year, the Court of Appeal ruled that expressing views critical of gender-identity ideology shouldn’t be treated as a police matter (Spiked). More recently, the judgement handed down in Maya Forstater’s employment appeal tribunal ruled that gender-critical beliefs, including the belief that sex is immutable and not to be conflated with gender identity, was a protected philosophical belief (Times).

    And yet despite the fact that these legal victories made clear that gender critical beliefs are perfectly lawful, officers still persistently trample over freedom of speech and even the law in the name of trans rights.

    Caroline Farrow’s case is just the tip of a very large iceberg. Last month, an official Sussex Police social-media account warned users not to question the gender identity of convicted child sex offender John Stephen Dixon (now identifying as Sally Ann Dixon), who is reportedly being sent to a women’s prison. Sussex Police told critics that any “hateful comments” directed towards the convicted child abuser would not be tolerated. They claimed that referring to Dixon as a man met the definition of a ‘hate crime’ and advised critics not to express their views. In other words, the police’s bias towards trans ideology led them to prioritise the feelings of a convicted paedophile over free speech. It took an intervention from Suella Braverman to get Sussex Police to apologise.

    Earlier this year, women’s rights campaigner Jennifer Swayne was arrested and detained for 10 hours by Gwent Police for allegedly causing “offence”. Her crime? Putting up posters saying “No Men in Women’s Prisons”.

    In July, feminist campaigner Kellie-Jay Keen was visited by police after warning online that gender self-identification would be exploited by male sex offenders to get access to vulnerable women. Police recorded this as a ‘hate incident’.

    And in August, lesbian campaigners from Get the L Out were ejected by police from Cardiff Pride for carrying signs reading “Lesbians don’t like penises”.

    So why is it that despite the Miller and Forstater rulings, the police still seem determined to engage in a politically motivated crusade against those holding the ‘wrong’ (i.e., gender critical) views?

    Maybe they’ve forgotten Robert Peel’s nine principles of policing. Issued in 1829, they form the basis of modern policing by consent. Principle five, in particular, should from now on be required reading: “Officers should seek and preserve public favour, not by pandering to public opinion but by constantly demonstrating impartial service to law, in complete independence of policy.”

    The FSU’s packed schedule of events this autumn!

    Register here for our forthcoming Online Speakeasy with comedian, writer, actor and presenter Jack Dee on Wednesday 12th October and here for our Online Speakeasy with historian, author and television presenter Neil Oliver on Wednesday 9th November.

    You can see a calendar of all our events on our Events page. As that is a public page, you cannot book members-only events on the website, so do please look out for regular emails from FSU Events for full details, including links for tickets and registration. Members who have opted to hear about FSU Events should have received an email this week. If you have not received this, do check your inbox, including your junk folder, and get in touch if you can’t find it there, using events@freespeechunion.org.

    We have two excellent sessions at the Battle of Ideas Festival taking place in London on the weekend of the 15th and 16th October. Toby will be speaking on a packed panel debating Online Safety vs Free Speech on Saturday afternoon, and the Free Speech Champions will discuss Winning Young Hearts and Minds on Sunday afternoon, with panellists including Professor Alice Sullivan and Rod Liddle. Members can access special discount tickets by entering the promo code FSU-BattleFest2022 at the top of the ticket page. Do come and say hello to us at our stall where we’ll also be selling some merch.

    Sharing the newsletter

    As with all our work, this newsletter depends on the support of our members and donors, so if you’re not already a paying member please sign up today or encourage a friend to join, and help us turn the tide against cancel culture. You can share our newsletters on social media with the buttons below to help us spread the word. If someone has shared this newsletter with you and you’d like to join the FSU, you can find our website here.

    And a warm welcome to all those people who joined in the past couple of weeks because they were so horrified by PayPal’s attempt to cancel us. You will be getting your welcome packs in the post within the next fortnight.

    Best wishes,

  39. What we have here is a clinical case of “projecting.” Democrats and other leftist parties around the world accuse the Right of wanting to expand government powers when that is precisely the overriding objective of the modern-day American Left.

    It is prototypically fascistic. Elevate race and skin color into the public debate. Trample civil liberties. Squash those who disagree with the reigning government. Partner up Big Government with Big Business and micromanage the economy through dictates from the central planners. Put your political enemies in handcuffs and jail without a trial. Trample over the traditional guardrails that were installed to protect liberty — by changing voting rules, ending the 60-vote filibuster in the Senate and discrediting and trying to pack the Supreme Court. Declare everything, including COVID-19 and climate change, an existential threat to justify more power to the politicians.

    So what is a fascist really? The Left says it is anyone who opposes what they want to do to expand government.

    But the real definition of a fascist is a leader who wants to exploit governmental power to suppress the basic liberties of individuals. It is the partnership of government and private industry for political power and monetary gain. To find it in modern-day America, the folks at the White House may want to look in the mirror.

    https://www.takimag.com/article/who-are-the-neofascists/

    1. It’s the Left through and through. The more they control and dictate, the more power they gather for themselves to further expand. Lefties don’t have any concept of right and wrong. To them, every action justifies their behaviour because, fundamentally, they’re psychotic egotists.

  40. Shocked Uber passenger, 22, is charged £35,000 for a four-mile journey that took just 15 minutes after his driver confused town in Manchester for one in Australia

    Oliver Kaplan, 22, was told it would cost just £10 for the four-mile journey

    However, he was shocked to find he was charged over £35,000 after the trip
    The Uber driver mixed up Ashton-Under-Lyne with Ashton, a town in Australia

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11290343/Shocked-Uber-passenger-22-charged-35-000-four-mile-journey-took-just-15-minutes.html

  42. The vaccine victim seeking answers from Dame June Raine. TCW. 7 October 2022.

    I am a 43-year-old mother of two adult sons and sports therapist. Prior to having the vaccine, I was running three times a week and doing weight training alongside running my business. After my second AstraZeneca jab in February last year, I had a reaction causing acute numbness, tremors and more than 30 other symptoms. Adverse reaction to a Covid vaccine is confirmed in my medical notes. I’ve had seven diagnoses so far: peripheral neuropathy, postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome, cardiac arrhythmias, ME/CFS, fibromyalgia, postural hypertension and nystagmus. I have not worked in 15 months and am not able to exercise due to ongoing cardiac investigations.

    I never cease to give thanks that I gave this Quack Nostrum a miss. There will be no justice for the victims since they are as much the subjects of Political Chicanery as Medical Incompetence.

    https://www.conservativewoman.co.uk/the-vaccine-victim-seeking-answers-from-dame-june-raine/

    1. Dear 43 year old. Pure coincidence. Nothing whatever to do with the totally safe and life-saving vaccine.

      Stop peddling rumours. We know where you live.

      June Raine.

    3. I dodged a bullet taking that AZ stuff. Never again. It seems to have been quietly withdrawn.

      1. I was coerced into having 2 AZ shots, so that I could travel. Refused a booster as I could only have Pfizer, and didn’t fancy a cocktail, and have just turned down the offer of yet another shot! How do I feel? Lucky I think!

        1. Me too. I had the first two so they’d let me in to Kenya and we still had to postpone the trip twice. Not having any more.

  44. Dalrymple on hatred, amongst other observations

    We seem to have entered a golden age of hatred, even if all ages were also propitious to that great emotion. I am told that people of opposing political outlooks (and of course there are only two to choose from) cannot nowadays bear to be in the same room together. I say that I am told so, because I am not myself as small-minded as this, and have even recently gone to the cinema and had a very pleasant dinner afterward with an old communist, whose personal qualities and accomplishments I like and admire. A man is no more to be reduced to his opinions than is a country to be reduced to its military history, but we seem to have forgotten this and now take opinion as the sole measure of a man’s virtue and the sole reason for liking or disliking him.

    I do not foresee an era of civil war, but rather an era of constant and bitter bickering and unscrupulous disputatiousness of the kind that failed to notice that Miranda Hughes never said that she would not resuscitate Conservative voters. It is often said that the devil is in the detail; it might with equal justice be said that the devil is in the lack of detail.

    https://www.takimag.com/article/nursing-a-grudge/

  45. Congratulations Grizz on getting your letter published – it could only have come from you and says what everyone is thinking

        1. Thanks, Maggie. If only, I’m usually to be found on the cutting-room floor or in the WPB.

  46. Some years ago I bought some Tesco ‘bag for life’ bottle carriers. These would accommodate 6 wine bottles and were extremely useful. One has just reached the end of its useful life and is falling apart, so I took it back to my local Tesco and asked for a replacement. ‘We don’t do those any more, haven’t had them for years’, came the reply. So it’s not ‘bag for life’, more ‘bag until we hope you’ve forgotten’. I then ‘phoned Tesco customer relations and got the same response, this time with an apology of sorts. Which part of ‘bag for life’ has eluded them?

    Should I buy an equivalent from another supermarket and send Tesco the bill? Any ideas?

          1. It does- but is called something else and is extremely difficult to navigate…

            Having been involved in the drafting of the 1968 Act – I was appalled at the way supposedly helpful legislation is disguised.

        2. My very dear father was lumbered with having a bag for life after he had an urinary infection.

      2. Bags for Life are ideal when carting albums and large books. They limit the number you can actually carry to a manageable weight.
        I was assured that I can replace them FOC when they are knackered. If I do that, you will be reading sometime in 2023 about Lidl’s profits taking a nosedive.

    3. Send Tesco a letter threatening to sue. You might get some vouchers to stop you pestering them.

    4. Publish the story on Facebook or Twotter or similar.

      Apparently, the press offices of companies read the stuff and react….

          1. Any Complaints Department with an iota of self-preservation instinct would steer well clear of NOTTL…

    5. Have your wine delivered by a proper independent wine merchant like Corney & Barrow.. I fill the empty carton with the empty bottles in my recycling bin.( bottle bank)

      1. In fact we obtain wine (and beers) from various sources, not just supermarkets. My comment was specifically about Tesco welching on their earlier commitment.

          1. Not yet. I was hoping for some inspiration from NoTTLers. The message is on the bags as well.

    6. Try shopping at Lidl or Aldi. The money you save would allow you to purchase a Louis Vuitton bottle carrier.

        1. Were these really the words of that song? It was a favourite dance track when I was at art school and many sang along with the line “Brown Sugar, just like a young girl should”. I only remember that and not any reference to slaves, though we all knew that brown sugar referred to black girls.

          Gold Coast slave ship bound for cotton fields
          Sold in the market down in New Orleans
          Skydog slaver know he’s doin’ all right
          Hear him whip the women, just around midnight
          Brown Sugar, how come you taste so good?
          Brown Sugar, just like a young girl should, oh no

          Drums beatin’ cold, English blood runs hot
          Lady of the house wonderin’ when it’s gonna stop
          House boy knows that he’s doin’ all right
          You should have heard him, just around midnight
          Brown Sugar, how come you taste so good?
          Brown Sugar, just like a young girl should, yeah
          Brown Sugar, how come you dance so good?
          Oh, got me quittin’
          Brown Sugar, just like a black girl should, yeah

          Now, I bet your mama was a tent show queen
          And all her boyfriends were sweet 16
          I’m no school boy but I know what I like
          You should have heard them, just around midnight
          Brown Sugar, how come you taste so good? Oh, no no
          Brown Sugar, just like a young girl should
          I said, yeah, yeah, yeah, woo
          How come you, how come you dance so good?
          Yeah, yeah, yeah, woo
          Just like a, just like a black girl should
          Yeah, yeah, yeah, woo

          1. There were a lot of rapey, downright unpleasant song lyrics from the sexual revolution onwards until feminism kicked in in the late 90s, and now they’re all about drippy men moaning about how inadequate they are.

          2. Surely the lyrics are more ambiguous, contrasting and comparing desirable young women (Marsha Hunt and Claudia Lennear, both in their twenties at the time) with an addictive substance such as heroin.

  49. Ouch my arm hurts, he gave a flu jab while I was there. But agreed no covid for me.
    Not unusually…..
    Last night my good lady and myself went to the Alban Arena, to see the Tom Jones tribute band. What a lovely fantastic evening it was.
    The guy sang his heart out for well over two hours. He was excellent he even strongly resemble TJ. And the 7 piece band and beautiful young lady backing singing were also fantastic. I’ve never seen so many people enjoying music, many ladies up dancing in the Isles. I strongly Recommend that you go if it’s in your area. It’s known as The Ultimate Tom Jones.

      1. During the break a lady came down the steps h behind us waving a pair and the audience were laughing and cheering. She left them on the stage.
        ‘Tom’ later asked her to stand up holding the draws with both hands suggested that she hadn’t worn them for some time. They ended up on the top end of the bass guitar.
        He also said I’ve had a request for the next song from a chap in the audience, he’s from Australia, we all know Tom is big down under. 🤣

        1. At one TJ concert a middle aged lady threw her knickers at the stage but they hit the wall at the side – and stuck

        2. I was given a voice test for BFPO radio prog when I was based in Malta for a year in the late 1960’s.. They were testing a few Naval nurses and Wrens and blokes for the Forces network out there .

          I had to read a request from a lads parents , he was based with the RAF in Malta, and his parents song request on the card came from some where in England .

          All was going well with me re the introduction … but a big but … Green Green Grass of Home sung by Tom Jones was the request … and my voice faltered almost tearfully.. full of emotion .. and hesitantly.. .. and I felt very homesick all of a sudden .. I was probably 19 years old then .

          Thank you for attempting our test , did very well, but…

          Oh dear … a big fail !!!

          1. He sang that, I couldn’t believe how fantastic his voice is.
            Look up the link at the bottom of my first post TB

    2. We went to the Talk of the Town to see Tom Jones many years ago what a great night out, full orchestra and a very good meal .

  50. Oh I nearly forgot, how do I get rid of all these bloody intrusive advertisements we suddenly have on the website now.

    2. Adblock Ultimate. FREE. Instant relief. I installed 48 hours ago. It has blocked: 13,000 advert; 34,000 rackers.

  51. Meanwhile – looking at our council tax bill (other ways of bleeding away your cash are available) ….

    “For instance, in the NHS these days, you can’t say ‘disabled’. The correct expression is: ‘A person with protected characteristics under the 2010 Equality Act’. Yes, really. And even the word ‘illness’ is banned, since — and I quote from the NHS website — it ‘suggests the person could get better’. Eh? What’s that supposed to mean?”

    At least that’s accurate; ‘could’ rather than ‘will’ just about sums up our No Hope Service.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-11289329/RICHARD-LITTLEJOHN-need-degree-woke-mind-language-days.html

    1. What makes it all even worse Anne is, we pay these idiot’s to sit around tables for days to come up with all this garbage.

      1. I was reading the other day about that poor lad who died because the NHS didn’t manage to get a cardiologist to see him after he was rushed to hospital – his grandfather was a surgeon and the family is obviously well to do. There is a family who has contributed not just financially, but also in terms of their labour to healthcare in the UK – and yet when they needed it, no healthcare was available for them, and neither was there any alternative in the UK apart from taking their sick family member to an NHS hospital.
        The NHS is slowly killing healthcare in Britain altogether – saying that parts of it work is not good enough.
        We have accepted far too much of this nonsense.

        2. Part of the problem in A&E is, instead of going to the local GP practice for advice, people are now turning up at the hospitals. Someone told me he had to take his elderly mother in who had a bad fall. And it was packed out.
          And 5 ambulances were queued out side.

      2. I always think back to MB’s incredibly boring cousin. Started working for Colchester Borough Council in his teens, and spent the rest of his working life moaning and looking forward to retirement.
        Productive public employee?

  52. Indeed John.
    SIR – I have never understood the argument that, in order to incentivise the wealthy, tax reductions are necessary, but to have the same effect on the poor, benefits have to be cut.
    John Catchpole
    Beverley, East Yorkshire

    1. A moment’s thought would suffice to understand the difference between taking the fruits of his labour away from an individual and giving him the fruits of someone else’s labour. Mr Catchpole.

  53. Just went into my local branch of Nationwide to pay in £10 of 50p bits.
    2 tills out of 3 manned & dealing with customers and up to 6 people waiting.
    One member of staff in the customer area greeting customers and asking if they needed the counter.
    Why didn’t he man the 3rd till?

    1. It’s like the assistants hovering round the do-it-yer-bloody-self tills in supermarkets.
      Open another manned till and get things going.
      Having said that, I love going through a conventional till while the numpties still stand in the queue with their laden baskets stretching their arms down to the ground.

      1. Dear Asda, Tesco, Morrisons, Sainsbury’s, Waitrose, and all other stores that have self-checkout —

        You are almost exclusively self-checkout now. The last time I was there the lady checked receipts at the exit stopping everyone.
        I didn’t choose to participate in that nonsense, so I just skipped the exit line and left.

        I heard her saying “Madam Um ” as I kept walking and raised the receipt above my head, leaving the store.

        You can either trust me to do self-checkout, or you can put your cashiers back in place like they used to be. I’m not interested in proving that I did your job for you. If you want me to be a cashier with no training then that’s your problem, not mine.

        Don’t Audit me for a position you refuse to employ any longer.

        Signed,
        All of us
        Copied and pasted, because I agree 100%

        2. No one has ever asked me to “self check out”. If they even thought about it they wouldn’t like either the withering look or the response they would inevitably get.

          If they want me to check out myself, then they can pay me the going rate … plus expenses.

      2. At my local M&S food hall recently, all three of the remaining cash self checkouts were kaput so one of the stockroom guys was pressed into service on a conventional till. When a long queue suddenly formed, he complained that he’d only agreed to help out one customer and, “This isn’t my job”! A few days later I went in and there he was, sitting at the same till. He’s efficient and his manager is clearly sensible?

      1. 30y ago there was a needlework shop in Cromford called Polly’s Patch that was owned by a former Tiller Girl.
        A VERY nice looking “Lady Of A Certain Age” too!

    6. He wanted to divert some to the self-service machines.
      I went into Barclays the other day in Gloucester (no bank near here now ) and there are hardly any staff there, just one person helping direct customers. I managed to use the machine without help at the second attempt.

      1. We don’t have self service machines in Matlock.
        One of the reasons I refuse to use the main Derby branch.

          1. I know.
            Ashbourne, Bakewell & Belper are without as their Derbyshire BS branches were closed before the Nationwide takeover. As did Duffield.

          2. We would have been seeing our niece and family who live in Belper this weekend, if the rails strikes hadn’t scuppered our trip to Sheffield. The family gathering will go ahead without us.

  54. That Alan G Barstow seems to know his onions, but stops too early.
    If confidence in the police is lost, then the citizenry will set up vigilantes and administer “justice” themselves, and taht will not be calm, level headed, or even necessarily applied to the guilty party. Instead, witch-hunts will spring up, innocent people maimed or lynched. And all because the police cannot be bothered.
    Already, it took a week (!) for police to attend a stabbing in a mountain town north of Firstborn – the fire brigade had to deal with it at the time. The police have a beat that stretches from Geilo in the North to Ålesund in the south, some 4 hours drive, and often there is one patrol car (the area of all the Yorkshires…).
    When seconds count, the police are only a week away. Locally administered justice is the likely outcome, I’m afraid.

    1. That was the first time in history, Paul, that the letter-writer had his letter published without any censorship. I’ve discovered that if you do “go on”, then it will either be edited heavily or discarded.

      As for vigilante action, that would only take place, in this soft day and age, if lives, homes and livelihoods — en masse — were placed under direct threat. Modern humans are not as warrior-like as their ancestors. They’ve had it too good for too long and have become complacent as well as stupid. The powers-that-be know this and react accordingly.

    2. Just like Shropshire, then (police HQ in Worcestershire and the county is 50 miles long by 25 miles wide and mainly rural).

  55. I must change the batteries in the CO monitor. That beeping is giving me a terrible headache

    1. Are you sure that is Helen4Yemen or another of the Corbynista Palestinian nutjobs?

      Seems to me like pacifistics that aren’t happy until the enemy knocks on the door

      1. Seems to me that the pro Ukrainian warmongers won’t be happy until Armageddon blows their doors in.

        While addressing the Australian audience via video link, Zelensky said, “We need pre-emptive strikes, so that they’ll know what will happen to them if they use nukes, and not the other way around, Don’t wait for Russia’s nuclear strikes.”

      2. I’m not a pacifist but, as I asked you yesterday, what is the objective of this war?
        I have written to my MP and ask the same question of him.
        Johnson visited Kiev 3 times and there was no sign of any fighting having taken place. It’s turning out like the scamdemic, keep feeding sh1t and no real information to the public.

        1. The objective of this war is to put Putin back in his box, secure freedom for Ukraine, whilst at the same time maintaining the demilitarised buffer of Ukraine between the Russians and the main borders of western Europe, to show the “axis powers” of China, Russia, North Korea, Iran and Syria that they cannot get away with it, and prevent geo-destabilisation sucking in the likes of the middle east like Saudi and India into their control bloc.

          And of course the increased threat that would bring id successful of a direct threat to western Europe

          1. Demilitarised buffer, you say?
            Is that why Ukraine is pushing to be part of NATO and why all those numerous former USSR satellites are militarised members of NATO now, rather than the buffer states they were?

            If the cretins that run The USA and the EU and NATO had put out olive branches to Russia (not the USSR, a completely different entity) then we/they might have had a useful ally against the two real threats to world peace, China and militant Islam.

          2. Spot on. History will show that the West’s refusal to engage positively with post-Communist Russia was an enormous error.

          3. I fear so, and I also fear it might even come to a head in what little time I have left to me.

          4. Like history showed that the “refusal” to deal positively with Hitler was a “mistake”

          5. Actually, it could just as easily be argued that trying to deal positively with Hitler was the mistake.

            Ultimately it could be argued that Hitler was a direct result of the Allies forcing the Germans to accept the treaty of Versailles, i.e. caused by the victors taking too much from the vanquished, there are parallels with USA ,EU and NATO actions in Europe post the break up of the Soviet Union leading to the rise of Putin.

          7. Well, if someone breaks into your house and trashes it I hope you’d be happy with a judge saying the aggressor doesn’t need to pay for the damage.

          10. No, in the unlikely event that that is true I strongly suspect that it refers to reported burglaries, people no longer bother reporting them because they know the police don’t give a damn.

            I also suspect you invented that figure or took it out of context.

          11. Don’t believe everything the MSM tell you to get the Tories out of office

            https://www.statista.com/statistics/956906/burglaries-in-england-and-wales/

            See for yourself

          12. Number of police recorded burglary offences in England and Wales from 2002/03 to 2021/22

            The key words there are “police recorded”, people don’t report because they know it’s pointless.

            a the police do nothing, they certainly don’t get the property back nor do they catch the vast majority of burglars
            b unless the property stolen was sufficiently valuable to merit an insurance claim there is no need to get from them the only thing useful, the crime number.
            c these data are used by the police to analyse crime patterns as well as design and evaluate policing strategies. Nevertheless, there is inherent inaccuracy in police-recorded crime data, which is not only dependent on police recording practices but also on victims’ reporting rates.

          13. So are you saying people who are burgled don’t report it, and therefore don’t have a crime number and therefore can’t claim on their insurance?

            Or is just that the stats seem to prove you wrong?

            Or do you have any better statistics to prove your case?

          16. Erm, peace in his very limited time remaining in office.

            Post war, those involved on the German side said that he had no interest in honouring it, no more than he did with the Russian pact

          18. 1) you cannot join NATO if you have any border disputes.

            2) We have had plenty of “olive branches” which were trampled under by Putin, not least of course you are forgetting Crimea in 2014, which we olive branched over, and then he went for an all out invasion.

            didn’t work did it?

          19. That’s clearly horseshit, because there are plenty of NATO members with border disputes, many of them with other members of NATO, those disputes are ignored because it suits the Americans in their determination to put Russia down in any way they can.

            Even Crimea was exacerbated by the Americans. The USSR and Russia have had naval bases there and in the Black Sea for decades, who do you think the British, French and Ottoman Empire were at war with in the Crimea in the nineteenth century? Hint, it wasn’t Ukraine. Attempting to take away Russia’s access/egress in the Crimea and the Black sea by Ukraine was a provocation. Even the hand over of Crimea by Russia was under dispute long before Putin.

            If Russia really was the evil empire you appear to think it is they would never have set up pipelines into the EU and the rest of Europe.
            Ever since the fall of the iron curtain America, post Reagan, has been steadily encroaching across Eastern Europe where States were granted/took independence.

          20. Its not horseshit at all, its to prevent NATO being drawn immediately into a war because of an open border dispute.

            If Ukraine joins NATO we then would have a NATO nation invaded by Russia and therefore on the basis of NATO “And invasion of one is an invasion of all” would mean going to war with Russia under NATO terms,

            Hence why you cannot join with an open border dispute.

            Which NATO members have a open border dispute? AND – was it open at the time they joined?

          21. Greece, Turkey, the “new” Eastern European States, and some are still quarrelling with each other and yes they were doing so when they joined.

          22. 1) Greece and Turkey joined in 1952

            2) The International Court of Justice in its ruling on 11 September 1976, determined the Aegean continental shelf beyond the territorial waters of the two littoral states as “areas in dispute” with respect to which both Turkey and Greece claim rights of exploration and exploitation.

            So the dispute arose after BOTH had already joined NATO

          23. You clearly don’t know your Greek Turkish history. They have been in dispute over Islands since the Ottoman Empire and before.

          24. It depends on if its disputed at the time they joined, but as both joined at the same time the border dispute becomes entirely internal to NATO.

            We can solve the Ukraine issue if we admit Russia at the same time.

            Is that what you want to do?

          25. Talk about trying to split hairs. Greece and Turkey were in dispute and they were both admitted, they are still in dispute. NATO and the EU break their own rules whenever it suits them.

            NATO could have done a lot worse than have admitted Russia when the USSR collapsed.
            But then it’s raison d’etre would have vanished, and the American military Industrial complex would have not agreed.

          26. The point being under NATO that you cannot join with a dispute EXTERNAL to NATO.

            So yes, Ukraine can join but only id Russia does AND all existing NATO member states agree to it.

            If not, they can’t join under the articles of NATO

          27. As I noted, if they want to ignore their rules they will.
            Do you think NATO will support Turkey or Greece if they start fighting again, eg over Cyprus? or Turkey if they kick off with the Kurds, or Iran, Iraq or Syria?

          28. This is turning into nothing applies there are no rules and nothing that’s evidence is evidence.

            In which case there’s no point arguing because you won’t accept any facts.

            Yes the rules can change but ONLY if all members agree the changes, as it stands it requires all members to agree the admittance and that would also require ALL members to agree to a change the rules to admit a new member with a border dispute IN AN EXISTING WAR which would mean immediately being drawn into that war

            Because an attack on one is an attack on all, so letting Ukraine in would be starting WW3 which none of them are going to do voluntarily.

          29. He (Putin) only went for invasion because 14,000 Rusian speakers in the Eastern part of Ukraine were slaiughtered by Zelensky’s Azov (Neo Nazi) Brigade. Hence his wish to annexe 4 regions of Ukraine, keeping them part of Russia.

          30. I see, and will he be invading China to save the Uyghurs?

            I’m quite sure if the Russians had asked nicely and those people really wanted to be Russian, they could have happily moved to Russia.

            How do you explain the annexation of Crimea and the attempt to take Kiev and the regions outside the Dombass, the soldiers just got lost, or trying to help strays from the Dombass that went on holiday?

          31. We missed, or rather threw away a marvelous opportunity for rapprochement with the Kursk tragedy and the subsequent salvage efforts by Norwegian and British divers.

          32. Ukraine as a modern country was created in 1922 from parts of Russia. Following the collapse of the Soviet Union in 1991 it became independent in 1994. It would appear there has been continued fighting on and off since then. The Donbass region is mainly Russian speaking and there has been continuing conflict since the signing of Minsk 1 and Minsk 2 agreements in 2014 and 2015. In that region there have been estimates of 20-25,000 casualties there, both Russian speaking and Ukrainians.
            Minsk Protocol
            The Minsk Protocol is an agreement which sought to end war in the Donbas region of Ukraine. It was written in 2014 by the Trilateral Contact Group on Ukraine, consisting of Ukraine, the Russian Federation, and the Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe, with mediation by the leaders of France and Germany in the so-called Normandy Format. After extensive talks in Minsk, Belarus, the agreement was signed by representatives of the Trilateral Contact Group and, without recognition of any status, by the then heads of the Donetsk People’s Republic and Luhansk People’s Republic. The agreement, which followed multiple previous attempts to stop the fighting in the Donbas, aimed to implement an immediate ceasefire. It failed to stop fighting in Donbas, and was thus followed with a new package of measures, called Minsk II, which was signed on 12 February 2015.Wikipedia
            Context:
            War in Donbass
            Signed:
            September 05, 2014
            Location:
            Minsk, Belarus
            Mediators:
            François Hollande, Angela Merkel
            Original, signatories:
            Heidi Tagliavini, Leonid Kuchma, Mikhail Zurabov, Aleksandr Zakharchenko, Igor Plotnitskiy
            Language: Russian

            Russia has the following borders with Western Europe, Finland, Estonia, Lithuania, Norway, Poland and Latvia but, for some reason, they do not appear to be a problem nor need a ‘buffer’ against Russia, I wonder why. This is an interesting link showing the tooing and froing across the various borders in almost equal numbers. https://www.statista.com/statistics/1337155/russian-border-crossings-to-and-from-the-eu/
            My view is that the Russians went in to Ukraine to protect the Russian speaking population. I have great difficulty in believing our government, the EU or the US who I think are pulling the strings from afar.

            The truth will never be known because history will be written by the victors if any survive that is.
            An anecdote – an acquaintance’s daughter took in a ‘Ukrainian’refugee’ who wants to go on holiday, back to Ukraine. It must be really dangerous there.
            Finally, why is that when the ‘west’ wants to bring freedom to countries why do thousands of the people end up dead? Could it be the west’s idea of freedom and democracy is alien to those people.

            Edit – forgot the link, now added.

          33. National borders change, however, what constitutes a country’s borders is that which is recognised by the UN.

            So if border changes occur, and its recognised, that’s the new borders, like the split up of Yugoslavia.

            The borders of Ukraine are recognised by the UN, therefore an incursion within them is a breach of their internationally recognised sovereignty.

            Of course, you can always avoid war by endlessly giving in to bullies, are you suggesting we should have all given in before WW1 or WW2?

            There comes a time you have have to stand up to dictators, if you don’t, they take it as a sign of continued weakness and an open invite to go further, just as Hitler did.

          34. I do not believe we should give in to bullies and no I don’t think we should have given in in WW2.
            If all those other borders are next to Russia why are we not concerned about those?
            It seems that Russia was interested only in the Donbass and two othe ‘Republics’ and that would not have bought him next to Western Europe than he already is along a very long border. Why are the west only interested in the border with Ukraine and not the others? Why will nobody tell us?

            The only truth I know is that truth is the first casualty of war. Our going in to ‘help’ others has not been flattering.
            Do you believe ‘the west’ was right to go into Iraq, Libya, Afghanistan, Syria – I may have missed some. How do you think we did.

          35. Why are we not bothered about existing Russian borders

            1) The border length is very small, most of them were not in NATO until recently

            2) The more border length you have, the more you have to defend and staff.

            3) They are concerned about those borders, but historically that’s where we have been, there’s no alternative to having those borders with Russia

          36. The border length of NATO and non NATO independent countries is approximately 2,432 km. the length of the border of Ukraine is 2093 km. Historically we have had far shorter borders with Russia as ex USSR Satellite states account for approximately 1,065 km. Finland is not part of NATO but has applied to join, its border with Russia is 1,272 km.
            It has been said there was an agreement, on the break up of USSR, that NATO wouldn’t let former USSR states join NATO. If that’s the case the west have broken an international agreement. Believe what or who you will https://www.rferl.org/a/nato-expansion-russia-mislead/31263602.html

          37. From your link

            “The U.S.S.R. was never offered a formal guarantee on the limits of NATO expansion post-1990,” John Lough, the research associate who authored the section, wrote. “Moscow merely distorts history to help preserve an anti-Western consensus at home.”

            Nikolai Sokov, a former Russian diplomat who served in the Foreign Ministry in Moscow between 1987 and 1992, disagrees. “The Chatham House piece is very bad — it sounds to be as a piece produced by the Ideology Department of the Central Committee” of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union, he told RFE/RL.

            “We didn’t have to come to this, though, and the issue could have remained a small script in history that does not need to be resolved,” he said. “It is more about the manner of NATO enlargement and the arguments used to promote enlargement.”

            So the author of the section in the agreement says there was no agreement about NATO expansion.

            If you believe the Russians and the likes of Lavrov, Russia told us they were not going to invade, and there were no atrocities.

            If you believe Lavrov, I have a bridge to sell you.

          38. It’s obvious we are never going to agree but am willing to continue the discussion as we both seem to be heading he said she said route.
            I maintain that whether the war be hot or cold the first casualty is always the truth.
            Truth is an abstract construct.
            If four people were eye witnesses to a road traffic accident and all gave a statement to the police you would probably find you have four different stories of what happened. Interestingly they will all have told the truth as they saw it.

          39. So you think there was credible truth in Putin’s statements that he was not going to invade Ukraine?

            And presumably you still think he told a “version” of the truth as you see it?

          40. As i have said I think he was more interested in protecting the Russian speakers. No sign of fighting in Kiev when Johnson went there. Would have the capital city would have been one of the first targets if he was going to invade the whole of Ukraine.
            I don’t think we’ll ever discover the truth.
            As always history will be written by the victors if there is/are any. Eventually they will discuss but a will is needed on both sides.
            Not there yet.

          41. Explain why he invaded from the north via Belarus?

            If he only wanted to reunite the Donbass, why has he gone far beyond its borders?

            I still have a bridge for sale

          43. Because they are protecting a sovereign nation and their own interests on the geostrategic stage.

            Your turn, answer the questions

            Explain why he invaded from the north via Belarus?

            If he only wanted to reunite the Donbass, why has he gone far beyond the Dombass borders?

          45. Is it not obvious? because the intent from the start was to take the whole of Ukraine, as per Putin’s OWN statement that he wants to restore the ENTIRE USSR.

          46. I missed the statement do you have a link please.
            What and where is the box ‘we’ want to put him in and, with the current strategy, when will we know he’s arrived?

          48. Where has he gone beyond the borders unless you mean the two small ‘republics’ to link Donbass with Crimea.

          49. Like right up to the border with Moldova, well outside the Dombass on all sides and then the invasion attempt from Belarus at the start which is nowhere near the Dombass.

            Are you just a Putin apologise or don’t you actually follow news reports

            You must be at a loss without RT.

          50. I don’t follow any MSM including RT. I pick things up from links on here and my own internet searches.
            I don’t trust Putin, Zelenski, Truss, the EU or USA. After the debacle of the scamdemic I’m surprised anyone believes them or the MSM.
            Do you believe USA blew up the Nordstream pipelines?

          51. Or stats produced by any of them, so just news sources that pander to your belief system and ignore anything that doesn’t fit your mental model.
            I believe its POSSIBLE they did blow up Nordstream pipes, but unlike you I’ll wait for some concrete proof.

            Or have you already decided irrespective of evidence?

          52. It sounds as though you’re exactly the same as me in that you believe what you want to believe and read what confirms your view.
            I don’t think we’re going to get any further with this discussion.

          53. I have been reading your posts about Russia and have come to the conclusion that you’ve a very one-sided view of Russia.
            Most of what you blame Russia for, could equally apply to the USA.
            In fact since 1945, America has been a far more dangerous entity when it comes to aggressive behaviour throughout the world than Russia.

          54. The degree of intervention and the purpose for it is different, the Russians have had plenty of wars themselves, like Afghanistan, Syria and a couple of others.

            I take it you were in the Corbyn camp, we need to ask him if the Novicok poisoning was down to him?

            So your position is we should leave Ukraine to be eaten up by Russia, and then if he moves on with his stated aim of a USSR reformation by invading Poland and Hungary and the Czech Republic, that’s OK with you too?

          55. ‘In the Corbyn camp’ what has he got to do with what I said?
            Your other assumptions about my views on how I see the aggressive behaviour of both sides, rather justifies my previous observation about your posts.

          56. So you don’t think Putin tells lies endlessly then? Like when he said with 125,000 troops on Ukraine’s border he was not going to invade and it was just joint exercises?

            Or that Putin was not behind the killing of Litvenyenko or the Skripal’s?

            Bridge for sale if you are interested

  58. I wonder what Erdogan really makes of the Ukraine debacle. I’ll bet he knows his history alot better than Trussy and a large chunk of what was corralled into the Ukraine by Lenin was ruled by the Ottoman Turks for three hundred years. When the British pitched in on the Crimean War, it wasn’t anyone calling themselves a Ukrainian that we were defending? Yet here is NATO insisting that the remnants of the Polish Lithuanian Union are the rightful owners of Russian and Turkish land. Putin and Erdogan now effectively allies. Catherine II would doubtless understand how that has come about, while Biden doesn’t know what day it is and Truss doesn’t know where the borders are that she’s supposedly defending. For wealth and power, these people will claim anything, absolutely anything.

    1. Well, Our Susan. Fear not. Untrussworthy and Toy Boy Micron will solve all the problems. Just like that.

      You need no longer worry your fluffy little head….. The grownups have it all in hand…. {:¬))

    2. Is that another clue that the Americans want to create Ukraine II in Poland?
      Poland to be their new front line against Russia – blowing up Germany’s gas pipeline was a big clue that they are ready to sacrifice the Germans, who have occupied that role since 1945.

    3. I see the Ukrainian human rights organisation, the Center for Civil Liberties (CCL), is one of three recipients of this year’s Nobel Peace Prize! As I understand it Zelensky has banned all other political parties and presides over a country that has been shelling its own citizens since 2014 – doesn’t sound much like a haven of civil liberties!

  59. OT – for any NoTTLer who finds himself at Schiphol, there is a tiny bit of good news. Although only a quarter of the security booths are open – those that ARE work very well. No more liquids in separate bags. No more removal of shoes/belts. No more keeping electronics apart. Just take off your jacket and place in tray with hand luggage. The scanners are very fast – unlike the ones we are used to. The MR was impressed. The whole palaver took about one minute

    1. Being shouted at by Johnny Foreigner at Stanstead to take off my shoes, belt, trousers, to bin the water bottle I needed to take tablets with was insulting. I felt like saying ‘matey, we’re in this mess because you lot keep trying to kill us.’

      1. The water ban is a real con. You ditch your own water – go through – then find you have to BUY effing water to take with you…..

        1. It’s just offensive full stop. We wouldn’t be in this situation if Muslims hadn’t slaughtered thousands of innocent people.

          1. I suppose we could show solidarity with Stormie and send her our bottles of water!!

          4. Wasn’t there a joke about that? Bleedin’ Watneys….
            Great letter in the DT, Mr. Grizz!

          5. Thank you, Mrs Macfarlane. The joke:

            Q. Why is drinking Watney’s Red Barrel like making love in a punt?
            A. Because they are both fucking close to water!

          6. Thank you! I should have read a bit further! Have spent a lot of time with a steam cleaner today! I thought I was quite clean but the kitchen says otherwise! My Dad had a spoon rest which said ‘My kitchen is clean enough to be healthy and and dirty enough to be happy’ The floor, which I mop most days (2 cats and 1 plus extraneous dogs!) was mucky to say the least! The 4 grandchildren sit, run, bike, play and everything else on it! 🤷🏻‍♀️

        3. When I worked at Norwich airport, I took that very subject up with a visiting inspector from the DfT. I asked him what the logic (if any) was behind the decision. He told me that it was to stop passengers with bad intent taking obnoxious or dangerous chemicals, disguised as drinking water, through to airside where they could cause any amount of mischief. Since the DfT thought that it was impractical to test every container of water (or even ask the carrier to drink some), a blanket ban was brought in. The water purchased in the cafés and duty-free shops, airside, are from a stock that goes through rigorous checking process prior to be permitted there.

          I discovered that whenever I took the DfT (and their inspectors) to task on any similar matter, it was like talking to a brick wall. As far as they were concerned, a decision had been made, at government level, and who the hell was I to question that?

          1. It helps with sales revenue. The only sensible check-in I’ve experienced in the post 9/11 era was at Krakow airport. Have you got such and such? No. OK. No sign of enrichment there of course.

        4. Empty the bottle and take it through empty. Plenty of places to refill it airside.

          1. Not necessarily. At Stansted the drinking fountain is carefully hidden way – to encourage you to buy water.

      2. Stansted Airport is the pits. I will never fly from there again unless there is no other option.

      1. Because only a quarter of the booths were open. Had they ALL been open, the wait would have been very short.

        1. You’d think they would have enough of the new booths to accommodate the passengers though.

          1. Cannot get the staff – apparently. The cynic in me (Gosh!!) thinks that it is a deliberate ploy by the Dutch government to discourage air travel.

  61. I’ve just spent half-an-hour watching the commital service for 97 year old Ex-Flight Sergeant Colin Hynd (Chiefy as he was known to his ‘boys’) I am honoured to be one of those boys, who was shouted at, encouraged by and matured, as a result of being a boy entrant under training, as an Air Radar Mechanic, at RAF Cosford from 1960 to 1961. A fine man, much loved and respected by his ‘boys’. RIP Chiefy.

    1. Remarkable men such as F/Sgt Hynd STILL exist in the Armed Forces. Check out GSM Vern Stokes (Coldstream Guards)….

    2. It’s odd, I always find myself looking to ask ‘ what would you do’ of those who mentored me – sadly they’re not there to ask.

      1. Same here, and I also look to share a joke taht would have really matched their sense of humour, then realise… oh! Bugger.

        1. I did that for a good 10 years after my mother died.
          I’d be wandering round a garden centre and think “That would make a lovely birthday pres ….”

          2. I’ve turned into my mother, the older I get……. I see her in the mirror and hear her voice when I speak. I have her cynicism as well and her sense of humour. So I suppose she is still with me.

          4. Is that what they mean by “Eternal Life”?
            Mother always wanted to write a book about a child whose parents died when she was young, and she grew to a ripe old age, died, and met up with her parents again in Heaven – only she was much older than they were! It would apply to her – her parents died aged late 70s, and she’s managed 93.
            She’ll not be writing it now. Too daft, sadly.

          5. I think the ‘eternal life’ is the memories they leave, the genetic residue that’s passed down as well. Dementia is a horrible way to end your life, though I suppose she doesn’t really know much about it. Maybe it’s better than a painful illness.

          6. Got a bit teary Wednesday after I spoke to her.
            She said that she was waiting for, and looking forward, to my Father’s return from Aberdeen. Problem is, he died in 1997, but how lovely to be happy in anticipation of a loved one’s return… without knowing that he’ll never return.
            Sigh…

          7. At least it sounds as though she can still talk rationally, even though she is in a world of her own. Clearly she still misses your father and remembers him, not the fact that he died.

  62. Green initiative sees LA gas prices surge to all-time high of $6.49-a-gallon – as cost across California leaps a gigantic $1.15 in just one month. 7 October 2022.

    There is more woe for Californian motorists as gas prices have surged to record highs – and the pain is expected to get worse before it gets better.

    The price of a gallon of gas in Los Angeles has soared to $6.49, with a gigantic increase of $1.15 across the state over last month, blamed on the ongoing war in Ukraine, high taxes, green policies and refinery shutdowns.

    Across the state, the average price sits at $6.42 on Thursday, with gas most expensive in Mono County on the border with Nevada, where drivers have to fork out $7.29 a gallon – nearly double the national average of $3.87.

    That will help concentrate the minds of the voters in the forthcoming mid-terms!

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11291061/LA-gas-prices-surge-time-high-6-49-gallon-statewide-1-15-month.html

        2. If I’d calculated it properly, I’d have got to £7 per UK gallon or about £1.54 per litre.

          I’m surprised no one challenged it! There’s usually one…

    3. Daft of the yanks to call petrol ‘gas’. In the USA ‘gas’ could mean petrol, natural gas or flatulence.

      1. If only I could run my car on the latter
        I wonder how many MPG I’d get……(Miles Per Guinness)

      2. If only I could run my car on the latter
        I wonder how many MPG I’d get……(Miles Per Guinness)

  63. “Heatwaves led to record number of excess deaths Two thirds were women and over-65s” The Grimes this arvo:

    Phew – glad it was nothing to do with the ultra safe vaccine.

    1. At the leavers’ address the headmaster told us that only the Pope and the Archbishop of Canterbury could get VD from lavatory seats and that we should never go into a brothel wearing an Old Blundellian tie.

      1. That’s probably because he thought the girls would spot your tie, know that you were wealthy and hike up their fees accordingly! Sounds to me like the Head did you a favour when applying for head…..

    2. Of course you remember when we had a much longer heatwave in ’76 and people were dropping dead all over the place. Bodies everywhere.

      A work colleague was complaining yesterday that her arm was still sore after jab#4. I recalled having a swollen arm after the smallpox vax, many years ago. She said, “Was that a booster”. How to explain, politely…

      1. Far more deaths occur in cold winters than in a couple of days’ hot weather.

        Have they ever done boosters for any other jab? I know most of mine were due to expire after 10 years, but I think I won’t be going back for them now.

      2. Ah the summer of 76. Stand pipes in the street, hose pipe bans…. we had been married just two years. I awoke one morning opened the bedroom curtains and said ah this is the life…..let’s go to Australia. We were there just before Christmas.
        I had my flu jab this morning. It was agreed I should not have any others.

  64. Oh well…
    Wordle 475 6/6

    🟨🟨⬜⬜⬜
    ⬜⬜🟨🟨🟨
    ⬜🟩🟩🟩⬜
    ⬜🟩🟩🟩🟩
    ⬜🟩🟩🟩🟩
    🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

    1. I’m calling this a par five

      Wordle 475 5/6

      ⬜⬜⬜⬜⬜
      ⬜⬜🟨⬜🟨
      ⬜🟩🟩⬜🟩
      ⬜🟩🟩⬜🟩
      🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

    2. Mine’s a Sad Six Double Bogey!

      Wordle 475 6/6
      ⬜🟩⬜⬜⬜
      ⬜🟩⬜⬜🟩
      ⬜🟩⬜🟩🟩
      ⬜🟩⬜🟩🟩
      ⬜🟩🟨🟩🟩
      🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

  65. BBC Radio 4 News reporting that Border force at Dover have very little space for the illegals as they cannot find places to distribute them to. Their conditions are unacceptable with very little facilities for them. The Border force shouldn’t be collecting them off the Channel and the RNLI shouldn’t be in French waters picking up passengers and bringing them to the UK. The RNLI should return them to France. Truss seems happy with her discussions with Macron yesterday about illegals coming to the UK. Truss needs to stop this illegal traffic which is assisted by her Home Office.

    1. They could accommodate some of them on a disused container ship or similar – not luxurious hotels. They might not be so keen to come if that was their destination.

      1. I think there are some pretty rancid cruise ships hanging around with not a lot to do.

    3. Just sent that to mum-of-twins daughter! Don’t know what she’s moaning about!

    6. Have you got a video of the 3 nuns and the 3 cannibals who have to cross a river in a canoe which holds a maximum of three including the paddler?

    7. Have you got a video of the 3 nuns and the 3 cannibals who have to cross a river in a canoe which holds a maximum of three including the paddler?

    1. In a rapidly-increasing world of stupidity, the citizens of China, South Korea and Japan are reputed to possess the highest average IQ.

      1. I read somewhere about an individual buying shopping and having to tap a government card before doing so.

        It truly is egregious where the world is these days.

  69. This may have been posted on here before – but it is worth repeating!

    Mafia Godfather finds out that his bookkeeper, Enzo, has cheated him out of 10 million bucks. His bookkeeper is deaf. That was the reason he got the job in the first place. It was assumed that Enzo would hear nothing that he might have to testify about in court.
    When the Godfather goes to confront Enzo about his missing $10 million, he takes along his lawyer who knows sign language.
    The Godfather tells the lawyer, “Ask him where the 10 million bucks is that he embezzled from me.”
    The lawyer, using sign language, asks Enzo where the money is.
    Enzo signs back, “I don’t know what you are talking about.”
    The lawyer tells the Godfather, “He says he doesn’t know what you are talking about.”
    The Godfather pulls out a pistol, puts it to Enzo’s temple and says, “Ask him again!”
    The lawyer signs to Enzo, “He’ll kill you if you don’t tell him.”
    Enzo signs back, “OK. You win! The money is in a brown briefcase, buried behind the shed in my cousin Bruno’s backyard in Woodbridge !”
    The Godfather asks the lawyer, “What did he say?”
    The lawyer replies, ” He says you don’t have the balls to pull the f*ckin trigger.”

    Don’t you just LOVE lawyers?! 😀

  70. Afternoon, all. Don’t faint. I’m here early because I have to try to sort out my broadband communication. I had a letter today to say MOH hadn’t replied to the email they sent! Doh! Surely it should have been a bit obvious that the name of the current account holder is different from the one in the email address? Especially when the reason for the change was the death of the original holder. Alas, I need to log in to their site and to do so I need the password, so I’m going to have to trawl through the computers to see it it’s been saved anywhere. Life is never simple. I’m still struggling to get Lifeline (the alarm people) to accept that I gave the equipment back last August. They keep trying to bill me for something I no longer have, despite the fact I have let them know the situation.

    1. Note to self: Get a receipt when returning stuff, or written acknowledgement that they don’t want it back.
      Same issue here with Mother’s internet router. They billed me for it, and kept on billing me for it. Sent them copies of previous bill and bank receipt showing it was paid. They stopped, eventually.

      1. I’ve had an acknowledgement from the people who supplied the equipment that they’ve had it back. It’s the people who man the alarm that haven’t got the message yet.

    1. Now, if only they would fill that boat with the denizens of Westminster who are shipping these people in, and drop said denizens in the middle of the Channel, I’d think it was a fair swap.

      No need to let the French coastguard know they are coming.

        1. Yes, I did see the bloke on the floor. I thought that he’d been fixing a faulty earthing pole.

      1. Rachel gave me a very good price. She also supplied leads, harnesses, sleeping basket and puppydog food. Had him immunised and chipped which saved me a lot of dosh.

        1. I think you’re a star, pet!⭐️ Great for Dolly (she mightn’t realise that immediately!) great for Harry and hours of entertainment for you! What# not to love? 🌹

          1. Dolly only barks when the postman comes, the delivery man comes, the Ocado van comes and whenever she is in the garden and can see up the alleyway when someone walks by. Normally very brief as i respect my neighbours. Her nickname now is Bing Bong Woof Woof.

            Harry just wags his tail all the time. I’m surprised it hasn’t fallen off !

    2. If Harry starts rootling through your garbage in the middle of the night, he’s definitely a racoon. In all likelihood, so are you. {:^}}

      2. Dolly ignored him for the first 24 hours. Occasionally snapping at him if he got too close. Now they chase each other and wrestle most of the time. Pitter patter pitter patter for most of the day but at least they settle down when i turn out the lights.

    4. For a sense of scale – Mongo’s paw is bigger than Harry’s head, as his paw is bigger than the palm of my hand.

      More folk should get Newfoundlands. They’re bonkers.

      1. Couldn’t call him that. Gizmo the cat was a previous…

        He is named after Harry Rawlings the gangster in a TV show. As is his wife Dolly.

    6. I think that gripping the puppy firmly by the neck is rather unnecessary. As a precaution, I have notified the RSPCA…

      1. Thanks. It was the only way to keep the little bugger still for a second. Note the blurriness? It’s cos i hadn’t had a drink !

  76. Chap walks into bookshop and asks for a book.

    Chap: “I’ve heard there’s a new book out about men with small penises, but I can’t remember what it’s called.”
    Seller: “It’s not in yet.”
    Chap: “That’s the one. How much will it be?”

    1. Chap walks into a bookshop and asks for books on anal sex.

      The seller says ‘Round the back, love’.

    1. The junior doctors (which is quite insulting) are seriously overworked and not being supported by the consultants except by phone. When they can get hold of the buggers.

      I have been under the Haematologist consultant for two years now and i have never met him. Not once in dozens of appointments.

      1. That’s probably a good sign that you don’t require his/her urgent attention……Although you might do if the Rabid ones catch up with you for posting a certain cartoon….

        1. One would normally see the consultant on first diagnosis for treatment. I think my conditions were reasonably serious. Obviously not in the Cancer stakes. But i had two conditions at the same time which were being treated by two consultants. Those two conditions were both blood related. I don’t even know if they conferred. I haven’t seen a GP in goodness knows how long relating to these conditions and i also know from the last telephone call from the haematology department that my last two admissions for unrelated conditions were not added to my medical record.

          1. Hhmm! Your GP should in theory be taking an interest in what the hospital bods have diagnosed and the treatment plan (if any). After all your GP is one responsible for your overall wellbeing. I hesitate to suggest it but might it be worth a discussion with your GP if you can get an appointment?

          6. I haven’t seen my actual GP in two years. I saw a locum last time and she said i had had a heart attack and sent me to Acute Medical.. Which i hadn’t. Useless cow.

      2. That’s probably a good sign that you don’t require his/her urgent attention……Although you might do if the Rabid ones catch up with you for posting a certain cartoon….

      4. Interesting story coming. In Spring, the MR needed a small growth “seen to”. NHS hospital = 12 month wait. So she went private. Saw consultant within days. Was given advice. Decided to postpone treatment. Six months later, changed mind – rang private consultant – no apptmts until Feb 2023.

        Contacted GP surgery by e-mail (so efficient) – one of the GPs can sort it out within a fortnight……. Trebles all round…

  79. Yesterday I took my new EV Kona for a trip alone to the cardiology clinic with the default Lane Keep Assist https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/3d1ae7b5bc34d51c2d0e1afa0b58d5c5892d2ade25e6eecb8baf1784600c872e.jpg
    kept activated.The forward camera can read road lane markings and shows a green icon when you’re driving straight. When signalling and changing lane it temporally reverts back to white and refrains from flashing the icon to indicate that you’re crossing the white lane markers.

      1. I’m visiting your part of the country in the New Year. Going to meet up with some Nottler friends for lunch on the coast. Be seeing you !

      2. The round trip was 8 miles of the original 275 range and cost 2kW @ 68p (at £0.34/kW).

    2. Might you not be better off concentrating on your driving rather than on the flashing lights and any associated sounds?

        2. I put mine on voice. “In 100 metres, turn left onto xxx road” is very helpful, and much more so if you missed a junction.

          1. (a) I wouldn’t hear it;
            (b) if I did, it would annoy me;
            (c) I was born and brought up to use MAPS.

          2. #metoo, but when you are driving in a city, lost, and took the wrong turning, it’s helpful to have a “mapreader” to tell you how to get to your destination.

          3. I always choose maps over a satnav, I need to know where I am in conjunction and context with everything else.

          4. My satnav is stuck on the message At the next junction make a U turn if possible./.

            I don’t know why people spend $1,000 on a built in satnav when you get as much benefit from the maps on your mobile phone.

          6. I don’t have Google maps. I have a TomTom (for the car) and a Garmin) for the campervan. The Garmin has been programmed with the height, length, width and weight of the vehicle, so I don’t get sent down narrow lanes.

      2. In my first 44 miles driving the EV I deliberately cancelled all driver assist options so as not be distracted by any unexpectrd alarms whatsover.
        I agree this is could be a distraction but I was prepared for it whilst trying out a degree of white lining.

      3. Another needless accessory which bumps up the price of the car. Also why do all cars have rev counters. The only gauges you need are a Speedo, a water temp gauge, a fuel gauge and an oil pressure gauge (never get one of those now). Sat nav? read a map! TV cameras? get to know the size of your vehicle! If you can’t stay in lane, cruise control ….learn to drive properly. Just think how many needless gadgets increase the price of a car. Do we need these gadgets or do we use them because they are there? Then there’s my pet hate – things hanging from the rear view mirror, should be banned, they are a distraction and potential cause of accidents.

        2. The one item I do like is Cruise control. It’s ideal when there are 10 miles of roadworks on the motorways and average speed cameras in place. Set it at the speed limit and you can just steer the car wondering why there is so little roadwork activity, mile after, mile after mile…?

          2. Yes it’s handy for average speed cameras if you set it at the speed limit but before we had that you kept an eye on the speedo

          3. I find it just wonderful for my right leg. Before CC, on a 500 mile drive, I would arrive exhausted and very stiff because of the stress on the accelerator leg. Now – hardly any discomfort.

          4. Agreed Bill but when you are in traffic on the motorway I find the flexibility of being able to accelerate and decelerate without suffering a lag is safer – in light traffic though yes a real stress saver

          6. I would be a happier driver if they set a sensible speed limit rather than constantly chopping and changing.
            It is roughly 6 miles between my house and the centre of town, the speed limit changes constantly; all kph,
            from recollection: 70, 30, 80, 70, 80,70, 50, 90, 80, 50, 30, 50 and I may have missed a few changes. Some are stupidly fast for the road conditions and others are maddeningly low.

          8. Supposedly new car has road sign sensing and will adjust speed to suit the limit.

            No I will not intentionally be trying that feature.

          9. I hired a car that had that, it was a nightmare.
            In France people like to drive so close that you can smell the garlic, I was constantly expecting to be rammed.

          10. Same here in Sweden. They can change every hundred-or-so metres. Those making the rules are utterly clueless. We also have a crass situation where there are pedestrian crossings at crossroads governed by traffic lights. You wait for ages for a green light, start to turn into the next road, then have to stop, abruptly, over the junction because a pedestrian has got a green light at the same time as you and has precedence. Who ever worked that idiocy out needs a good bullwhipping!

          11. Re crossings, same here in France.

            They also have roundabout diarrhoea, replacing lights with roundabouts but leaving the pedestrian crossings where they were!
            You enter the roundabout only to be stopped on exit as a pedestrian steps onto the crossing.

          14. Another useless item which puts up the cost is front fog lights – they are useless in fog, they don’t have the right beam configuration.

          15. I once had the misfortune to drive home from London to South Yorkshire at night in Fog. Crossing the river Trent at Newark I could just see one ‘cat’s eye’ at a time. I swore I would never ever drive in fog again. I’ve told my children if they ever find themselves trying to drive in foggy conditions find the nearest hotel and I will pay for their room for the night.

            Weather forecasters often refer to ‘patchy fog’ (it sounds rather harmless). My experience suggests patchy fog can sometimes turn into dense fog banks with practically zero visibility.

          18. I had zero visibility and so stopped as close to the verge as possible. A car pulled in behind me and lit up his blues thank goodness. Scary as hell.

          19. Whereabouts in South Yorkshire did you live if you were driving up the A1? Donny, by any chance?

          22. I can’t ever remember being on foot in Doncaster town [sorry: city] centre, but I have visited a lot of places in the vicinity whilst birdwatching. Potteric Carr, Misterton (where the Chesterfield canal passes), Haxey, Westwoodside, and Epworth in particular. I remember a minibus carrying around 20 of us breaking down on the way home from a fishing trip at Bridlington. We had to walk about eight miles across Thorne Moors before happening upon the town of Thorne where we spent an enjoyable evening waiting for a new minibus to arrive and drinking the local hostelry dry of their superb local Darley Thorne bitter! Happy days.

          23. There was (is?) a fine canal side pub at Stainforth that served Darley’s ales. It sticks in the memory because I got terribly well refreshed ………

          26. I get too much reflection with the main headlamps. The fog lamps (fitted really low down) don’t seem to reflect as much.

        3. Yes, most gadgets are unnecessary when you start out.
          I know a lady who was not even allowed a saddle until she was about 13. That way she learned to control and understand her horse.

          3. I used to ride the horses back to their field without a saddle. It saved having to lug it back.

          4. I was thinking of a lady who was brought up outside the UK; her father refused to allow her a saddle to ensure that she rode well. I am told that you would struggle to find anyone with a better seat.

        4. Why do manual-gearbox cars need six gears? I drove most of my life in (first) a three-speed box, and then in a four-speed box. That is more than sufficient for all road conditions encountered. It then went up to five-speed and I couldn’t work out why an extra gear (with the extra necessary shifting) was considered a good thing. Then it went up to six and I believe some cars have even more. For the first time in my life I now have an automatic gearbox and all that unnecessary constant mucking about with a gear stick is history.

          1. My auto has 7 gears and despite its 190bhp 2 litre engine I recently achieved 68.3 mpg – 7th Heaven!

          5. Actually the boat only consumes about 1 litre an hour. Assuming there are no locks that will take me about 4 miles!

          7. #MeToo, George – an automatic every time. People don’t realise that one may shift down, if you know how to use your automatic gearbox.

          8. Because they’ve narrowed the power band which in my case is between 1500 and 2500 revs so to keep the best part of the power and best part of fuel consumption they need 6 gears to keep within that band – so I’m told

          9. My new car has an eight-speed box. However, since it is automatic I’m not troubled by constantly shifting manually.

        5. Sorry, Sparkey, I was surprised to find that driving, using the SatNav, my speed was much less than that shewing on the speedometer.

          So much for the accuracy of the speedometer.

          1. Sparkey? I ain’t got a magic piano! A speedo has to be accurate within 10% over-read. It must not under-read

        6. Adding the gadgets “justifies” the price increases – look at all the new shiny bits. In the same way that a large bowl of chips justifies charging much more for a cheese ‘n pickle sandwich.

        1. …and potentially burn with all those willing to ignite lithium batteries on board……

      2. I came off the dual carriageway yesterday and on the minor road, with no lane markings, the icon went white showing that it was ready but inactive.

    4. Until it is foggy, raining or the roads are snow covered! They are OK until you start depending on them.
      I have lane keeper set to just warn on my Mazda, leaving me in control (sort of).

      The on order car has lane centering, who knows how that will turn out.

      1. A trifle longer than filling up with the jiuce that most decent cars run on

        Good luck with your incessant waits to recharge. Maybe you’ve found the achille’s heel with EVs.

        1. Yes NTN,

          My decent 2008 two litre EuroIV emission diesel 7-seater Mazda could be filled up in a matter of .minutes Its achillles heel was that it was useless on the short runs that clogged up the DPF, its fuel was becoming scarce and expensive as it comes from Russia and even if I did a fast run to my old home in Bromley I would soon (2023) find myself in a London ULEZ

          I now have my freedom back with my new Hyundai Kona with its 64 kWh battery and a range of nearly 300 miles.

          You are rght that EVs’ achilles heel is the battery charginng time because fast charging Lithium batteries with high currents significantly reduces their longevity.

          I deliberately chose my first charge at the lowest rate of 1.2 kW (6 amps @ 240 volts) to see if the vehicle’s AC/DC converter cooling fan would be deployed.

  80. Apropos the comments about airport buggerment.

    When the MR and I went to Brittany in August, at the Channel Tunnel we were pulled over for a “security check”. That’s where they wipe a sponge over your steering wheel and door hands and then see how much Semtex you have handled recently.

    As we waited the ten minutes, one of the blokes grinned. I asked him how many terror bomb cars they had spotted. He said he had been doing this exercise for five years and not one car had ever proved “suspicious”. I suggested that it was all a bit pointless – but gave him a job. He was agreed then remembered where he was and said, “It all helps safety.”

    3. They just do what they’re paid to do Bill.
      ‘Security’ that tight, but our W⚓ers let anyone in. No one has a clue who or what they are.

  81. Moh and I motored out of the village to take the dogs to the heath late this afternoon ..

    We both had a real shock, a proper shock .. sauntering along the pathway were a large group of probably Iraqis or Afghans or from somewhere like that, well dressed , for the weather , smartly attired …. I am certain they were not on exchange with the army ..

    We noticed three yesterday, I just would like to think they are all migrant doctors .. some hopes.

    2. I was chatting with our neighbour this afternoon he’s over from rural France for a week. He reckons they come here from Calais. Are accommodated for a few weeks and most of them walk out.
      They already have contacts in the UK.

    1. Interesting BTL comments about her. Most anti.

      In particular the fact that she has NO Treasury experience.

      A bit like appointing that useless woman to run JLP.

  83. A bientot, mes amis. I’m away to watch the racing I’ve recorded. May be back this evening.

  84. I’m having a discussion on notifications re crime statistics.

    A straw pole edit poll you fool, poll. It was Phizzee’s/Bob of B’s pole dancing threads the other day, honest guv, please don’t report me to the police:
    How many Nottlers have been victims of crimes that they haven’t bothered to report to the police?
    Burglary in particular.

    2. I understand that if you do report a burglary thee days it only costs you a cup of tea to chat to the Police Officer who will visit you to reassure you that nothing can be done…..

    4. We were burgled 5 years ago and 2 constables came out that evening and took full details and checked the perimeter of the house. The following day we had a forensic investigator trying to identify where the swine had entered our property.
      It was the policy of Surrey police to investigate all burglaries, not sure if that’s still the case.

      2. Nor I.

        Had you lost a lot of valuables? First time we were done we had similar, all to no avail, next time around it was only garden stuff, so we didn’t bother. To add insult to injury the damned insurance company argued for months and then insisted on security items that almost cost more than what we lost

        Similar for two of my three children, garden stuff nicked so they didn’t report either.

        1. No they took a £15 glass necklace and a pillow case. It would appear our burglar alarm worked successfully.

          2. Sixty years ago, half way through my articles, was told by an “insider” – never tell the Police or your Insurers that you are going away…

          3. No. Neighbours heard it and called police. We were only 20 minutes away and police arrived a couple of minutes before us.

    5. How To Call The Police When You’re Old
      Phillip Hewitson, an elderly man, from Norwich, was going up to bed, when his wife told him that he’d left the light on in the garden shed, which she could see from the bedroom window. George opened the back door to go turn off the light, but saw that there were people in the shed stealing things.

      He phoned the police, who asked “Is someone in your house?”

      He said “No,” but some people are breaking into my garden shed and stealing from me.

      Then the police dispatcher said “All patrols are busy. You should lock your doors and an officer will be along when one is available.”

      George said, “Okay.”
      He hung up the phone and counted to 30.

      Then he phoned the police again.

      “Hello, I just called you a few seconds ago because there were people stealing things from my shed. Well you don’t have to worry about them now because I just shot them.” and he hung up.

      Within five minutes, Six Police Cars, a SWAT Team, a Helicopter, two Fire Trucks, a Paramedic, and an Ambulance showed up at the Hewitson’s residence, and caught the burglars red-handed.

      One of the Policemen said to Phillip, “I thought you said that you’d shot them!”

      Phillip said, “I thought you said there was nobody available!”

      (True Story)

    6. Not me.
      But now the location of the removals has been found, I have not bothered to advise the police, since apart from issuing a crime number (upon prompting) they have done less than eff-all.

    1. And I bet the salesman is waxing lyrical over its potential when you do eventually get to drive it Ω,…..

          1. Nah, when grading essays an alpha was the top.

            Harold Wilson got 17 out of 18 alphas for his finals, allegedly the top degree of his year.

  86. BOURNEMOUTH West MP Conor Burns has been sacked as trade minister and had the whip suspended from the Conservative party following allegations of misconduct.

    Mr Burns was asked to leave the government with “immediate effect” following the complaint of “serious misconduct”, No 10 said.

    It is understood the allegations centre around the Tory party conference this week.

    The Tory MP has told the Echo he will “fully cooperate” with an ensuing investigation that he “looks forward to clearing [his] name.”

    https://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/news/23031761.bournemouth-west-mp-conor-burns-whip-suspended/

    1. Hand up skirt/in till…?

      He probably offered to buy a lady a drink. Sackable, these day.

    2. That looks very much as if Truss and the Trusstees are trying to nip sleaze in the bud, whether it is true or not.

  88. In other News Chickens come home to roost:

    “New York City Mayor Eric Adams (D) has declared a state of emergency after the ‘sanctuary city’ was unprepared to provide sanctuary to migrants arriving from Texas and elsewhere.
    On Friday, Adams said that since April, at least 17,000 asylum seekers have been bused to NYC from other parts of the country – and claimed that many of the migrants didn’t realize they would end up in the Big Apple, Axios reports.

    New York City officials have previously said they were not prepared to handle the influx of migrants. Adams requested federal assistance in August.
    He said the city has received an average of five to six buses per day since September, with at least nine arriving on Thursday. -Axios
    “This is a humanitarian crisis that started with violence and instability in South America, and it is being accelerated by American political dynamics,” said Adams, adding “Thousands of asylum seekers have been bussed into New York City and simply dropped off without notice, coordination or care, and more are arriving everyday.”

    “The majority are adults, who cannot legally work in this country. Many are families with school-age children. Some are in desperate need of serious medical care,” Adams continued. “We’re going to do what we have to do in New York, but we do need help to deal with this crisis that we’re facing.”

    1. BTL Comment:
      NoDebt
      1 hour ago
      Please remember, folks, Leftiods are COMPLETELY UNAFFECTED BY HYPOCRISY.

      The only thing that works is mockery. They can’t stand it.

      1. Leftoids are unaffected by HYPOCRISY because they choose to live in a HYPOCRACY. i.e. rule by hypocrites.

    3. The Left. Mouth off, procrastinate, virtue signal, whinge, moan and complain. Then reality strikes. Wankers.

    4. When are enterprising bus companies going to start running buses from the South Coast and dumping their cargoes full of illegal immigrants outside City Hall in London?

      1. Since the bronze age the people of Europe have been able to support them selves by farming crops and animals. 3000 years later people who are too lazy and can’t be bothered turn up and demand we look after them.
        Two word with three Fs.

        2. Lefties who I ask why the developing world hasn’t always argue that they’ve never had a need to.

          Why then do they demand we do it for them? Frankly, they need to grow up and start solving their own problems. The internecine tribal warfare, the Tutsi and Hutu nonsense, the endless corruption, fraud and theft in government – it’s why we should leave them alone.

          The problem is, when we do we get a situation like Rwanda. Can any of us honestly say we knew about it? It was a complete failure of the UN – a pointless, argumentative, useless body full of pen pushers who machinate and deceive, uncaring of the consequences of their actions.

    1. Chucking it down here. Not long after I’d finished mowing Our back front and our verges neighbours front grass. Let’s hope last one of the year.
      I’m clapped out.

  90. No doubt more will soon be revealed about Burns Night (I rather like that!!)

    That’s me gone for today. Looking forward to waking up tomorrow.

    Have a jolly evening.

    A demain.

  93. Well waddayaknow

    https://twitter.com/ActivePatriotUK/status/1578383816690991106

    The GOVERNMENT announcement that it would reform the asylum dispersal scheme, to ensure a fairer distribution

    WHAT THEY DIDN’T TELL YOU IS

    Under the new system, ALL local authorities in Britain will become ASYLUM DISPERSAL AREAS

    The comments are interesting ..
    Bussed in in darkness.

    https://www.dorsetcouncil.gov.uk/your-council/equality-and-diversity/refugee-resettlement-in-dorset

    1. Integration. Wasn’t keen on it in 55 years ago in maths and I’m even less keen on what it is now.

    4. The Marks Tey Hotel has cancelled all its Christmas functions to house Afghans.
      The money must be double plus good.

      1. Two birds with one stone as well! More immigrants to annoy and dilute the indigenous and put a spanner in their Christmas festivities and possibly dilute them as well! Brilliant!

    5. The Marks Tey Hotel has cancelled all its Christmas functions to house Afghans.
      The money must be double plus good.

  94. I may comment later- right now I am so pissed off I can barely stand it.
    This country is a total shambles. And that is a mild comment.

    2. Many things are back to front. On the upside, the more damage the Left do, the more they tie themselves in knots – vis pretending there’s no such thing as gender then whinging about the gender pay gap.

      1. Wibbs, right now, my priorities are with my husband and me. The NHS haven’t helped and we have many other issues.
        I don’t give a shit about the left wing, as you call them, the so called right wing are just as bloody bad.
        Sod them all, and I will not apologise for my language.

        1. I am certain that I’m not alone in thinking this.

          The Nottlers are all on your side, no matter our differences.

          Every one of them hopes and prays that whatever the problems might be, that they will be resolved to both of your best of health.

          2. Thanks Sos, I am hanging on as best I can with all that is going on. It does make me grumpy and short tempered. Dealing with school kids is easier and better than dealing with all this bollox these days.

          3. Indeed so.

            It would probably be either exceedingly unpleasant, or as HG would tell you, very warm and comforting. Please accept a huge hug from France.

    3. Sorry about that, Ann.
      I’d like to be typical male and offer “helpful” suggestions, but as most of them involve violence, maybe I’d better not.
      It’s a bit late now, but a long walk in the fresh air helps me get what’s left of my head together – looking at beautiful autumnal scenes can help soothe the soul, too.
      KBO, lass!

    1. Oh come on, he is only fifteen. A few months in a youth centre then out beforehe is eighteen.

      1. In this case I suspect not.
        But when he does get out I wouldn’t bet against him killing again.

    2. A Lefty lawyer will plead that because he’s black he has to be let out as keeping him behind bars would be cruel.

        1. No need, I could sense the vibes!

          Step back, take care, and always remember you’re amongst friends, however much they tease you.

          2. Yes, the problem is the usual one, one man’s humour is another’s offence.

            In my case, I try to ensure that when I am being offensive, the recipient is left in no doubt whatsoever.

          3. Have a watch of this video shewing basic pole dancing moves and imagine the strength and skill needed.
            https://youtu.be/6vlFaYgrRfA

            As I’ve said before, take away the seedy connotations and you have an artistic discipline on a par with gymnastics.

          4. It was a jokey comment to LotL, I agree with your assessment of it as exercise and being artistic.

          5. I half guessed that!
            It is a pity that Pole Dancing has such a shady reputation though.

          6. I totem pole ally agree.
            A friend of my son’s wife has one at home, she must be in her 50’s, it keeps her fit and prevents all sorts of muscle/skeletal problems and she swears by it as wonderful, but very hard, exercise.

  98. Conspiracy, as if:

    https://thepostmillennial.com/trudeau-liberals-partnered-with-wef-others-to-create-voluntary-known-traveler-digital-identity

    It is amazing what can be discovered when an effective opposition MP asks the right questions. After months if not years of denials of WEF involvement by Trudeau.

    It is quite a week for blackface. On Monday a Conservative MP responded to his standard o0bfuscation and avoidance of answers with a rather loud “Stop the woke Shit

      1. That really is the problem. Apparently around thirty percent still support him and his ilk.

  100. Right a top up glass of shiraz and we are going to watch this weeks recording of Doc Martin.

          1. Full of incident just now – a kick that got a yellow card and a penalty scored against the USA, then a goal that wasn’t a goal for the USA. So it’s still 2-1 to England.

          2. Nah! I just appreciate an excellent driver. Don’t like his ridiculous political posturing but he is pretty impressive. Even you must admit that?

          5. I certainly do, and I agree re the non-driving, but I remain on the side of the car/team, even more than the pilot.

          6. Men tend to be. Women on the other hand…..?

            I think I shall withdraw from this domestic….

  101. Me voici de retour, mes amis. Saw some nice two year olds who could well be contesting the Classics next year.

      1. No. I’ve got a share in a two-year old with James Fanshawe. He, the youngster, is a bit backward and may not run this year.

        1. Does James Fanshaw know you think he’s a bit backward and may not run this year?

          Or are you younger than we think?
          };-))

          1. Judging by the reports we get about the two-year-old, he won’t be ready to run this year. Mentally, I am a lot younger than you think 🙂

  102. Don’t tell anyone, but I’m watching the England/USA Wimmin’s football game. Refreshing in respect of skills and lack of gamesmanship.

    1. In thirty years time, when one of those poor children goes on a gun rampage, who will get the blame?

    2. What the F U U K possesses anyone to think that is right?
      Sack the bloody lot of them.

        1. Yes, I’ve just read through the comments.
          It’s the very least that should have happened to them.

    3. All Hallows’ Eve is the night before All Saints Day. It is not a holiday but has become an unofficial one in the US and now here- it seems.
      All things wicked were thought to be about on Oct 31 so people made turnip lanterns to warn away the nasty spirits. I may have a few here ;-))

        1. In CT we did pumpkins…. oh the smell. Carved them and lit them on the night for Trick or Treating. Tossed the remains into the woods where the deer and other critters no doubt ate them.

        2. We carved them out of swedes when I were little. Much more difficult than yer pumpkin

      2. Here in France, the tradition is chrysanthemums, you see them everywhere for sale to be left on family tombs and graves on all souls.

        2. Bristol CT has a Mum Parade in October. My son, when in the high school marching band took part in it for 4 years. October is chrysanthemums.

          1. It is the height of bad form to give them as flowers at any time of the year here, the symbolise death.
            We didn’t know.

            We were lucky that when we brought a pot to French friends that they laughed it off because we were “Anglais”, they explained the traditions and we haven’t made the same mistake since.

          2. Nearly did the same in Sicily a while or two ago. Fortunately, caught my mistake at the last moment. They would have been white, too… 🙁

    4. Hell, they cannot even show pictures of kiddies with cap guns without preceding it by a trigger warning. Anything to do with the first nations suspected graves thenwe get trigger warnings before and crisis phone line info afterwards.

  105. Goodnight, folks. I’m off to fondle the dogs (although I don’t expect to be awarded a PhD for it) 🙂

      2. Fondling the dogs (they need some TLC) or being awarded a PhD? For the latter, see the thread about research in Japan.

      1. I have to be careful how close I get to Oscar. He gets a bit claurstophobic and starts showing signs of stress if I put my arms around him. Still, we have come a long way. I was able to step over him today without him moving.

      1. Yes, imagine having a surgeon having to use bolt croppers near your wedding tackle like that!

  107. Good night from a Saxon Queen with blooded axe and longbow in handbag with marmalade sandwich . Just been watching a programme on the Stuarts I am also doing a course on the English civil wars . I believe we are heading towards a similar thing .
    Sweet dreams until eos opens the gates of heaven at the break of a new dawn .

        2. And we shall stay a monarchy. As High Priestess of Avalon we need to stand together.

    1. Good night, BoB. I guess your marmalade won’t arrive now until Monday or a few days later. Let me know when it does arrive, won’t you.

      1. Of course.
        Though it might be a while before I get round to sampling it!
        I’m trying to empty several already open jars of jam & marmalades before opening any others.

      1. Morning Bob.

        Very interesting .. I had heard similar .. but you know , that sort of thing still goes on all over Africa… yes West Africa and even South Africa..

        FOUR GUINEAS BY ELSPETH HUXLEY, 1955 was quite revealing !

      2. And they say we were the slavers.
        This letter should be copied and circulated in Brixton and other salubrious districts of our, once lovely, country.

  112. “Tyranny has had a makeover. It’s no longer a boot stamping on a human face forever. It isn’t a cop dragging you into a cell for expressing a ‘dangerous’ idea. It isn’t a priest strapping you to a breaking wheel. No, authoritarianism is well-dressed now. It’s polite. It has a broad smile and speaks in a soft voice. It is delivered not via a soldier’s boot to the head but with a caring liberal head-tilt. Its name is Jacinda Ardern.”

    Brendan O’Neill responding to Ardern’s address to the UN in which called she freedom of speech ‘hateful and dangerous rhetoric and ideology’, ‘misinformation used as a weapon to disrupt and to cause chaos’. It was delivered in that peculiar manner, earnest yet pleading. Did she adopt the head-wobble from our stick insect or was it the other way around?

    Don’t forget that this is the woman who said during the pandemic “We [the government] are your only source of truth.”

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CamSGA9hWSs

    1. Ardern is a truly disgusting human being [assuming she is human?} – a product of the B Liar stable.

      1. Ardern is a repulsive fascist. As you note she is a product of incubation under the war criminal Blair but with finishing by Klaus Schwab and his WEF organisation.

        Merkel, Macron, Trudeau, Johnson, Truss and the other ‘world leaders’ are from the same WEF stable.

    2. ‘Did she adopt the head-wobble from our stick insect or was it the other way around?’

      I think a praying mantis would also be rather apt.

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